Burgess Meredith or Danny Devito?

[The Shape]

Obviously you know nothing about the Penguin. So check this out and learn:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Penguin

Spidey-Bat, did you do your research??

 

[The Joker]

One thing I wish DeVito's Penguin had done was puff on the cigarette holder. That was one of my favorite traits of Meredith's Penguin. He was always blowing out huge plumes of smoke from his cigarette holder.

Its one of the Penguin's infamous traits. And it actually contributed to the sqwaking quacks Meredith came up with, because he used to cough sometimes because of the smoke, and he covered it up with the bird like sqwaks.

 

[Lex Luthor]

Yeah that would have been pretty cool to see. From what I remember, the closest Devito's Penguin looked like the Meredith Penguin was that campaign poster that read "Vote Cobblepot" or something. His pose, and appearance in that poster was somewhat similar to what we were used to seeing The Penguin look like. But thats about it.

 

[Bat Attack]

Merediths Penguin had a better quack IMO, it was loud and disturbing. "WHACK! WHAAACK!!!, EXCELLENT! WHACK!!"

 

[Buttman]

That's the best part of it.

Ohhh.. bad thing to say on a comic forum.

I went with Burgess, as he's more like the Penguin from the comics.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

I went with Burgess, as he's more like the Penguin from the comics.

Why does that make it better?

If the Batman comics, which have been published since 1939, have a right to evolve and alter the Penguin's character - and they have - why do the Batman movies not have the same right?

 

[El Payaso]

Some things in comics are no good. As in everything.

 

[The Shape]

Why does that make it better?

If the Batman comics, which have been published since 1939, have a right to evolve and alter the Penguin's character - and they have - why do the Batman movies not have the same right?

We know you're views about how the movies shouldn't be exactly like the comic book, and I agree for the most part. But this is his own opinion.

I also would have preferred a more direct adaptation to the comics Penguin, rather than a deformed, psychipath circus freak. It's just our opinion.

 

[Bathead]

Besides, the whole point of doing an adaptation is to bring the source material to life. Unlike some of you, I liked the original concept of the Penguin. He was never meant as a serious villain in the first place. He was comedic relief. What Burton did was change the Penguin to his liking, just like what the producers for the Catwoman movie did. Basically, it was PINO.

 

[CConn]

Obviously you know nothing about the Penguin. So check this out and learn:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Penguin

Actually, in the original comics, I'm pretty sure he was just what Spidey-Bat said he was. Yet, I'm unsure if he became the more intelligent, mobster Penguin of the current comics before or after BR came out.

 

[CConn]

Besides, the whole point of doing an adaptation is to bring the source material to life. Unlike some of you, I liked the original concept of the Penguin. He was never meant as a serious villain in the first place. He was comedic relief. What Burton did was change the Penguin to his liking, just like what the producers for the Catwoman movie did. Basically, it was PINO.

Penguin's a pretty serious villain in the comics now...

 

[Spidey-Bat]

That's what I originally said, buddy.

You didn't say you didn't want the mutant qualities of him.

Obviously you know nothing about the Penguin. So check this out and learn:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Penguin

It doesn't seem you have since all you did was post a link to wikipedia. You didn't even put an excerpt for me to look at and prove me wrong.

Regardless, Penguin was most famous for being a petty theif resembling a penguin who had a perchant for stealing bird-themed trinkets and using bird-themed gadgets. He was without a doubt one of the lamest villians in Batman's Rogues Gallery. Returns and BTAS were responsible for starting his reform to a deeper, more interesting character.

 

[The Shape]

You didn't say you didn't want the mutant qualities of him.

Why did I have to? I thought saying "I would have preferred a dark take on the Penguin from the comics" pretty much summed that up. Did I really have to say "I would have preferred the Penguin from the comics, who was not a deranged, mutant, psychopathic circus freak"?

It doesn't seem you have since all you did was post a link to wikipedia. You didn't even put an excerpt for me to look at and prove me wrong.

Regardless, Penguin was most famous for being a petty theif resembling a penguin who had a perchant for stealing bird-themed trinkets and using bird-themed gadgets. He was without a doubt one of the lamest villians in Batman's Rogues Gallery. Returns and BTAS were responsible for starting his reform to a deeper, more interesting character.

I guess that means you didn't read it. So here's what you need to know, buddy:

The Penguin (Oswald Chesterfield Cobblepot), is a DC Comics supervillain and an enemy of Batman. Created by artist Bill Finger (although Batman creator Bob Kane is credited by DC), he first appeared in Detective Comics #58 (December 1941).
In most incarnations, The Penguin is a short, chubby man who wears a tuxedo and top hat. A mobster-type criminal, he fancies himself a "gentleman of crime." Unlike most Batman villains, he does not theme his crimes around a psychotic obsession; his intelligence and aristocratic personality starkly contrast against demented Batman villains, such as the Joker.
The Penguin does however possess a few eccentricities. He is known for his love of birds and his high-tech umbrellas that serve some specialized function, such as hang-gliding and weaponry. He also keeps beautiful women around him; perhaps to remind others of his monetary power or to compensate for his own grotesqueness.
Burgess Meredith popularized the Penguin in the 1960s Batman television series, partially because of his signature squawking laughter. Danny DeVito played a much darker version of the character in the 1992 film Batman Returns. This version was not just an unattractive criminal but a physically deformed megalomaniac. Subsequent Batman animated series have alternately featured the deformed Penguin and a more traditional version.
The deformed version of the character has also appeared in comics, most notably in the miniseries, Batman: The Long Halloween, and its sequel, Dark Victory. He only appears for a minor cameo at the end of the Long Halloween, and has no lines. He plays a slightly more notable role in Dark Victory, when Batman goes to him for information. This incarnation also added elements of the 1966 TV series character, as he shouted the well known "waugh waugh" while talking.

-----

Born Oswald Cobblepot, The Penguin was teased very much in childhood due to his short stature, obesity, and bird-like nose. These traits made him an outcast in his rich, debutante family. Their rejection drove him to become a violent criminal. One story claims the Penguin and his mother owned a pet shop, and he became a criminal after neighborhood bullies murdered all the animals in the shop, including his beloved birds. In keeping with his family's tradition of wealth, the Penguin lives a life of crime and evil, yet executes it with his own self proclaimed high society class and style. He commits crimes with the theme of the various birds he loves.
Unlike most of the Batman villains, The Penguin is a gentleman villain, in control of his own actions and perfectly sane, features that serve to maintain a unique relationship with his archenemy, Batman. This has extended into the current situation with The Penguin ceasing his direct involvement in crime, instead running a nightclub that is popular with the underworld. As such, he is an excellent source of information on crime and Batman grudgingly tolerates his operations because of that. However, the entrepreneurial Penguin is often fencing stolen property or arranging early furloughs for incarcerated former criminal associates - for a hefty fee, of course - on the side. During the period when Gotham City was leveled by an earthquake, he was one of the major players in the mostly-abandoned and lawless city, using his connections (one was eventually discovered to be tied to Lex Luthor and his company) to sell necessities at outrageous prices (See also: "No Man's Land").
The Penguin's trademarks are the various deadly umbrellas he uses to execute his evil plans. Several stories affirm that he was forced as a child to always carry an umbrella by his over-protective mother, due to his father dying of pneumonia after being drenched in a downpour. In keeping with his pretensions of being a refined gentleman, he also prefers to wear formal wear such as a top hat and tuxedo during his jobs.
The Penguin received his alias from a childhood nickname, bestowed by his peers, who teased him because of his grotesque appearance and love of birds (retellings of his origin suggest he also suffered from some sort of hip ailment, which caused him to waddle when he walked. The Penguin shows no signs of suffering from this affliction today). Some comics suggest that he tried to abandon the nickname, which he hates, but it has been permanently brought into popularity by his high-profile criminal career. He has cashed in on its popularity with his "Iceberg Lounge" night club.
In the 1960s TV Batman series, the only available information on his early life is that he was once an actor. A frequent expression of Penguin on Batman was "Great Quivering Icebergs." Although called a "Pompous waddling master of foul play", Penguin thinks of himself as an "Aristocrat of Crime." On one episode, when Penguin tried to get himself taken back into prison by committing obvious crimes as part of a greater plan, he is extremely furious when the Batman has him locked up in the city jail as a "common criminal" for violating a Gotham City ordnance. Penguin's thugs wear black bowlers with dark clothing with names of various animals of prey being either birds ("Hawk") or fish ("Shark").

 

[Spidey-Bat]

Why did I have to? I thought saying "I would have preferred a dark take on the Penguin from the comics" pretty much summed that up. Did I really have to say "I would have preferred the Penguin from the comics, who was not a deranged, mutant, psychopathic circus freak"?

Would it have been harder to say that?

I guess that means you didn't read it. So here's what you need to know, buddy:

You do know most of Penguins revisions were from works that were done after Returns was being made.

 

[The Shape]

You do know most of Penguins revisions were from works that were done after Returns was being made.

Yes, and most of those revisions were to make him more like he was in Returns. C'mon now. He was still an eloquent, sophisticated criminal long before Returns was made.

You still haven't read the article, have you?

 

[CConn]

You still haven't read the article, have you?

I read it all. And commented on it. You ignored my post. Even Bathead (who I think is a pretty old school reader) said he was originally just comic relief.

 

[Dr. Fate]

I don't want to choose.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

...

 

[Kevin Roegele]

...

 

[Kevin Roegele]

Besides, the whole point of doing an adaptation is to bring the source material to life.

Is it? Or is it to tell the story in a different medium? Don't assume the two are the same thing, because they are not.

 

[CConn]

I like how you added that element of suspense with those two "..." posts before your real one.

 

[Dark Phantom]

Is it? Or is it to tell the story in a different medium? Don't assume the two are the same thing, because they are not.

telling a story in a different medium doesn't mean you have to change it dramatically from the source material. Its not mandatory, just a preference by the person directing because that's his vision of the source material.

Look at "Bat in the sun", they told Batman stories in a different medium without having to make it "work" on screen. Adapting comics to film doesn't have to make dramatic changes.

 

[batmaluco]

I prefer Danny DeVito's version.

 

[spdrknight]

Devito all the way. The penguin from the comic, before Burton's film, was just this goofy guy with umbrillas. Burton and Devito gave the character depth and personality.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

telling a story in a different medium doesn't mean you have to change it dramatically from the source material. Its not mandatory, just a preference by the person directing because that's his vision of the source material.

First of all, I don't consider Batman Returns a dramatic change from the source material.

Secondly, you have to take each case as it comes when it comes to adapting it to film. Something like Gormenghast or The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy or even the video game Super Mario Brothers simply need don't translate easily.

Look at "Bat in the sun", they told Batman stories in a different medium without having to make it "work" on screen. Adapting comics to film doesn't have to make dramatic changes.

Bat in the Sun makes short fan films for fans, who know who the characters and the stories are beforehand. Mainstream Hollywood movies have to appeal to, and be accessible to, the general audience. They are two completely different demographics. Sit a non-fan in front of a Bat in the Sun project and they'll be impressed by the costumes, but have no idea what is going on, laugh and loose interest quickly.