Halloween Remake Thread... - Part 1

I really urge anyone who doesnt care for 6 to hunt down the Producer's Cut version. It saves the movie for me, it doesn't make it not supernatural or anything like that, but it is a far better film than the theatrical version.

You do have to ignore the incest though.
 
I've watched H20 a bunch of times. I thought it was a good turn in the right direction, and also it's so short it's easy to watch over and over.
 
I really urge anyone who doesnt care for 6 to hunt down the Producer's Cut version. It saves the movie for me, it doesn't make it not supernatural or anything like that, but it is a far better film than the theatrical version.

You do have to ignore the incest though.

It's actually on youtube, haven't watched it yet though.
 
Saw Halloween Resurrection, it was actually worse than H6. Jesus H. Caviezel. What a waste of Katee Sackhoff. Thank Lucas Jamie Lee Curtis asked to be killed off. And the retconning of H20's finale? Hahahahahahaha.

I'd hunt the H6 Producer's Cut, but I never cared for the direction they took the story to in H5, so f**k that.
 
I'm watching the Rob Zombie remake and I'm sorry but I love what I'm seeing. It's the only Myers-featuring Halloween movie that does something for me. Not as good as Carp's, but my God did he make Myers interesting again.

So far my worst part is when we get to today's Haddonfield, where I was actually reminded it was a remake. Everything before it is solid gold, imo. Carpenter told Zombie to make the film his own and he did, in spades. I hope it's as good till the end.
 
I'm watching the Rob Zombie remake and I'm sorry but I love what I'm seeing. It's the only Myers-featuring Halloween movie that does something for me. Not as good as Carp's, but my God did he make Myers interesting again.

So far my worst part is when we get to today's Haddonfield, where I was actually reminded it was a remake. Everything before it is solid gold, imo. Carpenter told Zombie to make the film his own and he did, in spades. I hope it's as good till the end.


Seriously? Exactly what kind of MJ did you smoke before watching that white trash, redneck piece of trash? And where can I get some for myself?

The first act was pure gold? You must be the alien from American Dad that s**ts blocks of solid gold, because that's exactly what Rob Zombie's Halloween is, pure s**t.

The one and ONLY part of the movie Rob Zombie got right was the deaths of Rob and Linda. He changed things around a little bit to make it his own, but it was essentially the same scene as Carpenter's original. Just with a few minor changes. That's the only good thing I have to say about that entire piece of s**t movie. As for the rest of it, I could eat a box of Alphabits cereal and crap a better script than what RZ came up with.
 
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Seriously? Exactly what kind of MJ did you smoke before watching that white trash, redneck piece of trash? And where can I get some for myself?

The first act was pure gold? You must be the alien from American Dad]/i] that s**ts blocks of solid gold, because that's exactly what Rob Zombie's Halloween is, pure s**t.


Well, having done that myself, I don't mind when a poster trashes a director, or a movie. But you don't seem like a very conversation-friendly fella, so I guess I won't bother to explain.
 
I see what he says about hating most of zombies take and I will admit I left the remake feeling a little deflated because it didnt offer anytihng new. I thought the sessions between young michael and loomis were good but then it got alittle tedious because it went on alittle too long. Then you bring in these 3 actresses who besides the one from halloween 4 were all crap at acting. Also if Rob wanted to do a fresh take then why not just get new characters comepletely so he's not tied to the same story of michael coming after laurie. Why not take it in a new direction where theres no laurie and we the audience arent going down the checklist.
 
Well, having done that myself, I don't mind when a poster trashes a director, or a movie. But you don't seem like a very conversation-friendly fella, so I guess I won't bother to explain.

Gianakin, might I try to convince you to give the Producer's Cut a shot, especially if it is on youtube? I know you didn't care for H5 or the original 6, but at least give it a shot and see if it doesn't make 6 a little better. I think it gives Donald Pleasence a much better send off to the series, and although they couldn't run with the idea at the end, had they chosen to continue the supernatural storyline, it may have been a nice idea.

In case you decide to watch it, I'll spoiler this, but here's a few reasons to give it a shot:
1) Much better character development. I actually felt like Loomis and the other Doctor were good friends, and it makes the things later in the movie a lot more tragic.
2) At least they run with the cult idea. It does more than give a half-assed explanation and cut straight to Michael killing everyone.
3) Actually tones down the gore a bit. Makes it much scarier.
4) Has an original soundtrack, and not the "MTV-sounding" soundtrack the theatrical cut got.
5)Jamie gets an offscreen death, but it is actually much more effective than in the original cut, and she lives longer.
6) Jamie's baby gets an explanation...a really, really disturbing one.

There's more but it really does all factor into a better film. I would almost suggest watching the original cut before watching this just to see all differences, but its not requried and frankly probably isn't worth giving the theatrical anymore of your time.
 
Well, having done that myself, I don't mind when a poster trashes a director, or a movie. But you don't seem like a very conversation-friendly fella, so I guess I won't bother to explain.
Also, would you mind engaging me in this conversation? I'm not a fan of RZ's Halloween films. I've trashed them quite a bit but it doesn't change anything so I'd like to know your thoughts.

For me, I don't care to humanize Michael Myers. I feel like Michael was in a bad situation that many people who kill claim and it didn't impress me. The reason I love the original is because Michael did start human but just snapped. I find it much scarier that one day this innocent child just snapped, and became something pure evil. It may very well still be mental illness, but we don't know that, and it makes us fear it. I don't like they tried to give him powers and all that later, but looking at my favorite films, the original, II, and H20, you can see how he's human but he's completely dead inside now. Only at the end of H20 (ignoring the stupidity that is Resurrection), he maybe reclaims one shred of humanity before Laurie ends him.

I went alittle off topic, but I'm just not a fan of MM having this kind of origin. I didn't much care for the white trash angle either, but Zombie has used it to great effect in his previous films and I loved those. What I hate is it gets taken to the extreme in H2 for no reason and brings that film way down. Also the parts Zombie outright remade just don't hold up to the original. Maybe that is aprt of my problem, the fact I cannot look at Zombie;s film without seeing the original. Regardless, while the first may have a merit here or there, I canot find much nice at all to say regarding Zombie's sequel.
 
Gianakin, might I try to convince you to give the Producer's Cut a shot, especially if it is on youtube? I know you didn't care for H5 or the original 6, but at least give it a shot and see if it doesn't make 6 a little better. I think it gives Donald Pleasence a much better send off to the series, and although they couldn't run with the idea at the end, had they chosen to continue the supernatural storyline, it may have been a nice idea.

Sure, I'll give it a watch. If I can find it.
 
For me, I don't care to humanize Michael Myers. I feel like Michael was in a bad situation that many people who kill claim and it didn't impress me. The reason I love the original is because Michael did start human but just snapped. I find it much scarier that one day this innocent child just snapped, and became something pure evil. It may very well still be mental illness, but we don't know that, and it makes us fear it.

First off, let me say I hate remakes, no matter how good they may turn out to be. I hate the concept and the very idea of them. Narrow-minded? Maybe. Do I give a s**t? Not at all. So, Zombie's Halloween being a remake is a detraction. Had he done something completely different with completely different characters (like marvelman2006 suggested) would've also been a detraction once they decided to slap the Halloween name on it. You want original? Do original titles and launch your own damn franchise. You wanna do the same? You lost me right there. It's a lose-lose situation for me.

Having said that, Zombie went to Carpenter, who told him to make it his own. And that's what Zombie did. The parts that weren't Zombie's own were the worst for me. Humanizing him was a risky idea but Zombie made it work in spades, imo. It was the creepy kid, the white trash angle, his mom was a wonderful character. Trejo's character was also fantastic (still the best way to show he had no humanity anymore). The sessions between Loomis and Myers (and the mother's visits) were the best parts of the movie and some of the best in the entire franchise. They almost reassured you thast things were going to look up, but then Loomis reminded you that was not the case and then... the nurse getting offed.

Carp went for the boogeyman angle and it was perfect. He didn't start out as human, like you said, because Carp never intended to show him as a human. He went POV in the beginning to create the shock value that it's a kid, but you get nothing more. And that's indeed the scary part. So Carp went for the Unknown.

And Zombie didn't. He deconstructed the character and tried to show us what made him tick or not tick, whatever you prefer). The fact that he was a sociopath as opposed to Carp's psychopath, the masks to hide his true emotions and then the lack of them, the fact that what he wanted this time was Laurie's love in a sick way and not just to kill her. You need to humanize him to tell that story.

Now, you and most (from what I gather) didn't want to be told that story. Fair enough. I didn't NEED to be told that story. I was told a boogeyman story in 1978 and, to be honest, I didn't care much for H2. It was fine, sure, whatever, but to me it's always been H1 and then H3, aka Carpenter's vision of making Halloween-related movies every year. I find Michael to work best as a one-off thing, thus making the character set the standars for Voorhees to imitate and not in turn become a Voorhees ripoff himself.

That is why I liked Zombie's remake. I enjoyed it as a Myers story and as an overall movie, 'cause it's the first one after H1 not to be a blandly directed horror flick. There was vision behind Zombie's direction, his music choices, the editing, everything.

And I looooooooooove the new Laurie, both the actress and the sassier characterization. It's 2007. Jamie's Laurie was perfect for 1978. Scout's was perfect (and very fall-in-loveable, if I may add a more personal note) for 2007.

I don't like they tried to give him powers and all that later, but looking at my favorite films, the original, II, and H20, you can see how he's human but he's completely dead inside now.

Well, see, H20 is still illogical when it comes to how H2 ended. But whatever, it was a reunion kind of even so I give it a pass, even if it screams... well, Scream. Had it not been for Curtis' return it would've been as bad as, say, H4-5, imo. It was just fun.

Only at the end of H20 (ignoring the stupidity that is Resurrection), he maybe reclaims one shred of humanity before Laurie ends him.

Pretty sure Myers was faking it and was going to kill Laurie. She saw that and she wised up, deciding to off him instead.

I went alittle off topic, but I'm just not a fan of MM having this kind of origin. I didn't much care for the white trash angle either, but Zombie has used it to great effect in his previous films and I loved those.

I look at it totally, not in separate angles: To humanize him the way he did, the white trash angle was necessary, not just good.

What I hate is it gets taken to the extreme in H2 for no reason and brings that film way down.

Will get back to you on that after I've seen H2 (I was 10 minutes in yesternight). Suffice it to say, I wished that after Michael attacks Laurie after stabbing Annie, I wanted the story to go to completely different places. I hear H2 does just that, so perhaps I'll like it. The no mask angle is something I'm very excited for.

Also the parts Zombie outright remade just don't hold up to the original. Maybe that is aprt of my problem, the fact I cannot look at Zombie;s film without seeing the original.

I agree. And that's why he made them last far less than in the original. And that's why he had 5-8 more minutes after the "It was the boogeyman" line. He wanted to be done with them quickly and it shows. Another aspect I liked, since (like I said) I hate remakes, so the remade parts where the worst to me.

But his choice of music, the editing, the direction and the whole approach was very unique and told me he had a vision, he wasn't a gun for hire, like the people who remade NoES and F13. It was an overall enjoyable movie to me, not just in terms of what it added or crapped on with regard to the franchise.
 
The other day I listened to the commentary for Halloween Resurrection just for ****s and giggles. I think it made me hate that movie even more lol. When they came to the scene where Jamie Lee kisses Micheal one last time, they said that they included that scene so that they could get a nomination at the MTV movie awards for "Best Kiss."
 
Sure, I'll give it a watch. If I can find it.
This is actually a reply to your next post, but it's a big quote so this'll save space :woot:

You make some really good points, and I'm not gonna try and argue your opinion.
I agree on your points on H20, it actually does kind of end up having that 90's "Scream" vibe, but for better or worse I think it is an ok film. The fact Michael lived is pretty unbelievable but it was really supposed to be an anniversary movie, and for that I'm ok with assuming somehow he didn't burn to death and it took him twenty years to heal...somewhere...well enough to track Laurie down again. And you are probably right about Myers still wanting to kill her at the end, but I kind of like to think in those last moments he knew he was going to die, that even he knew his sister wouldn't have any sympathy for him.

The thing on the whole white trash issue for me, I just don't like it on Myers. I know generally there can be nice neighborhoods with one of those types of families, but I am just not a fan of it here. Combined with a few things in H2, it makes Zombie come off as a bit one note when looking at his body of work (and again, I like House of 1000 Corpses and love Devil's Rejects).

I'll wait for you to see H2, but the Loomis of H2 bothers me a lot as well. Specifically that Malcom Mcdowell was one of the few things I ejoyed in the remake, and I just find him severely unlikable in the sequel. Not to mention I'm not a fan of what they do to Myers. The maskless angle sort of hurts when you consider all he did in Part 1 is spend time making masks to hide his face. And then there's the stuff with his mother which.....well I didn't care for it. On Laurie, she was not bad in the first...again you can tell I find H2 much worse and Laurie is no exception to me. I hate Laurie's chracter in H2, even as a trauma survivor, I feel she changes way too much and for the worse.

On music, I'll give you that one for sure. I actually own the soundtrack to RZ's Halloween. The score mixed with some good classic rock really works. Its another one of the good points in my book.


Lastly, did you watch the theatrical or director's cut of Halloween, and which are you watching for H2? reason I ask is I have seen the DC of H2, but never TC, and I hear it makes a lot of difference, with the DC having a different ending and alternate scenes. I can vouch however for the first film, as I saw it in theaters and have seen the DC. Some notable changes include Myers breakout from him beating several cops in the TC to escaping when two guards try to rape another inmate in MYers' room, adding an extra scene of Loomis showing he is still alive near the end, and I know there is an alternate ending but I don't remember if it is added into the DC or was just a feature you could watch it with. There are other differences but its been so long I don't remember them all. .
 
I agree on your points on H20, it actually does kind of end up having that 90's "Scream" vibe, but for better or worse I think it is an ok film. The fact Michael lived is pretty unbelievable but it was really supposed to be an anniversary movie, and for that I'm ok with assuming somehow he didn't burn to death and it took him twenty years to heal...somewhere...well enough to track Laurie down again. And you are probably right about Myers still wanting to kill her at the end, but I kind of like to think in those last moments he knew he was going to die, that even he knew his sister wouldn't have any sympathy for him.

I agree 100% with everything sans the last part, which I respect (what you choose to believe Myers thought those last few moments). Kevin Williamson wrote an initial draft of H20, hence the Scream vibe and there's even a Scream 2 shot playing at one point.

The thing on the whole white trash issue for me, I just don't like it on Myers. I know generally there can be nice neighborhoods with one of those types of families, but I am just not a fan of it here. Combined with a few things in H2, it makes Zombie come off as a bit one note when looking at his body of work (and again, I like House of 1000 Corpses and love Devil's Rejects).

I agree that it's become his schtick (hopefully that's not the case in Lords of Salem), but it certainly fit for Myers to me.

I'll wait for you to see H2, but the Loomis of H2 bothers me a lot as well. Specifically that Malcom Mcdowell was one of the few things I ejoyed in the remake, and I just find him severely unlikable in the sequel.

Heard about Loomis, I dread this. I really liked him in both H1s.

Not to mention I'm not a fan of what they do to Myers. The maskless angle sort of hurts when you consider all he did in Part 1 is spend time making masks to hide his face. And then there's the stuff with his mother which.....well I didn't care for it. On Laurie, she was not bad in the first...again you can tell I find H2 much worse and Laurie is no exception to me. I hate Laurie's chracter in H2, even as a trauma survivor, I feel she changes way too much and for the worse.

I'll tell you on Monday.

Lastly, did you watch the theatrical or director's cut of Halloween, and which are you watching for H2? reason I ask is I have seen the DC of H2, but never TC, and I hear it makes a lot of difference, with the DC having a different ending and alternate scenes. I can vouch however for the first film, as I saw it in theaters and have seen the DC. Some notable changes include Myers breakout from him beating several cops in the TC to escaping when two guards try to rape another inmate in MYers' room, adding an extra scene of Loomis showing he is still alive near the end, and I know there is an alternate ending but I don't remember if it is added into the DC or was just a feature you could watch it with. There are other differences but its been so long I don't remember them all. .

I don't think I have a DC version of H2. If there's the rape from 2 guards scene in the H1 DC, then that's what I saw. I loved that scene, btw.
 
I agree 100% with everything sans the last part, which I respect (what you choose to believe Myers thought those last few moments). Kevin Williamson wrote an initial draft of H20, hence the Scream vibe and there's even a Scream 2 shot playing at one point.



I agree that it's become his schtick (hopefully that's not the case in Lords of Salem), but it certainly fit for Myers to me.



Heard about Loomis, I dread this. I really liked him in both H1s.



I'll tell you on Monday.



I don't think I have a DC version of H2. If there's the rape from 2 guards scene in the H1 DC, then that's what I saw. I loved that scene, btw.

I look forward to your thoughts on H2. Even with my distaste for the remake i'd actually suggest looking for the Theatrical Cut. It may be cut for the MPAA but it has some interesting differences.
Interestingly ive never seen the TC of H2 (the DVD was impossible to find here, the Unrated DC was very common) so I'd actually look forward of you ever end up watching both and comparing them.

One thing to my thoughts on H20, my reasoning for my thought on the end is that it's one of the few scenes we see Michael's eyes. In all the other films it's rare to see them and while they are more prominent in H20 (and completely visible at almost all times in Resurrection) you really see them in that final scene and he just has this look. Although the more I think it probably was a trick but Michael should have known it would never work. Funny enough, I realized I had forgotten that not only do Michael and Loomis burn in Halloween II, but that Michael probably should have been blind depending on where he was stabbed. Although H20 also suggests Loomis survived the explosion for a number of years but was dead by that point.
 
One thing to my thoughts on H20, my reasoning for my thought on the end is that it's one of the few scenes we see Michael's eyes. In all the other films it's rare to see them and while they are more prominent in H20 (and completely visible at almost all times in Resurrection) you really see them in that final scene and he just has this look. Although the more I think it probably was a trick but Michael should have known it would never work.

I get your reasoning. I just think it was a ploy to make us question things ourselves. I rather liked it.
 
Seriously? Exactly what kind of MJ did you smoke before watching that white trash, redneck piece of trash? And where can I get some for myself?

The first act was pure gold? You must be the alien from American Dad that s**ts blocks of solid gold, because that's exactly what Rob Zombie's Halloween is, pure s**t.

The one and ONLY part of the movie Rob Zombie got right was the deaths of Rob and Linda. He changed things around a little bit to make it his own, but it was essentially the same scene as Carpenter's original. Just with a few minor changes. That's the only good thing I have to say about that entire piece of s**t movie. As for the rest of it, I could eat a box of Alphabits cereal and crap a better script than what RZ came up with.
No one will out do JC's Halloween so rehashing the same stuff won't work. Halloween just needed to be rebooted from part 2 and taken from there. Don't even call it 2.5 or number it... just let it be known thats the starting point.

I'll give Zombie credit too. He went out and did his own thing, any rehashing was forced on him by the studio. I actually think he used a lot of his TRex material in making the Halloween movies.
 
I'm watching the Rob Zombie remake and I'm sorry but I love what I'm seeing. It's the only Myers-featuring Halloween movie that does something for me. Not as good as Carp's, but my God did he make Myers interesting again.

So far my worst part is when we get to today's Haddonfield, where I was actually reminded it was a remake. Everything before it is solid gold, imo. Carpenter told Zombie to make the film his own and he did, in spades. I hope it's as good till the end.



I thought Doug Faerch was really good as a young Michael. I think Zombie had some interesting ideas but it's too over the top for most people. Also he has a strange sense of humor and most people don't understand that either.
 
Just an observation from scrolling through, I have no idea why people think the H6 cut fixes the movie...I think it's worse, and makes Michael look pathetic and inept.

I either really like or love 1, 2, 4 and 6 T-cut (I thought it worked quite well as a dark toned slasher regardless of how weird and far out there the story got), 3 is enjoyable...the rest I either dislike or hate.

I especially hate both of Zombie's, and that's coming from someone that loves The Devil's Rejects more than any Halloween movie. His style and ideas were all wrong for this series from the beginning.
 
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Just an observation from scrolling through, I have no idea why people think the H6 cut fixes the movie...I think it's worse, and makes Michael look pathetic and inept.

I either really like or love 1, 2, 4 and 6 T-cut (I thought it worked quite well as a dark toned slasher regardless of how weird and far out there the story got), 3 is enjoyable...the rest I either dislike or hate.

I especially hate both of Zombie's, and that's coming from someone that loves The Devil's Rejects more than any Halloween movie. His style and ideas were all wrong for this series from the beginning.


I'll agree with you there. Although I found House Of 1000 Corpses and Devil's Rejects to be pretty overrated as horror films go. Like I said before, RZ should stick to music and leave film making to people who know what the f**k they're doing, like John Carpenter.

As for preferred movies in the Halloween franchise, I maintain that H1, 2, and H20 are the best. Parts 4 & 5 are kinda fun in a Friday The 13th kinda way, but the wrong direction for the series to go in. Then Curse Of MM and Resurrection are just crap, but still better than RZ's version.

Halloween 3 is okay if you think of it as being Season Of The Witch, and drop Halloween from the title completely. But that's just my opinion.
 

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