The Rise of Skywalker JJ Abrams is Writing and Directing Episode IX

[TheVileOne]

You shouldn't have to read a novel or book to understand what's going on in a movie.

 

[BatLobster]

I still say that the central issue isn't the lack of a plan, but the lack of time.

Most of my favorite trilogies were not planned as such from the start. But the common denominator is they had 3-4 years between movies to develop organically. Even if you had different creators handing off the baton (IE the latest Planet of the Apes trilogy).

Disney's decision to release the films 2 years apart, without securing a creative overseer was the double whammy that put the films at a major disadvantage. No time to process what you're doing and think about the bigger picture. You can only focus on making the best movie you can and then you're handing off the baton, hoping it works out. That extra year makes a world of difference. There is no way the original Star Wars Trilogy would've been what it was if Lucas decided to crank the sequels out that quickly.

In the end, it was just greed, pure and simple. Disney wanted to crank them out. I honestly think Kennedy, JJ, Kasdan, Terrio and Johnson did the best they could under the circumstances. Even though I do think a lot of fundamental decisions in TFA caused some big problems.

 

[Sian]

Disney are buying up too many corporations and becoming a huge bloated corporation themselves - money before quality.
I've noticed the signs in some of the other franchises they've bought, particularly Marvel comics. TROS sums up perfectly what their mantra seems to be - fast, flashy and completely empty of heart and soul. Killing off all the heroes of the SW saga and their descendants and replacing them with a character whose sole 'memorable' trait is - 'gosh, she's female!' has to be one of the worst creative decisions they have made.
I'm a woman and Rey turned out to be a crushing disappointment. At the end of TROS I never wanted to set eyes on her again.And I'm not the only one who feels this way. Compare this to the OT characters, where fans eagerly lapped up the material published post ROTJ.

 

[NotSoLongAgo]

Just a lack of vision, I think. The mando crew are up to no good on Disney+, and it's because of Jon Favreau and Mr. Filoni. So the movies didn't work out - that was like a maiden voyage and the course correction is going great.

 

[CadeSkywalker28]

I can't even count how many great pitchs trying to fix this trilogy after TLJ I've read.

It is not a matter of time, just a lack of ideas and a lack of self-awareness. Why fans can come up with better stories than the people who get paid for it?

 

[Bobber]

I can't even count how many great pitchs trying to fix this trilogy after TLJ I've read.

It is not a matter of time, just a lack of ideas and a lack of self-awareness. Why fans can come up with better stories than the people who get paid for it?

They can't.

 

[TheVileOne]

For all the crap Abrams gets, I don't think he had malicious intentions, and he was not put in the best situation to succeed on all cylinders. Do I think he had some misguided notions and made some bad decisions? Yes. I think he tried too hard to please everybody and make sure everyone was happy. But I think some criticisms are warranted, but some are just going too far.

 

[BatLobster]

For all the crap Abrams gets, I don't think he had malicious intentions, and he was not put in the best situation to succeed on all cylinders. Do I think he had some misguided notions and made some bad decisions? Yes. I think he tried too hard to please everybody and make sure everyone was happy. But I some criticisms are warranted, but some are just going too far.

Well said.

I think the crucial thing that just gets tossed aside too often with any movie is no director is trying to make a bad movie. They're all just trying to make the best movie they can, and every movie is a battle. Nobody goes into it because you want to be the guy that ruined Star Wars. In fact they have to go into it in spite of the fear of that happening and knowing you won't please everyone.

And to be fair, I don't even know if Abrams really tried to please everyone. On any big movie you're probably hoping to just please as many people as you can. In the press for TROS he seemed pretty open and honest about the inescapable fact that a lot of people would hate the movie.

My thing with him is I feel he is more of a mystery-builder than a myth-builder, and I wish more of a myth-builder would've been the one to set the trajectory of the new trilogy. But I would never think he intentionally tried to screw things up.

 

[Sian]

I remember a youtube reviewer - not even a TLJ fan - said he thought the retcon for TFA was almost vengeful. I thought the same thing myself.

The fact is, just as Thor The Dark World suffered from bad editing I think TROS has suffered from a number of thing.
They kept changing their minds, hence the repeated reshoots, which involved at one time Adam Driver having to say his lines in his own closet.
They listened too much to the more unpleasant fans, such as the hate filled nerds who sent Rian Johnson death threats.
And...I suspect some things were changed, removed or added on due to Abrams himself. He DID NOT like Anakin Skywalker, and I also think he wanted Kylo as an 'unredeemed villain.' He couldn't completely retcon his character post TLJ, but he did his best, turning him into a clone of his grandad for the first half of the film then completely rushing his redemption so it satisfied no one, including Kylo/Ben fans. The 'reylo kiss' was Disney's idea not Abrams, so that is why Rey seemed so callous post Ben's death to never mention him at all to anyone else....'reylo' was RJ's idea, Abrams I believe, was totally against it. Rey in Abrams' world was never in love with Ben Solo. One funny little detail...a lot of reylos said the scar Rey had on her arm after the throne room fighting scene resembled two hands reaching out to each other, but notice how throughout TROS it was hidden under an armband.

The more I look at the ST the more I'm convinced Abrams wanted 'villains' who were obviously space Nazis, hence the heroes being called The Resistance and the 'bad guys' the First Order, but Lucas himself took inspiration from a number of sources, not just WW2, but also Flash Gordon, Dune and The Lord of the Rings. I couldn't help but notice a dash of the Roman Empire in there as well. Abrams narrowed it down a lot.
Finally...Abrams also has a habit of indulging his cast. Isaac wanted Poe to live, so he did, and was elevated to a prominent character. Daisy and John wanted to work together again, after being separated throughout the filming of TLJ, hence them sharing almost every scene in TROS. I might be wrong, but I also think Rey ends the film a committed singleton because Daisy herself was quoted as saying: 'Rey doesn't need a boyfriend.' Whether Abrams was right or wrong to give his actors what they wanted over story is up to viewers to decide; personally I didn't like the focus on the Trio at all, but others loved them so, as they say, one man's meat is another man's poison.

 

[TheVileOne]

I'm still confused about what upset John Boyega. Was it the poster issue or was it not having a larger role in Last Jedi? Like why is he angry with Disney for writing and directing decisions that Rian Johnson made for his character?

 

[Sian]

Might be wrong, but from what I've heard he thought he was going to be the 'male lead' or 'hero'...apparently Abrams told him:
'You are going to be the new star of Star Wars.'

But that was Rey.

 

[TheVileOne]

Might be wrong, but from what I've heard he thought he was going to be the 'male lead' or 'hero'...apparently Abrams told him:
'You are going to be the new star of Star Wars.'

But that was Rey.

I mean he technically was, wasn't he? Also, he's constantly defended Abrams over the franchise.

 

[Sian]

TBH, I really don't know what is going on in Boyega's mind at the moment. Comments he made post TROS on social media seemed to hint that he had wanted a Finn/Rey romance, but he could have simply been extracting the urine. A few things I DO know, however:
He wanted FS Finn. Apparently he was disappointed that they didn't make him FS from the start after the main poster for TFA showed him with a lightsabre.
He is very good friends with Daisy, and didn't like working on TLJ as much as TFA/TROS because they didn't work together much.
Those are the only problems I know for sure that he had with the films, but regarding Abrams, the man is his friend, so this is probably why he's defending him.

I've said this on other forums, but I actually don't think there WAS a male lead - only a female lead. Rey is put so much front and centre in TROS they are actually screaming out loud that she is not just all the Jedi - but the central character, the chosen Skywalker heir, and that every other character is second to her. Look at so many of the promo pictures - Rey is in the foreground, every one else in the background.
Most telling is how one particular promo pic showed her in the Millennium Falcon, in Han's seat, Chewie at her side, but Poe and Finn are both sitting behind her. Poe was an ace pilot himself, why was he playing second fiddle to a girl who had only had a year's proper practise as a pilot?

I suspect JB wanted the amount of attention AD got from the audience and critics, and was peeved that he didn't get it. But in any case, he had far more screen time than AD - but not as much as Rey.
The ST was Rey Palpatine's story, and everyone else was there just to pad out her adventures.

 

[TheVileOne]

TBH, I really don't know what is going on in Boyega's mind at the moment. Comments he made post TROS on social media seemed to hint that he had wanted a Finn/Rey romance, but he could have simply been extracting the urine. A few things I DO know, however:
He wanted FS Finn. Apparently he was disappointed that they didn't make him FS from the start after the main poster for TFA showed him with a lightsabre.

This makes no sense. JJ Abrams hired him personally. Are you saying they didn't have discussions about this character and his basic backstory and their hopes for the role at the outset?

Basically from your explanation you are basically suggesting John Boyega saw a poster and suddenly thought, "Wait a minute! I get the lightsaber! My boss and director JJ Abrams is keeping the subplot that Finn is becoming the ultimate Jedi hidden from me! This must mean I will wield the lightsaber and eventually become a Jedi in this franchise! Hells yeah!"

If he was disappointed he wasn't a Force user from the start, then that's on JJ Abrams, is it not? Did Disney, Alan Horn, and Kathleen Kennedy go up to Abrams and say, "You can't make this character a Jedi Force user! Racist audiences will reject it!"

He is very good friends with Daisy, and didn't like working on TLJ as much as TFA/TROS because they didn't work together much.
Those are the only problems I know for sure that he had with the films, but regarding Abrams, the man is his friend, so this is probably why he's defending him.

OK so what? This is a sci-fi fantasy story. They can't team up all the time. Heroes get separated and splintered in these action-adventure stories. Luke is away from the main group for most of Empire Strikes Back after they get off Hoth. If he's unhappy about that, wouldn't his major contention be against Rian Johnson, someone I've never heard him criticize or rail against at all.

This is why I find some of his complaints hollow and lacking in a lot of sensical, factual basis.

I suspect JB wanted the amount of attention AD got from the audience and critics, and was peeved that he didn't get it. But in any case, he had far more screen time than AD - but not as much as Rey.
The ST was Rey Palpatine's story, and everyone else was there just to pad out her adventures.

Is the issue here that Adam Driver ultimately got the focused romance with Rey, and while the first film set up a potential romance between Finn and Rey, the movies never went there? Did Finn want to be the one defeating Palpatine with Rey at the end instead of Kylo? Again, that's on Chris Terrio and JJ Abrams if he's upset about that, and yet he's gone out of his way to constantly defend Abrams.

 

[Sian]

This makes no sense. JJ Abrams hired him personally. Are you saying they didn't have discussions about this character and his basic backstory and their hopes for the role at the outset?

Basically from your explanation you are basically suggesting John Boyega saw a poster and suddenly thought, "Wait a minute! I get the lightsaber! My boss and director JJ Abrams is keeping the subplot that Finn is becoming the ultimate Jedi hidden from me! This must mean I will wield the lightsaber and eventually become a Jedi in this franchise! Hells yeah!"

If he was disappointed he wasn't a Force user from the start, then that's on JJ Abrams, is it not? Did Disney, Alan Horn, and Kathleen Kennedy go up to Abrams and say, "You can't make this character a Jedi Force user! Racist audiences will reject it!"



OK so what? This is a sci-fi fantasy story. They can't team up all the time. Heroes get separated and splintered in these action-adventure stories. Luke is away from the main group for most of Empire Strikes Back after they get off Hoth. If he's unhappy about that, wouldn't his major contention be against Rian Johnson, someone I've never heard him criticize or rail against at all.

This is why I find some of his complaints hollow and lacking in a lot of sensical, factual basis.



Is the issue here that Adam Driver ultimately got the focused romance with Rey, and while the first film set up a potential romance between Finn and Rey, the movies never went there? Did Finn want to be the one defeating Palpatine with Rey at the end instead of Kylo? Again, that's on Chris Terrio and JJ Abrams if he's upset about that, and yet he's gone out of his way to constantly defend Abrams.

And...guess what? I agree with everything you say, but I was trying to be careful of what I say, because I was accused of racism on another forum simply for mentioning Ben Solo in a Finn thread, something which believe it or not, caused me a lot of distress and ultimately led to me quitting the forum.

If John Boyega is unhappy at how his character turned out, it's got zero to do with racism, as Abrams cast him instead of another actor, who's white, and who was originally slated to play Finn. It has nothing to do with Adam Driver, who actually has less screen time than John Boyega - the latter is no. 8 in the top ten of screentime for the entire SW saga while the former doesn't even make the top ten. It has nothing to do with Rian Johnson who gave him a far better story arc than in TROS. It's all down to the writer and director of TROS, who reduced him to a whiny sidekick whose primary existence is to adore Rey.

 

[henzINNIT]

I think Boyega was pretty clear with his criticism. He describes a number of experiences that made him feel like his race was an issue, down to relatively trivial things like having a stylist who didn't know how to work with his hair. Mostly his frustration was with Disney casting diverse for social currency, but not following through with important roles for those characters. Not just him and his character, but with Poe and Rose too. I think he is correct. This trilogy is going to age poorly in terms of diversity; with thin roles for its non-white cast and a female lead constantly defined by male counterparts.

Is this all a racism issue? Kind of, yes. I don't want to speak for others and it's naturally a very touchy subject. The problem with identifying prejudice is that it is sometimes a completely passive act. I love TLJ and think it's the only real arc Finn ever gets. I think Rian Johnson did what any decent writer would do with Finn; he identified a character flaw and built a story around overcoming that flaw. I don't think it was ever Johnson's intention to 'demote' Finn or harm that character, but once TLJ is done and edited down, Finn just didn't get a whole lot or worth. In the end, your black co-lead has lost out, accidentally or not.

I think it's crazy to lay the blame at one director's feet, especially when the other director did 2/3s of this story. To me, Finn was botched from inception. His character should never have been a cowardly goofball, that was already wasting him. I don't read much into Boyega's seeming defense of Abrams, as it was in the wake of TROS, and he has an understandable bias for the guy who hired him. I would assume Boyega has reason to blame Disney. I bet he has a different view of their decisions. He was front of center of TFA marketing, in some countries at least, receiving all the backlash from racists when Star Wars was white hot. It must have been incredibly disheartening to feel like Disney were shying away from him after all of that. They never cared about his race, just his demographic.

 

[TheVileOne]

I think Boyega was pretty clear with his criticism. He describes a number of experiences that made him feel like his race was an issue, down to relatively trivial things like having a stylist who didn't know how to work with his hair. Mostly his frustration was with Disney casting diverse for social currency, but not following through with important roles for those characters. Not just him and his character, but with Poe and Rose too. I think he is correct. This trilogy is going to age poorly in terms of diversity; with thin roles for its non-white cast and a female lead constantly defined by male counterparts.

Is this all a racism issue? Kind of, yes. I don't want to speak for others and it's naturally a very touchy subject. The problem with identifying prejudice is that it is sometimes a completely passive act. I love TLJ and think it's the only real arc Finn ever gets. I think Rian Johnson did what any decent writer would do with Finn; he identified a character flaw and built a story around overcoming that flaw. I don't think it was ever Johnson's intention to 'demote' Finn or harm that character, but once TLJ is done and edited down, Finn just didn't get a whole lot or worth. In the end, your black co-lead has lost out, accidentally or not.

Those criticisms have never been clear at all from Boyega. If he believes Rian Johnson was being passively racist toward his character and his character arc, he's never actually said that at all, and he's never actually criticized Rian Johnson himself, at least to my knowledge.

As for the hair stylist stuff, no idea. Not sure what happened behind close doors with hair and makeup people. And if the hair stylists aren't sensitive to issues like that, no idea. However at the same time, I find it hard to believe Boyega never made his concerns known to his agent or manager or Disney HR to get the issue taken care of.

I think it's crazy to lay the blame at one director's feet, especially when the other director did 2/3s of this story. To me, Finn was botched from inception. His character should never have been a cowardly goofball, that was already wasting him. I don't read much into Boyega's seeming defense of Abrams, as it was in the wake of TROS, and he has an understandable bias for the guy who hired him. I would assume Boyega has reason to blame Disney. I bet he has a different view of their decisions. He was front of center of TFA marketing, in some countries at least, receiving all the backlash from racists when Star Wars was white hot. It must have been incredibly disheartening to feel like Disney were shying away from him after all of that. They never cared about his race, just his demographic.

If he was botched from the inception, then a large part of the blame is at the feet of JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan. And Abrams is the person Boyega appears to go out of his way to constantly defend and deflect from criticism.

I don't see how Disney was shying away from defending and supporting Boyega at that time. All this seems a little fugazi if you ask me.

Now removing or shrinking Boyega's image for the marketing posts, that's a more valid criticism I can understand. I'm not sure if he's even mentioned that publicly though. I know others have, but I haven't seen that from Boyega.

 

[BatLobster]

Yeah I think what a lot of it comes down to is Finn was put front and center in the marketing for TFA, he's on the poster holding a lightsaber. But that was a misdirect, as TFA clearly establishes Rey as the force sensitive protagonist.

I think Finn's arc in TLJ works alright, but yeah...I mean nothing Finn gets to do is anywhere near as interesting as what Daisy Ridley and Adam Driver got to do. Same goes for Oscar Isaac. But again, I mean...the same could be said for Luke vs. Han and Leia in the original trilogy. That's just kind of how it goes. The Jedi character gets the juicy lore stuff. I think Boyega's frustration is stemming from a lot of places. Race is definitely a big factor, because the optics of it don't look good when you've dangled the carrot of a black lead with possible Jedi potential and then it's pulled away. I also think he just came into it as a Star Wars fan, and wanted to be more directly involved with the more mythological aspects of the story.

To be fair though, I never got the vibe that Finn was supposed to be the next Jedi. His chemistry with Ford in TFA was great, and with him being a more comedic character with a shady past and a heart of gold... it felt like he was kind of being setup as the next Han. So I don't blame Rian Johnson for basing his decisions on what the actual content of TFA was, rather than what the marketing led with. I think he continued the story in a way that made sense, especially considering Finn was left in a coma at the end of TFA with Rey already on an island with Luke. His character's progression felt consistent. He cared more about protecting Rey than he felt any loyalty to the Resistance. I think that's inarguable based on what is actually shown in TFA.

 

[TheVileOne]

Yeah I think what a lot of it comes down to is Finn was put front and center in the marketing for TFA, he's on the poster holding a lightsaber. But that was a misdirect, as TFA clearly establishes Rey as the force sensitive protagonist.

Is that really a misdirect? Rey is just as front and center in the marketing and it's clear from the trailers she's an important character and likely a Force wielder in the story as well. Finn did use the lightsaber in the film multiple times, so that's technically not a misdirect IMO.

I think Finn's arc in TLJ works alright, but yeah...I mean nothing Finn gets to do is anywhere near as interesting as what Daisy Ridley and Adam Driver got to do. Same goes for Oscar Isaac. But again, I mean...the same could be said for Luke vs. Han and Leia in the original trilogy. That's just kind of how it goes. The Jedi character gets the juicy lore stuff. I think Boyega's frustration is stemming from a lot of places. Race is definitely a big factor, because the optics of it don't look good when you've dangled the carrot of a black lead with possible Jedi potential and then it's pulled away. I also think he just came into it as a Star Wars fan, and wanted to be more directly involved with the more mythological aspects of the story.

I don't understand complaints like this at all. People had just as many complaints about the Rey and Luke Skywalker subplot. Also, what was Rian Johnson supposed to do? Have Finn go to Ahch-to as well to meet Luke Skywalker?

To be fair though, I never got the vibe that Finn was supposed to be the next Jedi. His chemistry with Ford in TFA was great, and with him being a more comedic character with a shady past and a heart of gold... it felt like he was kind of being setup as the next Han. So I don't blame Rian Johnson for basing his decisions on what the actual content of TFA was, rather than what the marketing led with. I think he continued the story in a way that made sense, especially considering Finn was left in a coma at the end of TFA with Rey already on an island with Luke. His character's progression felt consistent. He cared more about protecting Rey than he felt any loyalty to the Resistance. I think that's inarguable based on what is actually shown in TFA.

Again, still not sure what Boyega wanted, other than he wanted Finn to be more involved with Rey in Last Jedi. And if he's upset, he's always avoided criticizing Rian Johnson.

 

[BatLobster]

@TheVileOne

He hasn't really avoided criticizing Rian Johnson. He made a bunch of headlines for bashing TLJ during the press for TROS. And he flat out said he didn't agree with a lot of Rian's decisions. In an industry where people usually just play nice and say every director they work with is brilliant to the press, that alone was kind of big.

Now if you were to read between the lines, yeah-- I think he saw a budding romance with Finn and Rey, and probably didn't appreciate his character being paired off with Rose in the second film. In other words, "Let's put the two POC characters together cause it's now the Rey and Kylo show". I think it's pretty clear that's factoring into his feelings somehow based on his comments about how Daisy and Adam had all the best material. I also think just from a personal standpoint he was bummed to not get to work with Daisy much at all on the second film, after they had bonded so much on the first one. But it's also awkward because he obviously has to have KMT's back too in the whole situation after what she went through. But if you do the math on what he's saying...he probably would've been completely fine if the Rose character never existed in the first place. It's a mess.

As far as implying Rian was being casually racist...idk, sometimes it does feel like he's implying that. But I don't think he'd outright say it. Probably just easier to blame a big corporation than start an awkward beef with a specific director who's pretty beloved by a lot of Film Twitter. I mean, it's awkward enough that he was openly ripping TLJ.

I am not endorsing any of these viewpoints btw. Just doing my best to wrap my head around how he sees it and why he is frustrated with how things went.

 

[TheVileOne]

@TheVileOne

He hasn't really avoided criticizing Rian Johnson. He made a bunch of headlines for bashing TLJ during the press for TROS. And he flat out said he didn't agree with a lot of Rian's decisions. In an industry where people usually just play nice and say every director they work with is brilliant to the press, that alone was kind of big.

I've never heard him criticize Rian Johnson. In fact, he makes it sound like the decisions in Last Jedi were Disney's decisions and not Johnson's.

Now if you were to read between the lines, yeah-- I think he saw a budding romance with Finn and Rey, and probably didn't appreciate his character being paired off with Rose in the second film. In other words, "Let's put the two POC characters together cause it's now the Rey and Kylo show". I think it's pretty clear that's factoring into his feelings somehow based on his comments about how Daisy and Adam had all the best material. I also think just from a personal standpoint he was bummed to not get to work with Daisy much at all on the second film. But it's also awkward because he obviously has to have KMT's back too in the whole situation after what she went through. It's a mess.

Well what about Finn and Poe? A lot of fans were invested in those two having some sort of relationship as well.

As far as implying Rian was being casually racist...idk, sometimes it does feel like he's implying that. But I don't think he'd outright say it. Probably just easier to blame a big corporation than start an awkward beef with a specific director who's pretty beloved by a lot of Film Twitter. I mean, it's awkward enough that he was openly ripping TLJ.

I am not endorsing any of these viewpoints btw. Just doing my best to wrap my head around how he sees it and why he is frustrated with how things went.

I wouldn't say publicly getting into a beef with a major corporation who has lots of power and money is an "easy" thing to do. So, I guess some credit due to Boyega for his bravery in voicing his issues publicly.

 

[henzINNIT]

Those criticisms have never been clear at all from Boyega.

Most of his comments are from a single interview where he spoke at length about his criticisms. I don't know how much clearer he can be.

If he believes Rian Johnson was being passively racist toward his character and his character arc, he's never actually said that at all, and he's never actually criticized Rian Johnson himself, at least to my knowledge.

He's never mentioned Rian Johnson by name like that to my knowledge. To me that suggests he has no particular gripes with him specifically. Could be wrong. He's either naming Disney to soften it or he thinks they had the power. I brought him up because you have frequently mentioned him though.

As for the hair stylist stuff, no idea. Not sure what happened behind close doors with hair and makeup people. And if the hair stylists aren't sensitive to issues like that, no idea.

This was covered in that same single interview with Boyega. It's worth reading.

However at the same time, I find it hard to believe Boyega never made his concerns known to his agent or manager or Disney HR to get the issue taken care of.

He himself said he went along with it at first because he was grateful for the opportunity. I would assume he did get certain issues dealt with eventually. The point is that he experienced issues in the first place.

If he was botched from the inception, then a large part of the blame is at the feet of JJ Abrams and Lawrence Kasdan. And Abrams is the person Boyega appears to go out of his way to constantly defend and deflect from criticism.

I agree that Abrams is also responsible. That said, I understand why Boyega has defended him. From the outside we can see that JJ hired Boyega and gave him a big break. That would be enough for most people. JJ is probably a decent guy with good intentions. We also know TROS was a disaster behind the scenes, and he came in to try to save it. This is literally how Boyega described the situation too, so not exactly stunning praise and a stubborn defence.

I don't see how Disney was shying away from defending and supporting Boyega at that time. All this seems a little fugazi if you ask me.

Finn has less of a role in 8 and 9 than in 7. Rose has less of a role in 9 than 8. Minority characters were demonstrably reduced over the course of the trilogy.

Finn was a potential love interest for Rey in 7. The next two films contorted around and made the only white guy in their cast her love interest instead, despite him being the main villain and abusive to her directly. Finn instead is paired with different, acceptable minority partners for 8 and 9 while screaming Rey's name.

None of this happens in a vacuum. Probably a bunch of ideas, struggles and compromises that were never ill-intentioned on their own but quickly adds up.

Now removing or shrinking Boyega's image for the marketing posts, that's a more valid criticism I can understand. I'm not sure if he's even mentioned that publicly though. I know others have, but I haven't seen that from Boyega.

The poster is clear and apparent. Surely it supports the other things you find less valid though.

 

[Brother Jack]

Is that really a misdirect? Rey is just as front and center in the marketing and it's clear from the trailers she's an important character and likely a Force wielder in the story as well. Finn did use the lightsaber in the film multiple times, so that's technically not a misdirect IMO.

Rey being a force user and wielding the lightsaber were deliberately kept out of the marketing before the film opened. Finn was the only one ever shown with the saber in the trailers and posters, whereas Rey was only ever shown with her staff. There was some subterfuge there, to make Rey force-grabbing the saber away from Kylo into a big moment. Of course it was obvious from the get-go that Rey was the Luke analog so especially in hindsight it feels very unnecessary. Just Abrams mystery boxing once again.

 

[TheVileOne]

Rey being a force user and wielding the lightsaber were deliberately kept out of the marketing before the film opened. Finn was the only one ever shown with the sabre in the trailers and posters, whereas Rey was only ever shown with her staff. There was some subterfuge there, to make Rey force-grabbing the sabre away from Kylo into a big moment. Of course it was obvious from the get-go that Rey was the Luke analog so especially in hindsight it feels very unnecessary. Just Abrams mystery boxing once again.

Judging by this trailer, it seems pretty indicative that Rey is a force user and pretty important to the story.



This one doesn't indicate Finn is going to be a Force user or Jedi either.

Also once again, how would Finn not have discussions about this with Abrams when he first signed with the movie?

People are acting like Disney gaslit Boyega with the marketing campaign and tricked Boyega into believing he was becoming a Jedi.

 

[henzINNIT]

People are acting like Disney gaslit Boyega with the marketing campaign and tricked Boyega into believing he was becoming a Jedi.

Cross out Jedi. Replace it with 'great character'. I think Boyega and audiences thought Finn would be important. But Disney had absolutely nothing in store for that character. They had nothing for any of the characters, but cobbled something together for Rey, and Kylo.