Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Season 1 Episode 5 "Girl in the Flower Dress" Discussion

[Dark Raven]

Anyone else expecting some connection between Scorch and Radioactive man?

Only as much connection as there is between the Human Torch, Firestar, Firebird, Firelord, Sunfire or any other fire character and the Radioactive Man.

 

[Destructus86]

Any idea who the clairvoyant is?

 

[Dark Raven]

Any idea who the clairvoyant is?

Well if I could see into the future to tell you, then I'd say it was me.

 

[BOOZEMAN]

Let me forward this by saying that I am a long time Marvel junkie. Love the comics, love the movies, desperately WANT to love this show but...

I really can't understand why Marvel is wasting such a great opportunity to try out new characters that could go on to be new movie franchises. Why couldn't they have re-tooled the script a bit and made "Scorch" into "Sunfire" or some existing character? Why Couldn't the first Extremis subject from the Pilot have been an existing character? Sure, "because those characters in the show died" is a valid argument, but they didn't have to die. That's what I meant by re-tooling. Look at Smallville and Arrow. Those show have a universe generally grounded in reality and they actually care about their fan base enough to throw them some cool little geek moments like when Arthur Curry shows up or the mysterious assassin turns out to be Deadshot. Quite frankly, other than Coulson and May I really couldn't care less about the rest of the team. I agree that they might just need time to gel with the audience, but...there isn't going to BE an audience if you don't give them a reason to keep tuning in. The whole Extremis thing is cool, but there's got to be more than that out there for S.H.I.E.L.D. to investigate. Hell, Iron Man took care of that in that little movie thing that he had going on a few months back. Give me HYDRA!!! At least give me some bad guys in green body armor and red goggles so that I can pretend it's HYDRA. Give me some low rent bad guys like Batroc the Leaper, Gorgon, or Scorpio. The team ,as it stands right now, CAN'T carry this show. I want it to keep going on and every new episode that comes out just frustrates me even more. Joss Whedon's name can only keep a show alive for so long. Look at Firefly. That was an AMAZINGLY GOOD show and it got cancelled. This show needs some emergency damage control bad assery injected into it soon or it's going to be another failed series that could have been great.

 

[Eddie]

Let me forward this by saying that I am a long time Marvel junkie. Love the comics, love the movies, desperately WANT to love this show but...

I really can't understand why Marvel is wasting such a great opportunity to try out new characters that could go on to be new movie franchises. Why couldn't they have re-tooled the script a bit and made "Scorch" into "Sunfire" or some existing character? Why Couldn't the first Extremis subject from the Pilot have been an existing character? Sure, "because those characters in the show died" is a valid argument, but they didn't have to die. That's what I meant by re-tooling. Look at Smallville and Arrow. Those show have a universe generally grounded in reality and they actually care about their fan base enough to throw them some cool little geek moments like when Arthur Curry shows up or the mysterious assassin turns out to be Deadshot. Quite frankly, other than Coulson and May I really couldn't care less about the rest of the team. I agree that they might just need time to gel with the audience, but...there isn't going to BE an audience if you don't give them a reason to keep tuning in. The whole Extremis thing is cool, but there's got to be more than that out there for S.H.I.E.L.D. to investigate. Hell, Iron Man took care of that in that little movie thing that he had going on a few months back. Give me HYDRA!!! At least give me some bad guys in green body armor and red goggles so that I can pretend it's HYDRA. Give me some low rent bad guys like Batroc the Leaper, Gorgon, or Scorpio. The team ,as it stands right now, CAN'T carry this show. I want it to keep going on and every new episode that comes out just frustrates me even more. Joss Whedon's name can only keep a show alive for so long. Look at Firefly. That was an AMAZINGLY GOOD show and it got cancelled. This show needs some emergency damage control bad assery injected into it soon or it's going to be another failed series that could have been great.

... but the two characters you used as examples are comic characters.

To be fair, they're significantly different from their comic counterparts. Comic Mike Peterson was an obscure character connected to Slapstick, of all people. Comic Scorch... apparently there are a few of them. There are multiple Scorchers as well. None of them share the same real name as MCU Scorch, but that's nothing new for the MCU. The same thing happened to Whiplash and the Mandarin. Also, there's a reasonable chance that Skye is a super. Notice how much of the redacted info on her is about medical stuff.

 

[iamlegend]

Let me forward this by saying that I am a long time Marvel junkie. Love the comics, love the movies, desperately WANT to love this show but...

I really can't understand why Marvel is wasting such a great opportunity to try out new characters that could go on to be new movie franchises. Why couldn't they have re-tooled the script a bit and made "Scorch" into "Sunfire" or some existing character? Why Couldn't the first Extremis subject from the Pilot have been an existing character? Sure, "because those characters in the show died" is a valid argument, but they didn't have to die. That's what I meant by re-tooling. Look at Smallville and Arrow. Those show have a universe generally grounded in reality and they actually care about their fan base enough to throw them some cool little geek moments like when Arthur Curry shows up or the mysterious assassin turns out to be Deadshot. Quite frankly, other than Coulson and May I really couldn't care less about the rest of the team. I agree that they might just need time to gel with the audience, but...there isn't going to BE an audience if you don't give them a reason to keep tuning in. The whole Extremis thing is cool, but there's got to be more than that out there for S.H.I.E.L.D. to investigate. Hell, Iron Man took care of that in that little movie thing that he had going on a few months back. Give me HYDRA!!! At least give me some bad guys in green body armor and red goggles so that I can pretend it's HYDRA. Give me some low rent bad guys like Batroc the Leaper, Gorgon, or Scorpio. The team ,as it stands right now, CAN'T carry this show. I want it to keep going on and every new episode that comes out just frustrates me even more. Joss Whedon's name can only keep a show alive for so long. Look at Firefly. That was an AMAZINGLY GOOD show and it got cancelled. This show needs some emergency damage control bad assery injected into it soon or it's going to be another failed series that could have been great.

Smallville and Arrow can't be compared to this show in any way, shape or form. They've each existed in their own universes. This show is just one small cog in a massive one.

 

[BOOZEMAN]

... but the two characters you used as examples are comic characters.

To be fair, they're significantly different from their comic counterparts. Comic Mike Peterson was an obscure character connected to Slapstick, of all people. Comic Scorch... apparently there are a few of them. There are multiple Scorchers as well. None of them share the same real name as MCU Scorch, but that's nothing new for the MCU. The same thing happened to Whiplash and the Mandarin. Also, there's a reasonable chance that Skye is a super. Notice how much of the redacted info on her is about medical stuff.

Fair enough.

Allow me to rephrase, on that note. Why couldn't they be existing characters that people care about or have heard of.t:

I was a little intrigued by the last five minutes of this episode. I'm thinking that Skye might be some sort of "technomancer" or whatever you call somebody whose powers allow them to interact with technology on a superhuman level. That could be interesting. Perhaps she's one of the dozen or so illegitimate children of Tony Stark that have to be milling around the Marvel universe. Hell, maybe the entire team is comprised of illegitimate pseudo-Starks.

 

[Eddie]

Fair enough.

Allow me to rephrase, on that note. Why couldn't they be existing characters that people care about or have heard of.t:

I was a little intrigued by the last five minutes of this episode. I'm thinking that Skye might be some sort of "technomancer" or whatever you call somebody whose powers allow them to interact with technology on a superhuman level. That could be interesting. Perhaps she's one of the dozen or so illegitimate children of Tony Stark that have to be milling around the Marvel universe. Hell, maybe the entire team is comprised of illegitimate pseudo-Starks.

My money's still on her being Jessica Drew. As for other characters people actually care about... how dare you! Everyone loves Slapstick's, buddy!t:

Seriously, though, I don't think you'll have to wait for too long. There's been some speculation that Zzzax could be the killer in the next episode. We also know from this episode that S.H.I.E.L.D. is keeping tabs on more than a few supers. Oh, and Maria Hill mentioned unregistered gifted in the Pilot. This implies that the supers under S.H.I.E.L.D. watch are registered. Maria Hill registering supers... sound familiar?

 

[Mysteryman]

Yeah, but CW Started with the incident that led to the the law being enacted .
If they are building up to it ,
The law seems to ALREADY be enforced without much problem.
This might be more of a slow burn toward CW.

 

[Guard82]

That mysterious guy in prison whom Raina meets with in the episode's final scene reminds me somewhat of the Mad Thinker from the comics. The actor playing the guy in prison spoke with a very pronounced, logical, cold tone of voice that reminds me the way the Mad Thinker often speaks in the comics. Also, in the comics, the Thinker frequently masterminded crimes from inside prison, which this character apparently is about to do by contacting the so-called "Clairvoyant" for Raina and Centipede.

I wonder if this guy may be the Mad Thinker, or perhaps a character based in part on the Mad Thinker.

 

[Eddie]

Yeah, but CW Started with the incident that led to the the law being enacted .
If they are building up to it ,
The law seems to ALREADY be enforced without much problem.
This might be more of a slow burn toward CW.

I don't think we'll see Civil War for quite some time (if it even happens), but I could see AoS set up something resembling the Initiative teams.

 

[JJmelo]

Let me forward this by saying that I am a long time Marvel junkie. Love the comics, love the movies, desperately WANT to love this show but...

I really can't understand why Marvel is wasting such a great opportunity to try out new characters that could go on to be new movie franchises. Why couldn't they have re-tooled the script a bit and made "Scorch" into "Sunfire" or some existing character? Why Couldn't the first Extremis subject from the Pilot have been an existing character? Sure, "because those characters in the show died" is a valid argument, but they didn't have to die. That's what I meant by re-tooling. Look at Smallville and Arrow. Those show have a universe generally grounded in reality and they actually care about their fan base enough to throw them some cool little geek moments like when Arthur Curry shows up or the mysterious assassin turns out to be Deadshot. Quite frankly, other than Coulson and May I really couldn't care less about the rest of the team. I agree that they might just need time to gel with the audience, but...there isn't going to BE an audience if you don't give them a reason to keep tuning in. The whole Extremis thing is cool, but there's got to be more than that out there for S.H.I.E.L.D. to investigate. Hell, Iron Man took care of that in that little movie thing that he had going on a few months back. Give me HYDRA!!! At least give me some bad guys in green body armor and red goggles so that I can pretend it's HYDRA. Give me some low rent bad guys like Batroc the Leaper, Gorgon, or Scorpio. The team ,as it stands right now, CAN'T carry this show. I want it to keep going on and every new episode that comes out just frustrates me even more. Joss Whedon's name can only keep a show alive for so long. Look at Firefly. That was an AMAZINGLY GOOD show and it got cancelled. This show needs some emergency damage control bad assery injected into it soon or it's going to be another failed series that could have been great.

We did get a nod to HYDRA, AIM is clearly involved, we got Graviton's origin story, we've seen both Fury and Hill make appearances and we get nods to the movies all the time. I don't see how changing the guys name to Sunfire would make anything better. I personally love the show and what they're doing with it.

The reason they don't pack the show full of established comic characters like Arrow is because it is so connected to the movies. Arrow can do literally whatever they want with whoever they want with out worrying about messing things up down the line. If AoS introduces a character in the show that a director or producer wants in a future movie than they have to be careful as to not portray that character in the wrong light. Remember it is 2 separate teams working on the show and the films (Feige has said he has no influence over the show, that's Loeb's job). In order to keep every single person on both teams in the loop at all times would be a very daunting task. Its better to not include them than to have them show up and screw up continuity or stick a future director with a version of a character they don't like.

 

[JB-the-Hunter]

Smallville and Arrow can't be compared to this show in any way, shape or form. They've each existed in their own universes. This show is just one small cog in a massive one.

This is what people need to understand. Any character that gets introduced in this show will have to be cast correctly and portrayed correctly or that's it for them in the MCU. That's why we've only had D-listers so far. They have to start off safe until the show establishes itself.

 

[Mr. Dent]

Considering most people watching this show have probably never actually read one of the comics in their lives it's no surprise they're "upset" over comic characters not being used...you know, the big name ones they know through second hand.

Let me forward this by saying that I am a long time Marvel junkie. Love the comics, love the movies, desperately WANT to love this show but...

I really can't understand why Marvel is wasting such a great opportunity to try out new characters that could go on to be new movie franchises. Why couldn't they have re-tooled the script a bit and made "Scorch" into "Sunfire" or some existing character? Why Couldn't the first Extremis subject from the Pilot have been an existing character? Sure, "because those characters in the show died" is a valid argument, but they didn't have to die. That's what I meant by re-tooling. Look at Smallville and Arrow. Those show have a universe generally grounded in reality and they actually care about their fan base enough to throw them some cool little geek moments like when Arthur Curry shows up or the mysterious assassin turns out to be Deadshot. Quite frankly, other than Coulson and May I really couldn't care less about the rest of the team. I agree that they might just need time to gel with the audience, but...there isn't going to BE an audience if you don't give them a reason to keep tuning in. The whole Extremis thing is cool, but there's got to be more than that out there for S.H.I.E.L.D. to investigate. Hell, Iron Man took care of that in that little movie thing that he had going on a few months back. Give me HYDRA!!! At least give me some bad guys in green body armor and red goggles so that I can pretend it's HYDRA. Give me some low rent bad guys like Batroc the Leaper, Gorgon, or Scorpio. The team ,as it stands right now, CAN'T carry this show. I want it to keep going on and every new episode that comes out just frustrates me even more. Joss Whedon's name can only keep a show alive for so long. Look at Firefly. That was an AMAZINGLY GOOD show and it got cancelled. This show needs some emergency damage control bad assery injected into it soon or it's going to be another failed series that could have been great.

Does it matter? Why would they have made him Sunfire when they killed the character off? Would you have been happy if they introduced Sunfire just for them to kill him off in this episode? And as far as we know Marvel can't use Sunfire because he's a mutant and is almost exclusively connected to the X-Men outside of Big Hero 6. Think about this stuff before asking questions like that.

And really, REALLY? Are you really paying that little attention to what's actually going on and focusing so much on how they're not using enough from the comics for you to notice that the people who are behind all this **** ARE HYDRA, or at the very least AIM? It's blatantly obvious. They're not even trying to hide it from people who have read the comics with all the hints they've dropped. If you really love the comics as much as you say then you should have been able to pick up on the fact HYDRA/AIM ARE the main villains of this show. They're using ****ing Extremis, the drug AIM created for ****s sake.

As for characters in this show showing up in the movies, you might as well get that out your mind now. It's not happening nor does it need to. The movies do their thing, the show does its thing. We don't have too see random D-List characters in the movies from this show just to have some kind of shallow gratification that would feel very shoehorned and out of place. There are other, more sophisticated and appropriate ways, which they are doing btw, to connect the show and movies. As for how, it's not that hard to see if you know what's going on in the films.

And Batroc the Leaper is in Captain America 2 and Marvel can't use Scorpio because he's a Spider-Man villain.

So much wrong with this post as criticism of the show.

 

[Xeno]

Scorpio is a SHIELD/Avengers villain associated with Zodiac, which has already been mentioned in the Agent Carter short. The original Scorpio was Jake Fury, Nick's villainous brother.

The Scorpion is a Spider-Man villain. They are two separate characters.

 

[Zarex]

And Batroc the Leaper is in Captain America 2 and Marvel can't use Scorpio because he's a Spider-Man villain.

I think that out of the CA:TWS cast, Georges St. Pierre's Batroc has the best chance of showing up on AOS either before or after the film opening. Georges is looking to transition into a full time acting career, and I don't think his fight with Cap (is Cap sky diving to engage him at the start of the trailer?) is connected to the "SHIELD coup" main plot. A mercenary with an honor code would fit in within the existing show framework.

AOS is definitely at a disadvantage to Arrow and Smallville in terms of character appearances given that the show is in continuity with the existing movieverse, they are giving an awful lot of characters the big screen treatment, they don't have mutants, FF or Spidey related characters, and vigilantes wouldn't make much sense on the show. But with Maria Hill, Nick Fury, Franklin Hall, Scorch, Jasper Sitwell and Victoria Hand having shown up or scheduled to appear, the show has been doing a pretty good job of incorporating long time comic characters.

 

[metaphysician]

I doubt we will get anything like Civil War, for several reasons:

1. Civil War in its entirety drastically violates the themes and tones established for the MCU

2. There isn't a strong tradition of costumed vigilante-ism at the street level, nor of keeping secret identities

3. Forced conscription of superhumans would come off so laughably villainous as to destroy any possibility of the audience viewing the faction doing it as anything but villains

 

[JJmelo]

I think that out of the CA:TWS cast, Georges St. Pierre's Batroc has the best chance of showing up on AOS either before or after the film opening. Georges is looking to transition into a full time acting career, and I don't think his fight with Cap (is Cap sky diving to engage him at the start of the trailer?) is connected to the "SHIELD coup" main plot. A mercenary with an honor code would fit in within the existing show framework.

AOS is definitely at a disadvantage to Arrow and Smallville in terms of character appearances given that the show is in continuity with the existing movieverse, they are giving an awful lot of characters the big screen treatment, they don't have mutants, FF or Spidey related characters, and vigilantes wouldn't make much sense on the show. But with Maria Hill, Nick Fury, Franklin Hall, Scorch, Jasper Sitwell and Victoria Hand having shown up or scheduled to appear, the show has been doing a pretty good job of incorporating long time comic characters.

I could totally see Anthony Mackie making an appearance hinting at the wings but saving them for the film.

 

[iamlegend]

I doubt we will get anything like Civil War, for several reasons:

1. Civil War in its entirety drastically violates the themes and tones established for the MCU

2. There isn't a strong tradition of costumed vigilante-ism at the street level, nor of keeping secret identities

3. Forced conscription of superhumans would come off so laughably villainous as to destroy any possibility of the audience viewing the faction doing it as anything but villains

Personally, I'd never want to see Civil War portrayed in the films. The whole thing was an absolute mess in the comics, and the writers forced it down readers' throats - common sense be damned.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

This is what people need to understand. Any character that gets introduced in this show will have to be cast correctly and portrayed correctly or that's it for them in the MCU. That's why we've only had D-listers so far. They have to start off safe until the show establishes itself.

I think the first thing that should have been thought on this show was that the main characters were cast correctly and portrayed correctly. Forget making sure THE TRAPTSER and CHEMISTRO are looking good on ABC. Let's make freaking Ward and Skye look good. Sadly, that has not been the case.

 

[Xeno]

I think the first thing that should have been thought on this show was that the main characters were cast correctly and portrayed correctly. Forget making sure THE TRAPTSER and CHEMISTRO are looking good on ABC. Let's make freaking Ward and Skye look good. Sadly, that has not been the case.

QFT.

This show needs to get its core characters right before it can worry about anyone else.

 

[Hypestyle]

more fights are needed.

They should also bring in the Cigarette Smoking Man for good measure. He'd add an additional air of mystery to the proceedings.

 

[metaphysician]

Personally, I'd never want to see Civil War portrayed in the films. The whole thing was an absolute mess in the comics, and the writers forced it down readers' throats - common sense be damned.

Oh, I agree 100%. The only thing that keeps Civil War from being the worst thing out of Marvel ever is OMD/OMIT. Even World War Hulk is "just" a jobfest.

 

[BOOZEMAN]

Considering most people watching this show have probably never actually read one of the comics in their lives it's no surprise they're "upset" over comic characters not being used...you know, the big name ones they know through second hand.


Does it matter? Why would they have made him Sunfire when they killed the character off? Would you have been happy if they introduced Sunfire just for them to kill him off in this episode? And as far as we know Marvel can't use Sunfire because he's a mutant and is almost exclusively connected to the X-Men outside of Big Hero 6. Think about this stuff before asking questions like that.

And really, REALLY? Are you really paying that little attention to what's actually going on and focusing so much on how they're not using enough from the comics for you to notice that the people who are behind all this **** ARE HYDRA, or at the very least AIM? It's blatantly obvious. They're not even trying to hide it from people who have read the comics with all the hints they've dropped. If you really love the comics as much as you say then you should have been able to pick up on the fact HYDRA/AIM ARE the main villains of this show. They're using ****ing Extremis, the drug AIM created for ****s sake.

As for characters in this show showing up in the movies, you might as well get that out your mind now. It's not happening nor does it need to. The movies do their thing, the show does its thing. We don't have too see random D-List characters in the movies from this show just to have some kind of shallow gratification that would feel very shoehorned and out of place. There are other, more sophisticated and appropriate ways, which they are doing btw, to connect the show and movies. As for how, it's not that hard to see if you know what's going on in the films.

And Batroc the Leaper is in Captain America 2 and Marvel can't use Scorpio because he's a Spider-Man villain.

So much wrong with this post as criticism of the show.

WOW...I guess that I should have expected this kind of response when I decided to voice an opposing opinion on this thread.

1) I suggested Sunfire under the prerequisite that the story be re-tooled (As in they DON'T kill him) to make his appearance work. It would be a nice nod to Marvel fans instead of giving them a throw away character who nobody cares about. As for your X-Men/S.H.I.E.L.D. argument. I'm pretty sure that S.H.I.E.L.D. would at least be aware of the mutant situation as several powerful mutants have been in the public eye according to the movies and the comics.

2) I am completely ****ing aware that AIM is responsible for the Extremis experiments. Stop pelting me with asterisks for ****s sake. All I'm saying is that IM3 dealt with that. Let's see something new. If it's AIM just say it's AIM and get on to a new threat from them. Hell, maybe show us the beginnings of a M.O.D.O.K. in some petri dish in a lab or something. And why not tell the team about AIM? Why would they be keeping their field agents who are trying to deal with this stuff in the dark???

3) I am also aware that Batroc is going to be in Winter Soldier. I was simply using him as an example. If it makes you feel better, pretend that I said Grim Reaper instead. Also, I suggested SCORPIO (Nick Fury's brother Jake, who became a super villain) not SCORPION (Mac Gargan, who is a Spider-Man foe). Take a few deep breaths during your rage fits to clear your head and read a bit more carefully.

That said, I don't hate this show. I want it to succeed. The fact is that there was a huge viewer drop after the pilot and they can't really afford to take so much time stringing people along. This is still a fledgling show and they should attempt to give viewers a few big name character thrills like the movies they built off of as incentive to continue watching. I'm afraid that the slow pacing will lead to a quick death.

P.S. All that I really want is for the Bane or Spawn to show up on the show and fight Batman and the rest of the Avengers.

That last sentence was to explode the heads of people who don't read an entire post and simply attack somebody because they say something that bothers them.

 

[cph9fa]

Let's see something new. If it's AIM just say it's AIM and get on to a new threat from them. Hell, maybe show us the beginnings of a M.O.D.O.K. in some petri dish in a lab or something.

Well, we got the beginning of something new... "The Clairvoyant" -- maybe that is M.O.D.O.K.?