Why was Incredible Hulk ignored for so long?

[BatOnTheWing]

The Incredible Hulk is the throwaway film of the MCU, honestly.
All it deserves is the few nods that it got just to keep the continuity flowing.

 

[dax]

The major problem TIH has was that it just felt like it was seperate from the MCU. These were their three missed oppurtunities IMO:

1) Nick Fury in the film. If you put Fury in as General Ross's character, he'd have an arc that would setup his attitude towards The Avengers Intiative and give Phase 1 more interconnectivety in a natural way.

2) Casting Ruffalo as Hulk. Norton is fine, but Ruffalo is exceptional. He was also their first choice...it was Universal who insisted on Norton.

3) Underusing Samuel Sterns. Tim Blake Nelson rocked this role. The coolest thing they could have done is bring him back as the "scientist guy" in Thor or The Avengers. More interconnectivity.

The real mistake is that Marvel completely retconned the 2003 Hulk film. The audiences were all confused over whether or not the Incredible Hulk was a sequel to the 2003 film because both films showed Bruce Banner hiding in South America. Plus, General Ross mentioned that Bruce had been on the run for 5 years which could mislead the audiences into believing that the Ang Lee film is still canon but if they hadn't changed the origin story, then both Hulk films would seem like they could be interconnected to one another.

 

[Venom 1988]

The real mistake is that Marvel completely retconned the 2003 Hulk film.

lol no

 

[NealKenneth]

The real mistake is that Marvel completely retconned the 2003 Hulk film.

Hmm maybe at release there were some confused fans but I doubt that has hurt its long-term legacy. Here's my pitch:

An accident at a military base opens the film. Hulk is seen tossing soldiers around before jumping away and escaping the complex.

Next morning, SHIELD is allowed to invesitage the incident. There is a briefing scene where they go over the basic origin details. Ross explains that Banner was trying to create a super-soldier ("You mean like Captain America?" someone could ask). Fury orders Black Widow and Hawkeye to help General Ross track down and capture Banner. As the film goes on, Black Widow has a few close encounters with Banner and starts to sympathize with him. Fury begins to question the military's motives. Banner experiments with possible cures for his condition, eventually meeting with Samuel Stern. An accident occurs and the treatment fails.

Later on, Hulk is in a building as it starts to collapse following an epic battle with the military. Hulk notices Widow is still inside and, instead of fleeing, shields her with his body before bursting out of the rubble. Widow confers with Fury and he decides to use SHIELD's resources to help Banner stay in hiding "until he is needed."

I see it as a mid-budget horror film with Hulk as the monster. PG-13, under 100 minutes.

 

[metaphysician]

They didn't retcon it. It simply never was in continuity in the first place.

I suspect any similarities arise from TIH *starting* as a Universal production. They probably *did* intend it to be a sequel.

 

[Dasher10]

It was ignored because Universal won't play ball with Marvel, nor willthey give up the film rights.

Say what you will about Fox and Sony but at least they're still making films based on Marvel characters.

 

[Gamma Ra]

I feel like it would be difficult for Hulk to carry his own film sequel and be a great success. Someone mentioned the only reason to do another Hulk movie is if they introduce She Hulk. I agree. However a Hulk vs Thing vs Rhino vs. Venom vs Wolverine match or any combination would be worthy of a sequel.

I have to disagree. The problem with Hulk movies thus far has been the one dimensional characterization of both the Hulk and Banner. Instead of going with the comic book character, Marvel and Universal studios have stuck closer to the primal rage theme which was used in the 70's television show. The character was an extremely limited representation of his comic persona, but worked in a 45 minute setting.

The Hulk's comic book characterization has so much to offer. Hulk is not a simple character to write as one might assume as I've seen many top writers get it wrong. There is just as much internal conflict going on within Hulk's and Banner's own minds with themselves as it is with each other. But the biggest issue is Hulk not being verbally expressive as by nature he is extremely opinionated and sees the world from a unique point of view.

 

[Herofan]

The Incredible Hulk seemed rather anti-government/paranoia-ish, which was pretty inconsistent with the ethos of MCU (all are characters are lovable and loved and authorized) until TWS.

 

[Limonade]

I didn't like Edward Norton as Bruce Banner.

 

[Rorschach2012]

I have to disagree. The problem with Hulk movies thus far has been the one dimensional characterization of both the Hulk and Banner. Instead of going with the comic book character, Marvel and Universal studios have stuck closer to the primal rage theme which was used in the 70's television show. The character was an extremely limited representation of his comic persona, but worked in a 45 minute setting.

The Hulk's comic book characterization has so much to offer. Hulk is not a simple character to write as one might assume as I've seen many top writers get it wrong. There is just as much internal conflict going on within Hulk's and Banner's own minds with themselves as it is with each other. But the biggest issue is Hulk not being verbally expressive as by nature he is extremely opinionated and sees the world from a unique point of view.

I really think the MCU is moving towards that version of the Hulk, as evidenced by Ragnarok

 

[LaughterLives]

Banner or Hulk are literally mentioned, referenced or directly in every Marvel movie after Iron Man 2. Its After Iron Man 3 and Avengers 2 where it stops.
I can't wait for Ragnarok doh

 

[WereCoyote]

Hmm maybe at release there were some confused fans but I doubt that has hurt its long-term legacy. Here's my pitch:

An accident at a military base opens the film. Hulk is seen tossing soldiers around before jumping away and escaping the complex.

Next morning, SHIELD is allowed to invesitage the incident. There is a briefing scene where they go over the basic origin details. Ross explains that Banner was trying to create a super-soldier ("You mean like Captain America?" someone could ask). Fury orders Black Widow and Hawkeye to help General Ross track down and capture Banner. As the film goes on, Black Widow has a few close encounters with Banner and starts to sympathize with him. Fury begins to question the military's motives. Banner experiments with possible cures for his condition, eventually meeting with Samuel Stern. An accident occurs and the treatment fails.

Later on, Hulk is in a building as it starts to collapse following an epic battle with the military. Hulk notices Widow is still inside and, instead of fleeing, shields her with his body before bursting out of the rubble. Widow confers with Fury and he decides to use SHIELD's resources to help Banner stay in hiding "until he is needed."

I see it as a mid-budget horror film with Hulk as the monster. PG-13, under 100 minutes.

Only problem with that is, at the time of The Incredible Hulk's release, Nick Fury was the only character that the MCU had introduced. Black Widow wouldn't come until Iron Man 2, and Hawkeye until Thor.

 

[WereCoyote]

But the biggest issue is Hulk not being verbally expressive as by nature he is extremely opinionated and sees the world from a unique point of view.

Looks like from the new Thor: Ragnarock trailer, that is about to change.

 

[Gamma Ra]

Looks like from the new Thor: Ragnarock trailer, that is about to change.

This does seem to be the case. Ever since Ang Lee's Hulk film I've felt Marvel missed the opportunity to show a truly unique character. Hulk has so much to offer with so many internal and external conflicts and seeming contradictions.

 

[Hypestyle]

If Bill Bixby was alive, what role would he play in the MCU films?

 

[Boom]

I believe it was Mark Ruffalo that said this, but I agree with it quite a bit. Perhaps the reason people didn't respond so well to the first two Hulk movies (quality aside) is because Bruce Banner spends a great part of those films trying to keep the Hulk subdued while he searches for a cure. Presumably, people go to Hulk movies to see the Hulk in action, so when the lead character spends most of the movie actively preventing people from seeing the Hulk, the audience disconnects and simply counts the minutes until the big guy shows up again.

If there is ever going to be another Hulk film, I'd suggest two things:

1) The Hulk must develop a clear and distinct personality. Let him speak. Let him actually converse with other characters. Thor: Ragnarok is finally making a first step in this regard. Continue to push it.

2) Instead of trying to find a cure, get Bruce Banner to a point where he accepts the Hulk as part of himself, and focus on how the two must learn to co-exist with each other. Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes provided an excellent template for this. Not only do you have a goldmine of comedic opportunity here, but you also have a chance to get into some genuinely strong, heartfelt character work.

 

[Gamma Ra]

Those are good points.

I believe the Hulk and MCU movies in general have as of yet to capture the essence of what has allowed the character to last of 50 years.

The lack of a Hulk personality that can verbally express himself is the biggest problem. Generally speaking Hulk has many characteristics that make him unique. Hulk is an extremely opinionated character that does not view the world like anyone else. He is a walking contradiction; too many to name. He makes many defensive threats but really just wants to be left alone. He hates violence, but will entertain any that comes his way to prove his point. He is loyal and protective of those he calls friends. He's somewhat naive because he's honest even when he's wrong...to name a few.

While all the designs of Hulk were satisfactory at worst, the size of Hulk in all the movies is wrong. Ang Lee ruined his movie with the 'angry growing Hulk' and bad color choice. He is waaaayyyy too tall. His name signifies that he's massive, not a towering giant. Hulk should only be 6 foot 6 inches to 7 foot 6 inches tall which is tall enough. I realize 8 feet and taller takes away grom his imposing strength.

Banner is also a problem. They need to reread the first few issues of The Incredible Hulk in order to see a more interesting perspective on Bruce Banner.

 

[2kt09]

2) Instead of trying to find a cure, get Bruce Banner to a point where he accepts the Hulk as part of himself, and focus on how the two must learn to co-exist with each other. Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes provided an excellent template for this. Not only do you have a goldmine of comedic opportunity here, but you also have a chance to get into some genuinely strong, heartfelt character work.

The Hulk just doesn't feel different enough from Banner to get to that. There was a clear enough distinction between the two to make the split personality thing work in EMH and to a lesser extent TiH.

 

[dax]

2) Instead of trying to find a cure, get Bruce Banner to a point where he accepts the Hulk as part of himself, and focus on how the two must learn to co-exist with each other. Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes provided an excellent template for this. Not only do you have a goldmine of comedic opportunity here, but you also have a chance to get into some genuinely strong, heartfelt character work.

Bruce will NEVER accept the Hulk as part of himself. He will always view the Hulk as a walking weapon of mass destruction who could potentially harm anyone that gets in its way. In the opening credit scenes of the Incredible Hulk, Bruce felt so guilty about hurting Betty Ross after turning into the Hulk for the first time, that he went into hiding for 5 years. Plus, as long as the Hulk is inhabited inside Bruce's body, he will have a target on his back to which the authorities and the military (along with Thunderbolt Ross) will be hunting for him. That's why in the 70's TV show, Bruce had to fake his own death so that noone would know that he and the giant green monster are the same person and in the movies, he had to hide in South America. He even took the Quinjet to the other side of the galaxy which would explain why he's in Thor: Ragnarok.

 

[Tg11]

It makes me wonder why Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner/Hulk doesn't get his own solo film

 

[Gamma Ra]

It makes me wonder why Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner/Hulk doesn't get his own solo film

Marvel Studios can not do a solo Hulk film unless Universal Studios green lights it. While Marvel owns the rights of the Hulk and can feature him in an ensemble film, they can't do a solo film because Universal Studios owns Hulk's Distribution rights and right now they are not getting along with Marvel Studios.

 

[Random490]

Marvel Studios can not do a solo Hulk film unless Universal Studios green lights it. While Marvel owns the rights of the Hulk and can feature him in an ensemble film, they can't do a solo film because Universal Studios owns Hulk's Distribution rights and right now they are not getting along with Marvel Studios.

I believe Universal doesn't have a say in green lighting it. The deal is if Marvel makes a Hulk movie then they must offer Universal distribution. If Universal declines then Disney can distribute it themselves but Universal have no reason to decline. So it's all about whether or not Disney is okay with another studio distributing their films. As it stands Disney rather they make movies they have full rights over.

 

[Darth_Spock]

It made the least of any MCU film, and tied for second lowest reviews in the "just barely fresh" range. No, it wasn't good.

We're not talking about Ang Lee's Hulk here so if you didn't like TIH, fine. Just be mindful that your opinion in this case is not a fact. Plus Hulk's presence in the Avengers films only improved his star power.

Yes, it was good. A fresh film is a solid film. That's what the fresh rating signifies. I also has 72% on audiences which is also solid.

Exactly! And that's 71% of and audience that ranges over 700K according to RT!

 

[metaphysician]

You can claim all you want, it isn't going to change that TIH had both the worst box office performance, and the worst reviews, of the entire franchise to date. That is pretty strong objective evidence for "Worst film in the MCU".

At least the Ang Lee film tried.

 

[Darth_Spock]

You can claim all you want, it isn't going to change that TIH had both the worst box office performance, and the worst reviews, of the entire franchise to date. That is pretty strong objective evidence for "Worst film in the MCU".

At least the Ang Lee film tried.

Your opinion not every ones.

Plus Thor Dark World has the lowest MCU review so far, especially with audiences.


Moving on.....

As others have stated if Solo Hulk distribution wasn't still tied up with Universal, Marvel Studios would've made a sequel by now.