Dark Phoenix Dark Phoenix Deleted Scenes thread *Spoilers*

[Hand Banana]

 

[itsrivv]

I don’t buy all that. I mean obviously by now we know Fox doesnt know what to do with these characters and they obviously made it hard for Kinberg with all their changes and demands but at the end of the day if more experienced people and talented writers were involved they could have coped better. An extra 40 minutes to this film wouldn’t change the poor dialog, or the fact they turned an epic story into a “family drama”. That was Kinbergs vision and it just didn’t work for people.

 

[henzINNIT]

It happens even with critical and financial failures such as Alexander and Blade Trinity.

Fox even put out extended versions of Alien 3 and Alien vs Predator: Requiem.

All of the above benefited from a time when home releases were thriving. More importantly, they were released by a studio that still existed. Things are different now.

It's not impossible. There's a good chance that a lot of the deleted material here has minimal vfx work involved in it, and potentially some completed stuff that was cut last minute too. An alternate take is not a bad sales pitch for a film that didn't fare well at the B.O. The biggest question mark is whether Disney would have any motivation to do so with a reboot around the corner.

 

[EnDz0n3]

Does Disney even put out Extended Cuts and Alternate Takes for their movies? I'm struggling to remember the last time, granted the only Disney products I watch are mostly the MCU films and Pixar.

 

[henzINNIT]

Does Disney even put out Extended Cuts and Alternate Takes for their movies? I'm struggling to remember the last time, granted the only Disney products I watch are mostly the MCU films and Pixar.

I can't think of anything. There are a bunch of MCU films with interesting and sometimes substantial deleted material. An alternate cut has never been on the table.

 

[EnDz0n3]

Yea I thought so.

Even X-men at Fox wasn't known to come out with Alternate takes. The big one was obviously The Rogue Cut. The only one before that was "X-men 1.5" which I loved, but it didn't really splice together footage seamlessly. It gave you the ability to insert the deleted scenes into the movie but it wasn't edited together to be a different cut of the movie. I guess there's also Deadpool 2 Extended Cut Home Release, which I haven't seen yet (tbh, I've only seen that movie once, in the theatre). There's also Once Upon a Deadpool.

The difference between those 3 movies and Dark Phoenix is that the latter is bombing. Hard.

 

[The Guard]

I don’t buy all that. I mean obviously by now we know Fox doesnt know what to do with these characters and they obviously made it hard for Kinberg with all their changes and demands but at the end of the day if more experienced people and talented writers were involved they could have coped better. An extra 40 minutes to this film wouldn’t change the poor dialog, or the fact they turned an epic story into a “family drama”. That was Kinbergs vision and it just didn’t work for people.

Re: the dialogue...

a lot of the "clunkers" in this movie are essentially moments that were compressed into exposition dumps, especially in Act II. It's entirely possible that some of those exchanges were added either in reshoots or after the project was streamlined, in order to move things along due to scenes that were originally planned/shot. When you have more screentime to work with, you can back off on the exposition considerably. So a longer film with more time to breathe may well have featured more impressive, less generic expository dialogue.

 

[psylockolussus]

X-Men: Darker PhoeniX

 

[EnDz0n3]

Re: the dialogue...

a lot of the "clunkers" in this movie are essentially moments that were compressed into exposition dumps, especially in Act II. It's entirely possible that some of those exchanges were added either in reshoots or after the project was streamlined, in order to move things along due to scenes that were originally planned/shot. When you have more screentime to work with, you can back off on the exposition considerably. So a longer film with more time to breathe may well have featured more impressive, less generic expository dialogue.

They would still be dialogue written by Kinberg so probably not.

 

[psylockolussus]

Does Disney even put out Extended Cuts and Alternate Takes for their movies? I'm struggling to remember the last time, granted the only Disney products I watch are mostly the MCU films and Pixar.

They remastered a lot of their animated films but I can't remember an eXtended cut or alternate cut edition.

 

[Erik Lensherr]

X-Men: Darker PhoeniX

X-Men: Dark PhoeniⓍ

 

[Aurakles]

I don’t buy all that. I mean obviously by now we know Fox doesnt know what to do with these characters and they obviously made it hard for Kinberg with all their changes and demands but at the end of the day if more experienced people and talented writers were involved they could have coped better. An extra 40 minutes to this film wouldn’t change the poor dialog, or the fact they turned an epic story into a “family drama”. That was Kinbergs vision and it just didn’t work for people.

I like the idea of turning it into a family drama, focusing on how it effects Jean and the people who love her, rather than alien empires.
Certainly it could've been handled better, but I think the core idea has merit.

 

[itsrivv]

I like the idea of turning it into a family drama, focusing on how it effects Jean and the people who love her, rather than alien empires.
Certainly it could've been handled better, but I think the core idea has merit.

I like the concept of a family drama between the characters for an X-Men movie too but this story just wasn’t the one to do it with. It’s not what anyone wanted to see in a Dark Phoenix film.

 

[TheNewSlayer]

X-Men: Dark PhoeniⓍ

They could simply called Extended version or Uncut Version.

 

[psylockolussus]

DarkerPhoeniⓍ sounds catchier.

 

[Hand Banana]

All of the above benefited from a time when home releases were thriving. More importantly, they were released by a studio that still existed. Things are different now.

It's not impossible. There's a good chance that a lot of the deleted material here has minimal vfx work involved in it, and potentially some completed stuff that was cut last minute too. An alternate take is not a bad sales pitch for a film that didn't fare well at the B.O. The biggest question mark is whether Disney would have any motivation to do so with a reboot around the corner.

Fox is still going to exist as far as I know. After Disney officially owned Fox they released a schedule and the Avatar sequels are still under Fox. They are just losing the Marvel rights(and employees).

Word is that Fox anticipated failure and cut a lot of footage to trim the running time and squeeze in more showings per day. John Campea did say that Fox was panicking and didn’t know what to do with it. So a longer cut might already exist.

 

[SumT]

to make this a family drama.... they should be a family first.

Jean, Storm, Nightcrawler and co. werent a family in the previous movie, neither they are at the beggining of the movie. If you ask general audience what these exact characters are at the beggining relating to each other... each viewer would give you a different answer: students, friends, superheroes?, teachers?, fighters, class mates.....

anything but family. thats for sure.

 

[Hand Banana]

Yea I thought so.

Even X-men at Fox wasn't known to come out with Alternate takes. The big one was obviously The Rogue Cut. The only one before that was "X-men 1.5" which I loved, but it didn't really splice together footage seamlessly. It gave you the ability to insert the deleted scenes into the movie but it wasn't edited together to be a different cut of the movie. I guess there's also Deadpool 2 Extended Cut Home Release, which I haven't seen yet (tbh, I've only seen that movie once, in the theatre). There's also Once Upon a Deadpool.

The difference between those 3 movies and Dark Phoenix is that the latter is bombing. Hard.

The Wolverine also had an extended cut when it was released on home media.

 

[2kt09]

The Wolverine also had an extended cut when it was released on home media.

And Logan got a black and white cut.
Oh vey...guess we are getting an alternate cut.

 

[henzINNIT]

Fox is still going to exist as far as I know. After Disney officially owned Fox they released a schedule and the Avatar sequels are still under Fox. They are just losing the Marvel rights(and employees).

Word is that Fox anticipated failure and cut a lot of footage to trim the running time and squeeze in more showings per day. John Campea did say that Fox was panicking and didn’t know what to do with it. So a longer cut might already exist.

But you've said it yourself: Marvel have the characters now; the skeletal remains of Fox will no longer be a factor. Whatever shenanigans went on behind the scenes, it was done to make the most of an upcoming bomb. If they didn't think this potential alternate cut would sell more tickets, it is unlikely they'll think it'll sell more blu rays.

to make this a family drama.... they should be a family first.

Jean, Storm, Nightcrawler and co. werent a family in the previous movie, neither they are at the beggining of the movie. If you ask general audience what these exact characters are at the beggining relating to each other... each viewer would give you a different answer: students, friends, superheroes?, teachers?, fighters, class mates.....

anything but family. thats for sure.

So very, tragically true. This franchise is 19 years old and the 'family' vibe is non-existent. Even discarding any previous build up, there is no reason why this film couldn't fit some meaningful character interaction into these 2 hours. Quicksilver is benched and I don't think anyone even mentions him while he's off-sceen. Storm and Kurt are practically extras. These guys have known each-other for a decade.

 

[SumT]

But you've said it yourself: Marvel have the characters now; the skeletal remains of Fox will no longer be a factor. Whatever shenanigans went on behind the scenes, it was done to make the most of an upcoming bomb. If they didn't think this potential alternate cut would sell more tickets, it is unlikely they'll think it'll sell more blu rays.



So very, tragically true. This franchise is 19 years old and the 'family' vibe is non-existent. Even discarding any previous build up, there is no reason why this film couldn't fit some meaningful character interaction into these 2 hours. Quicksilver is benched and I don't think anyone even mentions him while he's off-sceen. Storm and Kurt are practically extras. These guys have known each-other for a decade.

each time I read fans adressing these flaws, I get disgusted because of how true they are.

these x-men DONT CARE about anyone on that school lol. Its so real that it hurts.
Storm doesnt care about Jean, none cared about Quicksilver being almost dead, they left him somewhere in the school and "goodbye", none mentions him ever LOL. its pathetic. Hank doesnt care about Jean, a "friend" of him supposedly. Kurt never mentions Jean. Are they even friends? we wont ever know.
Do Charles and Kurt share at least 2 lines on the latest two movies?
its like Charles doesnt give a damm about this blue elf on his house. Kurt is......... just there.

and here is where we, as fans, really realize that Kinberg doesnt give a damm about the x-men and their relationships. And dont fool yourself, his "original version" didnt explore their friendship either. Lets not be that naive, yall. Kinberg doesnt really care.

 

[henzINNIT]

each time I read fans adressing these flaws, I get disgusted because of how true they are.

these x-men DONT CARE about anyone on that school lol. Its so real that it hurts.
Storm doesnt care about Jean, none cared about Quicksilver being almost dead, they left him somewhere in the school and "goodbye", none mentions him ever LOL. its pathetic. Hank doesnt care about Jean, a "friend" of him supposedly. Kurt never mentions Jean. Are they even friends? we wont ever know.
Do Charles and Kurt share at least 2 lines on the latest two movies?
its like Charles doesnt give a damm about this blue elf on his house. Kurt is......... just there.

and here is where we, as fans, really realize that Kinberg doesnt give a damm about the x-men and their relationships. And dont fool yourself, his "original version" didnt explore their friendship either. Lets not be that naive, yall. Kinberg doesnt really care.

Maybe there's a few lines that were cut that allowed these characters to interact a bit more, but it's still a huge writing problem if this stuff only existed as superfluous material. To pick on one character: No added scene will make Hank's choices more likable or understandable. He has been in Jean's life for 17 years, and her killing Raven was clearly a mistake; yet he seeks out Magneto with the sole intention of killing Jean as revenge for her actions. He's been portrayed as compassionate, level-head, loyal. This doesn't work. This is bad writing. The scene between him and Charles works okay because the conflict there is rooted in their characters. He believes Charles is responsible for Jean's death and we can understand why. Ironically this makes Hank's later actions even more questionable. Why go out to kill Jean when you're blaming someone else for her situation? Kinberg draws conflict from plot instead of character, which is why no-one cares about them.

 

[Hand Banana]

But you've said it yourself: Marvel have the characters now; the skeletal remains of Fox will no longer be a factor. Whatever shenanigans went on behind the scenes, it was done to make the most of an upcoming bomb. If they didn't think this potential alternate cut would sell more tickets, it is unlikely they'll think it'll sell more blu rays.

Home media is not the same as theatrical release though. It’s not going to compete with summer blockbusters or anything like that, which was the cause of much of the panic. That and the early marketing was screwed due to people losing their jobs.

Maybe there's a few lines that were cut that allowed these characters to interact a bit more, but it's still a huge writing problem if this stuff only existed as superfluous material. To pick on one character: No added scene will make Hank's choices more likable or understandable. He has been in Jean's life for 17 years, and her killing Raven was clearly a mistake; yet he seeks out Magneto with the sole intention of killing Jean as revenge for her actions. He's been portrayed as compassionate, level-head, loyal. This doesn't work. This is bad writing. The scene between him and Charles works okay because the conflict there is rooted in their characters. He believes Charles is responsible for Jean's death and we can understand why. Ironically this makes Hank's later actions even more questionable. Why go out to kill Jean when you're blaming someone else for her situation? Kinberg draws conflict from plot instead of character, which is why no-one cares about them.

There is a cut scene in the trailer or tv spot where Hank says “she’s not Jean anymore”. It seems that he blames the entity inside her.

 

[TheVileOne]

I don’t buy all that. I mean obviously by now we know Fox doesnt know what to do with these characters and they obviously made it hard for Kinberg with all their changes and demands but at the end of the day if more experienced people and talented writers were involved they could have coped better. An extra 40 minutes to this film wouldn’t change the poor dialog, or the fact they turned an epic story into a “family drama”. That was Kinbergs vision and it just didn’t work for people.

Or the horrendous performances of all the characters.

 

[Hand Banana]

Or the horrendous performances of all the characters.

Disagree. I thought Sophie, James, Michael, and Nicolas were all good. JLaw phoned it in but she was not nearly as bad as she was in Apocalypse.

Everyone else’s performances were “meh”.