Endgame Does the Avengers have moral characters of a true hero? (SPOILERS!)

[SamuraiThanos]

• What is a hero?
  
  
• What type of moral characters do they have compared to other people?
  
  
• Is a hero someone that is emotionally imbalanced and base their decisions on emotions?
  
  
• Are they just characters that have super powers?
  

Movies, books, and stories are great ways to pass down a message to the people, especially to younger generations. The Avengers Endgame movie lacked what a true hero represents and possibly send the wrong message to people. Hero’s are those that face challenges against all odds and rise to adversity, along with having great moral characters. Did “The Avengers” truly show any of these during the movie? Let’s take a few examples. Continuing from the previous movie where Thanos has eliminated 50% of living beings from the existence of the universe. After this tragic incident and the hero’s are introduced to us; one becomes an alcoholic, another turns to vengeance, and others become emotionally imbalanced. After discovering the location of Thanos the hero’s recruit one another to retrieve the gauntlet or infinity stone. Before we continue: do you view hero’s as those that harm the injured? Or those living peacefully in solitude? Or harm the defenseless? They discover Thanos has been living peacefully on this planet and easily restrained him. After Thanos tells them that he has destroyed the infinity stone, which nearly killed him, Thor (The God of Thunder) beheads him with vengeance and hate. Do hero’s base their decisions on emotions rather than logic or reason? Knowing fully well they have captured and restrained the enemy with ease and on top of that has been living peacefully in solitude, still decides to do him harm.

Why is Batman such a popular hero? It's because he went through many adversity and battled his demons within to do right and not lose his soul to anger, hate, and revenge. Another downfall with these hero characters, especially the message that’s delivered to young minds, is they have become entangled with their emotions and external factors that they have lost their soul during the process. After 5 years, the so called hero’s are still attached and moan about their lost, they no longer have interest for the present moment or even the future. Filled with emotions and despair they forget to enjoy those that are still living. It is a misfortune to lose those you love but a catastrophe to lose your soul. Many of the decisions that were made, were made based on emotions and feelings. Isn’t this something that should be avoided and taught not to do? For hero’s that do many battles, shouldn’t they have an idea or understanding of losing those they love in battle? And how to die gracefully and thankfully themselves?

For those that have seen Spiderman into the Verse. What “The Avengers” are doing is similar to what King Pin was doing. After the lost of King Pin’s family he will do whatever it is to gain his family, regardless of the consequences. Isn’t this something The Avengers were doing? They do not fully understand the repercussions of their actions, bringing everybody back to life after the 5 years of departure. What about those that have moved on? Potentially those that may have been remarried and had kids. What will happen to them when they bring back their deceased husband or wife back to life? Could they not see that it was possible that they did more harm than good bringing them back to life?

To top it off, Captain America, the representation of what is good and protector of people was chosen and granted by the God's to be worthy of using Thor's hammer, possibly made him the God of Thunder. What did he choose to do? Take Thor's hammer and go back in time, to another timeline, to start a family. Quite possibly retiring from being a hero. Did he truly forfeit his duty as a hero after being granted such responsibilities?

What is a hero? Hero’s are those that face adversity and continue to live on the best they can without losing their soul. Someone that is able to withstand challenges and suffering but still continue to live peacefully. One that understands, acknowledges, and is not afraid of death - when it comes, faces it gracefully. Isn’t a hero one that is well balanced? Someone that has emotions but isn’t driven by their emotions. It seems that Thanos had the soul and moral character of a true hero but path of a villain. While “The Avengers” had the soul and moral character of cowards (typically seen in villains) but path of a hero.

What is a hero to you?

 

[metaphysician]

If your definition of a "hero" requires that they be obsessives whose only allowable fate is to die, then your definition of "hero" needs some reworking. Part of heroism is wisdom, and part of wisdom is "the humility to accept that you are not the only hero in the world".

 

[Mandon Knight]

A hero is moral fibre, a hero is moral compass, a hero is compassion, a hero is someone who places others ahead of themselves even when their own world has been destroyed, a hero is a willing listener, the widest shoulders, the capacity to see, when others turn their back.

The willingness to battle on knowing the defeat might beat the victory, but hell, going for it anyway.

Self sacrifice because you know it's the thing that needs to be done for the wider need.

Knowing that the pain you feel inside is felt by many more outside of own's own being.

Knowing your own journey is complete if others get there first and you helped them get there.

That's being a hero. Super powers or not.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

As someone that has written my fair share of deep dive "essay" posts about super heroes and who had to experience the across the board freak out that MOS and BvS caused among fans hearing a lot of the same, in my opinion, extremely wrong headed notions about both real world and fictional notions of morality as well as baseline ideas of what makes for good narrative...


I'm sorry OP, but you don't want to see a movie with any depth or compelling narrative. You don't want characters that in any way resemble people with actual emotions, flaws or liimits. In fact, heroes with more recognizable humanity, warts and all is a hallmark of Marvel Comics heroes going back to the 1960's. It sounds like what you want is to essentially have an average episode of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers.

I think what you are expecting out of both fiction as well as the real world likely will always be disappointing and unsatisfying to yourself because you cannot fathom that reality or any story crafted to mirror it in some way, and yes that even includes super hero stuff, at least when it's done best, must include the facet of existence that is imperfection, limitations and an understanding that what was taught to one as a child doesn't hold to the reality of the life of an adult, much less one that's acquired a modicum of maturity and wisdom.

Point blank... I think your criticisms are silly and poorly thought out.

 

[Samuron]

"Frank, do you know what a hero is? Ninety-nine times out of a hundred, he's somebody who's tired enough and cold enough and hungry enough not to give a damn."
-- Hawkeye, M*A*S*H

 

[Mandon Knight]

As preachy as she's written to be....this gets it right....

 

[SamuraiThanos]

If your definition of a "hero" requires that they be obsessives whose only allowable fate is to die, then your definition of "hero" needs some reworking. Part of heroism is wisdom, and part of wisdom is "the humility to accept that you are not the only hero in the world".

Where did you get that my definition of a hero "be obsessives whose only allowable fate is to die"? It's to accept it, that is all our fate. Not to do so going into battle is one who has already lost.

On wisdom: who do you think is the wiser of the two: Thanos or The Avengers?

"Humility to accept that you are not the only hero". This is true. What about their moral characters?

 

[SamuraiThanos]

As preachy as she's written to be....this gets it right....

Lol! Well put Aunt May.

 

[SamuraiThanos]

As someone that has written my fair share of deep dive "essay" posts about super heroes and who had to experience the across the board freak out that MOS and BvS caused among fans hearing a lot of the same, in my opinion, extremely wrong headed notions about both real world and fictional notions of morality as well as baseline ideas of what makes for good narrative...


I'm sorry OP, but you don't want to see a movie with any depth or compelling narrative. You don't want characters that in any way resemble people with actual emotions, flaws or liimits. In fact, heroes with more recognizable humanity, warts and all is a hallmark of Marvel Comics heroes going back to the 1960's. It sounds like what you want is to essentially have an average episode of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers.

I think what you are expecting out of both fiction as well as the real world likely will always be disappointing and unsatisfying to yourself because you cannot fathom that reality or any story crafted to mirror it in some way, and yes that even includes super hero stuff, at least when it's done best, must include the facet of existence that is imperfection, limitations and an understanding that what was taught to one as a child doesn't hold to the reality of the life of an adult, much less one that's acquired a modicum of maturity and wisdom.

Point blank... I think your criticisms are silly and poorly thought out.

Thanks! Lol! "average episode of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers". That's hilarious.
I don't expect anything. You literally didn't say anything that has substance.

The movie was $#!+ that represents poor moral characters of a hero, in fact as an individual. Death of Peter Parker from the previous movie was over played.

You use a lot of pretty words but have no substance my friend.

Does anybody know what happens in the comics vs this crap movie? Previous movies were great, this (thumbs down).

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Thanks! Lol! "average episode of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers". That's hilarious.
I don't expect anything. You literally didn't say anything that has substance.

The movie was $#!+ that represents poor moral characters of a hero, in fact as an individual. Death of Peter Parker from the previous movie was over played.

You use a lot of pretty words but have no substance my friend.

Does anybody know what happens in the comics vs this crap movie? Previous movies were great, this (thumbs down).

Enjoy your Power Rangers reruns. It's obvious both the film and my post went WAY over your head. And since I was born in 1976 and was probably reading these comics before you were reading in general, yeah, I am more than aware of the comic books. So... Yeah, multiple strike outs on your part.

 

[SamuraiThanos]

Enjoy your Power Rangers reruns. It's obvious both the film and my post went WAY over your head. And since I was born in 1976 and was probably reading these comics before you were reading in general, yeah, I am more than aware of the comic books. So... Yeah, multiple strike outs on your part.

Congratulations bro! You've won... You definitely deserve a gold medal. I'm guessing that's all your life experience.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

You:

Me:

No one gives a crap about your childish notions of how this film's screenplay should have been written. So please... Keep coming back craving for that contrarian attention you aren't getting anywhere else in life. If you think you're gonna be the person to "win" against me, whatever that means, on a freaking super hero forum, well... That speaks a lot more about YOU than myself.

"Oh heaven forfend, what shall I do? SamuraiThanos is calling me a loser! I guess I'll slit my wrists?"

Is that what you think your bull**** response is gonna make me do? Please child... Just... Please.

 

[jolldan]

• What is a hero?
  
  
• What type of moral characters do they have compared to other people?
  
  
• Is a hero someone that is emotionally imbalanced and base their decisions on emotions?
  
  
• Are they just characters that have super powers?

1. Movies, books, and stories are great ways to pass down a message to the people, especially to younger generations. The Avengers Endgame movie lacked what a true hero represents and possibly send the wrong message to people. Hero’s are those that face challenges against all odds and rise to adversity, along with having great moral characters. Did “The Avengers” truly show any of these during the movie? Let’s take a few examples. Continuing from the previous movie where Thanos has eliminated 50% of living beings from the existence of the universe. After this tragic incident and the hero’s are introduced to us; one becomes an alcoholic, another turns to vengeance, and others become emotionally imbalanced. After discovering the location of Thanos the hero’s recruit one another to retrieve the gauntlet or infinity stone. Before we continue: do you view hero’s as those that harm the injured? Or those living peacefully in solitude? Or harm the defenseless? They discover Thanos has been living peacefully on this planet and easily restrained him. After Thanos tells them that he has destroyed the infinity stone, which nearly killed him, Thor (The God of Thunder) beheads him with vengeance and hate. Do hero’s base their decisions on emotions rather than logic or reason? Knowing fully well they have captured and restrained the enemy with ease and on top of that has been living peacefully in solitude, still decides to do him harm.

Why is Batman such a popular hero? It's because he went through many adversity and battled his demons within to do right and not lose his soul to anger, hate, and revenge. Another downfall with these hero characters, especially the message that’s delivered to young minds, is they have become entangled with their emotions and external factors that they have lost their soul during the process. After 5 years, the so called hero’s are still attached and moan about their lost, they no longer have interest for the present moment or even the future. Filled with emotions and despair they forget to enjoy those that are still living. It is a misfortune to lose those you love but a catastrophe to lose your soul. Many of the decisions that were made, were made based on emotions and feelings. Isn’t this something that should be avoided and taught not to do? For hero’s that do many battles, shouldn’t they have an idea or understanding of losing those they love in battle? And how to die gracefully and thankfully themselves?

For those that have seen Spiderman into the Verse. What “The Avengers” are doing is similar to what King Pin was doing. After the lost of King Pin’s family he will do whatever it is to gain his family, regardless of the consequences. Isn’t this something The Avengers were doing? They do not fully understand the repercussions of their actions, bringing everybody back to life after the 5 years of departure. What about those that have moved on? Potentially those that may have been remarried and had kids. What will happen to them when they bring back their deceased husband or wife back to life? Could they not see that it was possible that they did more harm than good bringing them back to life?

2. To top it off, Captain America, the representation of what is good and protector of people was chosen and granted by the God's to be worthy of using Thor's hammer, possibly made him the God of Thunder. What did he choose to do? Take Thor's hammer and go back in time, to another timeline, to start a family. Quite possibly retiring from being a hero. Did he truly forfeit his duty as a hero after being granted such responsibilities?

3. What is a hero? Hero’s are those that face adversity and continue to live on the best they can without losing their soul. Someone that is able to withstand challenges and suffering but still continue to live peacefully. One that understands, acknowledges, and is not afraid of death - when it comes, faces it gracefully. Isn’t a hero one that is well balanced? Someone that has emotions but isn’t driven by their emotions. It seems that Thanos had the soul and moral character of a true hero but path of a villain. While “The Avengers” had the soul and moral character of cowards (typically seen in villains) but path of a hero.

What is a hero to you?

1. In terms of your point on Thanos I see maybe what you are trying to get at but remember this is the same person who had just caused the genocide of half the universe. to quote you "Before we continue: do you view hero’s as those that harm the injured? Or those living peacefully in solitude? Or harm the defenseless?" Just because someone is now living peacefully and is injured because of the evil they've done in the past doesn't mean they should be excused of their last sins, especially if they are as bad as Thanos's. If you ever found the zodiac killer and he was just keeping chickens on a farm I don't think many people would blame you if you killed him. In terms of their faults that shows you just what heroes they are imo. An experience like that would break any normal person but not them, instead it fractures them meaning everyone suffers in different ways but they still go on because they know they have to.

2. I think the whole hero sacrificing himself and going out on his shield (pardon the pun) has been done to death and in Cap's sense it was more heroic for him to have that storybook ending. Cap fought in countless wars & battles he would have happily gave his life multiple times if it meant victory for the rest of the team without hesitation. After the battle is over however its more heroic for him to honour his fallen friend Tony by going and actually living the life that he never got to have before. “I put the stones back,” Old Man Cap says. “And I thought maybe I should try some of that life Tony was telling me to get.”

3. Im sorry if you felt that way about The Avengers best thing I think I could say is their more than one kind of hero. Superman & Batman are very different both they are both heroes in the truest sense of the word. Both have very different approaches and personalities. I don't how you can reason that anyone who's plan is to wipe out half of all life can have the soul and character of a hero.

 

[MovieSlave]