The President Obama Thread: "Screw You Thread Manager" Edition

[Thundercrack85]

I can't see Hillary Clinton running, much less wining. She's already lost once, and come 2016, voters will want new faces.

I do find it an interesting phenomena that people refer to her as "Hillary". Shows she still isn't out of her husband's shadow.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Longshot but I am hoping for Elizabeth Warren, my money is guessing Hillary will win

Warren is running for the Senate in 2012 and would be far more detrimental to the Obama ticket. Obama doesn't need another divisive figure who is exactly like him, a Harvard type professor who happens to be extremely liberal from one of the Democratic progressive bastions of the United States.

What Obama needs is someone who would compliment him, not the exact same thing as him. It's why I think that Bob McDonnell would be the best choice for Mitt Romney on the GOP ticket because he compliments him very well and provides a lot more benefits too. Joe Biden was meant to do this, but it turns out that the guy is a total boob as Vice President. Hillary Clinton would be a great asset for Obama, especially in states like Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Michigan where Obama is having trouble with white working class voters. Mark Warner, Evan Bayh, Jim Webb, Sherrod Brown, Mike Bebe, and a few others would be better assets for Obama.

 

[Marx]

I can't see Hillary Clinton running, much less wining. She's already lost once, and come 2016, voters will want new faces.

I do find it an interesting phenomena that people refer to her as "Hillary". Shows she still isn't out of her husband's shadow.

I am a huge Clinton supporter. (President Clinton AND Hillary Clinton.) Referring to her as Hillary gives her her own identity. Referring to her as Mrs. Clinton or Bill's wife would show that she "still isn't out of her husband's shadow". She emerged from her husband's shadow a while ago.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

I don't see why Obama would want to jail or kill me, so I don't have a problem with the law. The only people who need to worry are ones who violate the law enough that they use it.

I hate to resort to Godwin's Law, but that reminds me of the old warning...

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
​

Sure, right now it's just brown people with funny Muslim-sounding names being imprisoned for years without charges, targeted in drone strikes and executed without trial. But eventually the precedent set in these cases will be used to justify clampdowns on dissent in the United States. Even with the Occupy movement, we already saw that domestic security forces have no problem using brutal tactics on non-violent protesters.

 

[hippie_hunter]

I am a huge Clinton supporter. (President Clinton AND Hillary Clinton.) Referring to her as Hillary gives her her own identity. Referring to her as Mrs. Clinton or Bill's wife would show that she "still isn't out of her husband's shadow". She emerged from her husband's shadow a while ago.

Yeah, she moved out of Bill's shadow when she was in the Senate.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I am a huge Clinton supporter. (President Clinton AND Hillary Clinton.) Referring to her as Hillary gives her her own identity. Referring to her as Mrs. Clinton or Bill's wife would show that she "still isn't out of her husband's shadow". She emerged from her husband's shadow a while ago.

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. And she might as well. Remember that outburst in Africa?

But then her husband is the main reason she even has a political career. I doubt the first lady of Arkansas could just take a New York senate seat on a whim.

 

[Marx]

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree. And she might as well. Remember that outburst in Africa?

But then her husband is the main reason she even has a political career. I doubt the first lady of Arkansas could just take a New York senate seat on a whim.

...how she got her start is irrelevent. (And she became a senator because the public voted her into it.)

The fact that she is widely known to everyone as HILLARY proves that she is her own person and not in her husband's shadow. I'm not quite sure how that's disputable in any way.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

Hillary is very much her own person now. Although her marriage to Bill was certainly instrumental in starting her political career, after her time in the Senate, her strong presidential campaign in 2008, and her time as Secretary of State, it's clear that at this point Hillary Clinton is a powerful political player on her own, regardless of last name. She commands respect - even a lot of Republicans now approve of her performance as Secretary of State.

Too bad she's a warmongering corporate snake. I remember very well her threat in a debate that the U.S. could "obliterate" Iran.

 

[Thundercrack85]

...how she got her start is irrelevent. (And she became a senator because the public voted her into it.)

The fact that she is widely known to everyone as HILLARY proves that she is her own person and not in her husband's shadow. I'm not quite sure how that's disputable in any way.

Oh come on, you don't really think that if she wasn't a first lady of the United States that she could just move to New York (only months before the election) and easily win?

I think this may be a cultural difference (though I'm pretty well acquainted with American culture, so I am somewhat skeptical). But in Europe being called by your first name, instead of your last name, because someone else in your family is better know, is usually a sign that you are in someone's shadow. She does seem to have a little complex about it too.

Though I'll agree that she has her own identity. She just got it riding her husband's coattails.

 

[hippie_hunter]

Yeah, she did ride on her husband's coattails, but she managed to still make something out of herself using that opportunity. It's a lot more than what most people do with the opportunities that are given to them.

 

[Marx]

Oh come on, you don't really think that if she wasn't a first lady of the United States that she could just move to New York (only months before the election) and easily win?

I think this may be a cultural difference (though I'm pretty well acquainted with American culture, so I am somewhat skeptical). But in Europe being called by your first name, instead of your last name, because someone else in your family is better know, is usually a sign that you are in someone's shadow. She does seem to have a little complex about it too.

Though I'll agree that she has her own identity. She just got it riding her husband's coattails.

I'm not arguing how she got her start. You made a statement saying that she is "still in her husband's shadow" and you couldn't be more wrong.

As far as the part I bolded goes, we'll have to chalk it up to a cultural difference because being referred to by your first name in the states does not mean you are in someone else's shadow.

 

[Matt]

I think he's right. She is still in his shadow as she is not his equal nor will she ever be. Who will be remembered more? Bill Clinton, the President of the United States or a one term senator and one term secretary of state? Hil-dog will be remembered mostly as a first lady who went on to the Senate and SecState. The fact that it is the First Lady that she will be remembered as first and foremost shows that she is still in and always will be in the shadow of her husband's legacy.

 

[Quetzal]

I personally consider Clinton one of the greatest modern presidents we have had and I like Marx, would love to see Hillary run again. I would vote for her within a heartbeat but she has said many times she would not run again. I think she wont, but if she were to, she could win the nomination and likely win the Presidency if the Dems in turn acted in 4 years of gridlock like these last couple of years.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

I think he's right. She is still in his shadow as she is not his equal nor will she ever be. Who will be remembered more? Bill Clinton, the President of the United States or a one term senator and one term secretary of state? Hil-dog will be remembered mostly as a first lady who went on to the Senate and SecState. The fact that it is the First Lady that she will be remembered as first and foremost shows that she is still in and always will be in her husband's legacy.

That is a sad commentary on the male-dominated power structure that still exists to this date in American politics. While I can sympathize with Hillary on a feminist basis, on a class basis she's made it clear that she works for the 1%.

 

[Matt]

I personally consider Clinton one of the greatest modern presidents we have had and I like Marx, would love to see Hillary run again. I would vote for her within a heartbeat but she has said many times she would not run again. I think she wont, but if she were to, she could win the nomination and likely win the Presidency if the Dems in turn acted in 4 years of gridlock like these last couple of years.

I used to think Clinton was a great president. Then I read One Market Under God. Clinton basically carried on the same pro-corporate policies as Ronald Reagan with a different coat of paint. Basically our entire economic state and the downfall of the labor workforce and the middle class can be traced back to Bill Clinton's policies. Bill Clinton sold out the middle class more than any president since Reagan, all while telling them that he was their friend.

That is a sad commentary on the male-dominated power structure that still exists to this date in American politics. While I can sympathize with Hillary on a feminist basis, on a class basis she's made it clear that she works for the 1%.

The thing is, Hillary made that choice. She agreed to enter and continue her sham of a marriage all so she could use her husband's name to get her own bit of power. It works both ways. She can't take advantage of the name Clinton to build her own legacy then complain when that legacy is in the shadow of Clinton.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

I used to think Clinton was a great president. Then I read One Market Under God. Clinton basically carried on the same pro-corporate policies as Ronald Reagan with a different coat of paint. Basically our entire economic state and the downfall of the labor workforce and the middle class can be traced back to Bill Clinton's policies. Bill Clinton sold out the middle class more than any president since Reagan, all while telling them that he was their friend.



The thing is, Hillary made that choice. She agreed to enter and continue her sham of a marriage all so she could use her husband's name to get her own bit of power. It works both ways. She can't take advantage of the name Clinton to build her own legacy then complain when that legacy is in the shadow of Clinton.

You are on fire.

 

[Crazy Quilt]

I used to think Clinton was a great president. Then I read One Market Under God. Clinton basically carried on the same pro-corporate policies as Ronald Reagan with a different coat of paint. Basically our entire economic state and the downfall of the labor workforce and the middle class can be traced back to Bill Clinton's policies. Bill Clinton sold out the middle class more than any president since Reagan, all while telling them that he was their friend.

This. Reagan couldn't have gotten away with NAFTA, gutting welfare and repealing Glass-Steagall. It took a Democratic President to do those things.

 

[SV Fan]

This. Reagan couldn't have gotten away with NAFTA, gutting welfare and repealing Glass-Steagall. It took a Democratic President to do those things.

Along with the Iran War and Bush Tax Cuts, Glass-Steagall is in the top 3 reason why we are where we are. Sadly the way politics work now is the higher you get up, the more likely the candidate was bought and paid for by big business.

Sort of sad that it basically comes down to what is the lesser of 2 evils.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

This. Reagan couldn't have gotten away with NAFTA, gutting welfare and repealing Glass-Steagall. It took a Democratic President to do those things.

The same way it took Nixon to go to China, or a black Democratic president to begin cutting Social Security.

 

[Axl Van Sixx]

Chavez: "Obama is a Total Fraud"

The president of the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela, Hugo Chavez, replied to statements said by his counterpart from the United States, Barack Obama, who criticized the sovereign relationship between Venezuela and Cuba, among others.

Chavez asked Obama to take care of poor people in his own country, who since the arrival of winter have endured cuts in social assistance to pay for in home heating.

"Obama is a total fraud. He cut social assistance for home heating oil for the poor," Chavez said during a cabinet meeting at the Miraflores Presidential Palace.

Given that situation, President Chavez said he had held a conversation with Oil Minister Rafael Ramirez so as to increase the support of Venezuela's CITGO to poor people who endure temperatures below zero during the winter in the United States.

According to Chavez, Obama is just looking for votes by criticising others and Chavez called on him to work with "the good people" of the United States.

"Obama is just about to lose the elections and with these criticisms [of Venezuela] he just wants to win some votes. You are a fraud, a total fraud. If I could be a candidate in the United States, I would beat you. I would win 80-20, I would beat you with [the votes] of all the good people you have there," Chavez said.

Go Chavez!

 

[Thundercrack85]

People living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

 

[Chris Wallace]

If internet ettiquette is all it takes to be a politician, I should consider running for office.

As should we all.

 

[Arc-Light]

Chavez: "Obama is a Total Fraud"

Go Chavez!

Wow now you are showing your hypocrisy....

 

[hippie_hunter]

Chavez: "Obama is a Total Fraud"

Go Chavez!

The only way that Chavez would beat Obama is by stealing the election the way he does in Venezuela. That man really needs to learn how to shut up sometimes.

 

[Crazy Quilt]

The only way that Chavez would beat Obama is by stealing the election the way he does in Venezuela. That man really needs to learn how to shut up sometimes.

Or maybe the CIA could try to depose Obama like they did Chavez.

"It's not about religion, Muslims aren't the only ones who oppose your imperialism.
Is Hugo Chavez a Muslim? Nah...didn't think so.
Is Castro a Muslim? Nah...didn't think so."