Another possible model of continuity for the X-Men Franchise - 6 universes

[Mutant 77]

It's cool that we got two cinematic versions of Quicksilver... 3, if we count the one in "X-Men Origins".

 

[Shoppy]

The movies are self-consistent. It was another era where continuity between sequels didn't matter that much. The span 'X1-Origins' is consistent. "First Class" was supposed to be a soft reboot.

It's always mattered to fans, just not to the writers unfortunately.

 

[Mutant 77]

It's always mattered to fans, just not to the writers unfortunately.

Well, they tried to do it until "First Class" (2011). "First Class" was designed and written to be a soft reboot. DOFP was an afterthought.

 

[Shoppy]

Well, they tried to do it until "First Class" (2011). "First Class" was designed and written to be a soft reboot. DOFP was an afterthought.

Absolutely ...... DOFP has got 2 versions of events in 1973, one version leads to the future we see at the beginning (and The Gifted seems to preced those events) ..... and then after the events of DFOP it leads to the future Logan wakes up in.
Neither version of events in 1973 that follow on from First Class leads to the original trilogy, and then the ages of Jean and Angel in particular in those two sets of films make them being the same universe impossible as well.
The fact it's the same actors playing the older characters need not come into it, It's the narrative we have to consider.

Legion is in a world where the government are only just learning about mutants which sets it apart from the reboot universe and I see it as part of the OT timeline for that reason.
The Wolverine, much as i dislike it and would happily write it off also seems to reference the events of The Last Stand with regards to the deaths of Jean and Charles so I'd sit that with the OT.

Logan seems to be in a similar world to the OT with a few changes but not too much to ignore if you don't try and make it fit with DOFP

The Deadpool films, until something says otherwise, I see as being in the reboot timeline, and for Wade to revisit the events of Origins:Wolverine with his time-hopping the only way I can see that happening and explaining the existence of another Wade in the past is if Deadpool's time-hopping created an alternate future from which came the pre-Deadpool Wade who worked alongside Logan, Sabretooth and Co, then after that created an alternate timeline Wade went back and stopped it by shooting alternate Wade.
As for "Quicksilver" and "Emma" in Origins:Wolverine lets just write them off as similar but not the same characters, it's not explicitly stated is it?
What that DP scene does do anyhow is remove the need to include Origins:Wolverine in the OT timeline and that works fine for me, and personally I wouldn't mind doing the same with The Wolverine but like I say there's arguments in favour of it being a follow on from The Last Stand.

 

[Mutant 77]

As for "Quicksilver" and "Emma" in Origins:Wolverine lets just write them off as similar but not the same characters, it's not explicitly stated is it?
What that DP scene does do anyhow is remove the need to include Origins:Wolverine in the OT timeline and that works fine for me, and personally I wouldn't mind doing the same with The Wolverine but like I say there's arguments in favour of it being a follow on from The Last Stand.

Well, cool enough:

In the Rogue's Cut, two sisters for Peter Maximoff/Quicksilver are referenced. That's great! Bingo.
Indeed, in "X2" (Timeline Prime Alpha), there are two "Maximoff" persons listed on Stryker's files: Peter's sisters (mutant as well), who came into existence despite their brother had never been conceived - that will happen when the timeline is altered by Sebastian Shaw in various ways.
Thus, in Timeline Prime Alpha, the DOFP Quicksilver was never born; Erik/Magneto had a speedster son with an unspecified woman in the late sixties (maybe 1969) whom I named: "Peter Lehnsherr". He is the Quicksilver featured on "X-Men Origins" (set in 1983).
Eureka!

"The Wolverine" is firmly placed in Timeline Two (the one following "First Class"), where an alternate version of "The Last Stand" did happen.

 

[Shoppy]

"The Wolverine" is firmly placed in Timeline Two (the one following "First Class"), where an alternate version of "The Last Stand" did happen.

How so?

 

[Mutant 77]

How so?

Good question.

At the end of the Timeline One "Last Stand" (the original one), the X-Men were fully active and there was a sense of hope for Xavier's dream. It was a definitive happy ending.

"The Wolverine" is on the same "destructive" path of DOFP (Timeline Two). The X-Men have disbanded. Wolverine is retired. Bad things are happening in the world. And then, in the mid-credits scene, we see the entire set-up of DOFP.

Plus, Xavier has his body again - not the P. Xavier's body he had at the end of Timeline One "Last Stand" - so maybe in the slightly altered version of "The Last Stand" which occurred in Timeline Two, Xavier's body has not been "destroyed". Wolverine is just surprised to see him alive.

 

[Shoppy]

Good question.

At the end of the Timeline One "Last Stand" (the original one), the X-Men were fully active and there was a sense of hope for Xavier's dream. It was a definitive happy ending.

"The Wolverine" is on the same "destructive" path of DOFP (Timeline Two). The X-Men have disbanded. Wolverine is retired. Bad things are happening in the world. And then, in the mid-credits scene, we see the entire set-up of DOFP.

Plus, Xavier has his body again - not the P. Xavier's body he had at the end of Timeline One "Last Stand" - so maybe in the slightly altered version of "The Last Stand" which occurred in Timeline Two, Xavier's body has not been "destroyed". Wolverine is just surprised to see him alive.

It only very loosely hints at Days Of Future Past, mainly because of how Eric and Charles are dressed, but it doesn't really work to create a direct connection.

Logan is obviously dealing with the death of Jean in The Last Stand and is surprised to see Charles after the events of that film, (but considering the chess scene at the end hinted that Charles was in Eric's head it might not have even been an actual physical Charles?)

But why it really doesn't work is that in the dark future we see in DOFP things have been heading downhill for mutants politically for a good while, and The Gifted fits with that, but The Wolverine, even though it's years before, is still missing any hint at things heading that way.
It fits more with the Original Trilogy OR with Origins:Wolverine in their own timeline.

If you wanted to fit it into the reboot timeline it would have to be post-DOFP to ignore how things were headed in the future that exists between First Class and DOFP happening, but THEN you've got the issue of Jean being alive when Logan wakes up.

The Wolverine fits FAR better with the Original Trilogy than in the reboot timeline.

 

[Shoppy]

If you really want to tie it all together and attribute it to someone time travelling you could call Deadpool 1+2 the original timeline, then DP creates the events of Origins: Wolverine which leads to the Original Trilogy and both Wolverine sequels, then he corrects that timeline to some extent by shooting Origins Wade but the "Emma" we see in that film time travels rather than Shaw and that creates the reboot timeline.

 

[Mutant 77]

Logan is obviously dealing with the death of Jean in The Last Stand and is surprised to see Charles after the events of that film, (but considering the chess scene at the end hinted that Charles was in Eric's head it might not have even been an actual physical Charles?)

.

The completely rebooted timeline is Post-DOFP, not Pre-DOFP.

In the second timeline, the "Post-First Class, Pre-DOFP" timeline, the original trilogy DID happen (even if slightly altered), and "The Wolverine" is connected to the slightly altered original trilogy - including "The Last Stand".

For instance, "the" Logan in "The Wolverine" would remember "The Last Stand" occurring with an older version of Angel, not younger.

That doesn't change the impact and the storyline of "The Wolverine" at all. The second timeline is nihilistic and bleak, and Logan retired from the X-Men some years later.


I forgot this: "the" Logan of the First Class timeline - including "The Wolverine" - has shorter hair.

 

[Mutant 77]

If you really want to tie it all together and attribute it to someone time travelling you could call Deadpool 1+2 the original timeline, then DP creates the events of Origins: Wolverine which leads to the Original Trilogy and both Wolverine sequels, then he corrects that timeline to some extent by shooting Origins Wade but the "Emma" we see in that film time travels rather than Shaw and that creates the reboot timeline.

I think Deadpool inhabits an alternate universe.

Emma Frost in "First Class" was just a mutant living her own time. Shaw knew the future, had an agenda and also altered Magneto's life in 1944. Everything points at him being more than what he seems. He's the catalyst.

 

[Shoppy]

I think Deadpool inhabits an alternate universe.

Emma Frost in "First Class" was just a mutant living her own time. Shaw knew the future, had an agenda and also altered Magneto's life in 1944. Everything points at him being more than what he seems. He's the catalyst.

I still think you're approaching it more from an angle of trying to make it fit with an idea rather than trying to find an idea that fits through logical elimination and that puts it in the realm of fan-fiction rather from my perspective.

 

[Mutant 77]

I still think you're approaching it more from an angle of trying to make it fit with an idea rather than trying to find an idea that fits through logical elimination and that puts it in the realm of fan-fiction rather from my perspective.

Well, Shaw was an absolute mutant leader in 1962 and was constantly talking about "the future". He is the FIRST RETCON we see in the saga, being the divergent element in the 1944 flashback sequence.
"First Class" is an un undeniable "soft reboot", so my theory makes a lot of sense and there are no more errors in the timelines this way. It works fine.

 

[Mutant 77]

Wondering if "The New Mutants" is gonna be included into the mainstream X-Men timeline... guess so.