misslane38
Superhero
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This thread is a place to discuss Lois Lane across all media and the multiverse.
I edited. Amy's version is basically the first version I've liked.
In my opinion yeah, but it's just my opinion.
Didn't say he wasn't but so bluntly calling him out on it is rude IMO, she could've simply walked off without speaking to him, which would've served to highlight her distaste of him just as effectively.
Yeah that's all she did! She appeared regularly but in a marginal capacity and she added nothing to the story.
Doesn't change the fact that all she did was needing to be rescued and trying to nab superman, totally useless.
Yeah rampant idiocy is right, when her life's mission (apart from trying to marry superman) was to expose him and she still couldn't prove that superman and clark are one and the same despite the fact that she interacts with both on a regular basis.
And she wasn't a challenge to superman, she was merely a welcomed distraction nothing more.
The other common complaint is that Lois is stupid too stupid to realize, for example, that Superman and Clark Kent are one and the same man. People who say that have obviously never read a Superman comic book. For the secret of the Silver Age Superman comics the twist in the formula that greatly differentiates it from the meaner Golden Age comics is that Lois does know that Clark is Superman. But, like a good reporter, she has to prove it first.
An astute observer, she notices the discrepancies in Clarks behaviour. Canny and cunning, she looks for plots and delights in ploys that might prove, once and for all, and beyond a reasonable doubt, that Clark Kent is Superman. And whenever Superman, through an elaborate ruse (as Michael Fleischer liked to say in The Great Superman Book), refutes her proof, she doesnt give up. Shes plucky, that one and unflappable.
Another common retort is, hey, if shes so smart, why does Superman always outsmart her? To those geniuses I just have to say, Hey! Hes Superman! Hes the smartest man on the planet! It has nothing to do with gender politics and everything to do with the fact that the man is a bloody genius!
But if you look carefully at these stories, youll see that Lois often makes Superman sweat. He does not pluck these solutions effortlessly out of his hat. He has to think and react quickly. She puts him to the test, really runs him through the wringer. More-so than Lex Luthor and Braniac, she is truly an adversary to be reckoned with.
And if her plots and ploys are just as likely as Luthors to kill Superman for example, leaving bits of kryptonite around to see if he reacts to it its not because shes insane. Shes driven.
Could careless if you're convinced or not, lois was marginalized and useless in the silver age and you'd realize it too if you weren't wearing your fan-girl tinted glasses but you won't so again I could careless about convincing you.
that's what I'm saying Lois was limited character with little characterization and I never delved into the why of it, just the fact that she was, so thanks for supporting my point.
Let's not get carried away here, these are comicbook characters that make the world alittle more tolerable but that's it. You want an example of women who make a true difference in the world then think mother Teresa or madam currie but I digress...
Had nothing to do with his alienation from lois but rather the shabby writing and the convoluted, linked story lines that went nowhere. Morrison's action comics run was good because it was self contained and so was Snyder's unchained and some of Greg pak's stand alone arcs (and the batman/superman stuff) were pretty solid IMO.
Again due to bad writing nothing more.
From "time to time" LOL!! She is a walking damsel she was an insult to feminists everywhere.
No lois is important for the superman mythology because she's the love interest, the "girlfriend", after all wasn't that the title of her "best selling series" as you put it.
The concept of lois lane is iconic, her portrayal in a large amount of story lines isn't.
Calm down seriously, You're gonna have an aneurysm. I don't need to support anything, I like the superman/WW pairing and that's all there is to it.
As for putting lois down, well I can't help it if the character is often written as a joke.
Yeah, I know. What I don't understand is why you defensively accused me of trying to force you to have a different opinion simply because I shared what romance the vast majority of Superman writers prefer.
It's rude for a woman to call a man out for handing her over to brutish sexual predator?! She couldn't very well walk away from Clark in that moment because she wasn't free to do anything she wanted. That's the point! Lois was forced to dance with a man who wasn't her date.
You're still not getting it. You said "that's all she did" in response to an image of Clark holding up a headline that read "Lois Lane Saves Superman," so if you say "that's all she did" during the Silver Age, then you are saying that Lois Lane saved Superman all the time during the Silver Age. Lois Lane did some amazing things during the Silver Age, but she was not always saving Superman. Your description of the Silver Age as a time when Lois Lane was marginalized is inaccurate.
It does change something. It should change the way you evaluate the character. If the character was limited by the sexism of her creators and the society in which they lived, then it changes how one calibrates one's assessment of the character. Lois Lane cannot be anti-feminist character for playing the role of love interest or damsel if those were the only roles allowed to her. It's like criticizing a Jane Austen character like Elizabeth Bennet for being at the center of a love story when that was what was expected of a young woman during Regency era Britain. Powerful men like King Henry VIII of England is perhaps best known for his tumultuous love life and obsession with finding the perfect mate, and it's because marriage and children were an important vehicles of power during his reign. You cannot ignore context. If you ignore context, then you are perpetuating the same sexism that limited Lois Lane in the first place. Limiting what Lois Lane can be and who she can love now because of how she was written then keeps her shackled to a sexist era and mindset that has come and gone.
It's not idiocy if she was right. Lois did figure out that Clark Kent was Superman, and Superman's efforts to put her off the idea never worked and had to become more and more elaborate. If Superman had been successful at disabusing Lois of her theory that Clark Kent and Superman were the same man, then Lois would have given up the idea. She never did.
She was absolutely a challenge. I'll just quote from this great blog post on the topic:
Don't lie. You've already spent plenty of time trying to convince me. If you didn't care about convincing me, then you wouldn't have replied to my previous post. I own and have read the recent Tim Hanley book entitled Investigating Lois Lane: The Turbulent History of the Daily Planet's Ace Reporter, and your conclusions do not correlate well with what I read. Having reread a bunch of Silver Age comics recently, I also didn't detect Lois Lane having a smaller role in them than she does in today's comic books.
I am not supporting your point. Your point seems to be that because Lois Lane was a victim of sexist writing, she is therefore a character that should be forever criticized and dismissed. That the character she was back in the sexist Silver Age should define and control the possibilities of the character today. Your point also seemed to be that Lois was alone a victim of this sexism when, in fact, Wonder Woman also struggled as a character during the same era. She was so robbed of her power and what made the character feminist that Gloria Steinem put Wonder Woman on the cover of her feminist magazine in protest.
Yeah, I never suggested that Lois Lane was as influential as real women. What I said is that both Lois and Diana emerged out of the women's movement as more empowered characters. I did not say that their empowerment in fiction generated significant and marked changes in the real world.
All of the arcs to which you are referring are the ones that did not marginalize Lois or her relationship with Clark/Superman. Only Greg Pak's stories marginalized Lois,but that's because DC literally would not let him include her in Action Comics. Too bad most of Pak's good writing was wasted on lame crossovers. The reason why New 52 included so many convoluted crossover storylines was because his distance from his supporting cast meant that Superman had to spend more time with Batman and Wonder Woman. When you start adding more and more superheroes into a story, the more you have to craft a storyline big enough to challenge them. That's how the big dumb events kept happening, and each of those events were made more ridiculous and convoluted by coming up with stupid things for Lois to do. She was controlled by Brainiac during "Doomed" and outed Superman's secret identity in "Truth," for example.
Yes, but the biggest shift from bad writing to good writing was accompanied by a shift from a Superman/Wonder Woman romance to a Superman/Lois marriage. So if the writers and creators made a decision to "Rebirth" Superman to generate better stories and sales, and their primary method of facilitating that change was to change Superman's romantic status quo, then it's pretty telling what lessons were learned from the New 52 experiment.
The fact that you continue to insist that a woman requiring physical help means that she is an insult to feminists is what is insulting to feminists. No feminist would ever argue that a woman must be strong in order for her to be empowered and equal to a man. Because there are other forms of strength and other ways to make a difference.
It was the title.
That was the title her sexist backward creators gave her. For you to define her the same way they defined her makes you as sexist as they were back then. You are not allowing the character to escape from that backward period despite the fact that it comprised only a quarter of her entire existence. Lois Lane has never been just a love interest. Her primary role is love interest, but that is not the only thing that defines her. Throughout the Golden Age, Bronze Age, Post-Crisis, and New 52/Rebirth eras, Lois Lane has been both love interest and journalist. Animated adaptations like the Max Fleischer shorts and Timm's animated series all focus Lois primarily as a journalist. Lois and Clark: The New Adventures of Superman is a show all about journalism. Lois and Clark spend each episode working together to make a difference. Lois on Smallville had several arcs that had nothing to do with being Clark's love interest. She wasn't even his love interest for four out of the seven years she was on the show! Instead, Lois worked in politics and as a journalist. She even got distracted planning her wedding because she was investigating the Legion of Doom!
I see you nicely sidestepped acknowledging your transparent sexism and hypocrisy. You claimed I misrepresented your reasoning for supporting the SM/WW pairing. You suggested I was wrong to assume that you were defending your romantic preference for Superman by putting Lois down to prop Diana up. You the proceeded to say that you simply like Superman and Wonder Woman more because Diana is more deserving. That is a sexist rationale. If you number one defense for a SM/WW romance involves putting down another female character, then that is sexist. You don't need to support anything, but it is difficult to accept your support of SM/WW when you cannot explain why you like them in any way that doesn't involve criticizing another female character. And, if one of your go-to arguments in favor of Diana over Lois is the former's status as a feminist icon, then you are a hypocrite. Because Diana's status as a feminist icon is exactly what leads her to embrace Lois Lane as her equally empowered sister.
More often than not Lois doesn't date "regular" guys. Those are the versions I dislike.
But other versions, especially Donner's pisses me off. On top of Clark being a massive idiot Lois could give to ****s about him. It's the comically overpowered alien she swoons over.
Wasn't defensive, again you need to stop reading too much into things and take a breather.
yeah Lois as rude plain and simple and the guy was a just a jerk not a 'sexual predator' who I imagine Lois could've handled on her lonesome but she still needed the man to stand up for her.....pathetic!
No I was right, she did nothing and added nothing.
She's was (and often is) a useless character and that evaluation will stand.
She was (and often is) an idiot if her entire life revolves around revealing who superman is and yet still can't prove such an obvious fact.
No, Lex, Brainiac, Mongul, Faora (in her first appearance on action comics), Galactic Golum, Metallo, Bizarro, Parasite and enlarging the bottled city were challenges to him, lois was a comedy distraction that the writers came up with to make things alittle more fun.
No lie, I respond to your post because your posts are the funniest things I've read on these forums in a long while!! You take everything and react to everything so seriously that just makes me chuckle. You are - like your favorite character - a welcome distraction.
You most certainly supported my points and I thank you for it.
Oh no, you very clearly made it sound like lois and WW changed the world somehow, which is a statement I expect from such a hyper-reactive fangirl.
And to me and most fans Pak's run was one of the superman runs in the new 52, partially because he focused on a far more interesting female character named lana lang rather than lois lame.
No it wasn't, the largest shift was turning superman into a moody, emo outsider just like Snyder did and the result was failure.
No, idolizing a character who isn't much more than the damsel girlfriend like what you're doing is an insult to feminists. But hey if you're gonna be predictable and call me sexist every time I say something you don't like then by all means continue.
Oh again with the sexist card, you're disappointing me, I thought you were capable of a semblance of an intelligent discussion but apparently yer not, oh well. As for your idol, well the writers tried to give her something to do but in the end she just ends up being the eye candy that got into trouble and required the man to show up and save her and rinse and repeat, useless!
Calm down, just breath and all will be ok. You're just angry because I pointed out what a useless character your fictional idol is and personally I would like my superman to be with someone better like Diana or even Lana or maybe Lori or Lyla lorrel, man the choices are endless.