Jared Leto IS The Joker - - - - - - - - - Part 18

[regwec]

Nobody really cares about El Diablo, though.

 

[The Joker]

What does his performance have to do with his musical career?

What happened before the movie came out is irrelevant. The performance speaks for itself, and people will have an opinion on it. Like The Joker said, there was a huge backlash when Heath was cast. He won people over. Leto didn't. It's that simple.

Exactly. That's the harsh reality of it.

 

[Wildcard]

El Diablo isn't nearly the cultural icon as the Joker, now is he? Nor was his design a huge departure from the books.

 

[The Joker]

Being a cultural icon is totally irrelevant. It would be like me saying people are biased against make up because they didn't like it on Ledger when they first saw it (which was a departure from his comic book look). If people hate tattoos then anyone with them in the movie would have been slammed for it.

But that wasn't the case. It was that they looked stupid on the Joker. And still do. It was a bad design issue, not a bias against tattoos issue.

 

[Wildcard]

Being a cultural icon is totally irrelevant. If people hate tattoos then anyone with them in the movie would have been slammed for it. It would be like me saying people are biased against make up because they didn't like it on Ledger when they first saw it (which was a departure from his comic book look). If there was a bias against tattoos, anyone with them would have been criticized for it.

But that wasn't the case. It was that they looked stupid on the Joker. And still do. It was a bad design issue, not a bias against tattoos issue.

It is relevant if the character isn't cared about enough for anyone to even complain. Like regwec said, nobody really cares about El Diablo, so why would they complain.

To that affect, I've yet to see anybody complain about Harley's tattoos, even though they make even less sense than Joker's and are there just because.

There's certainly a bias here against Leto and his Joker. That much is undeniable.

 

[The Joker]

It is relevant if the character isn't cared about enough for anyone to even complain. Like regwec said, nobody really cares about El Diablo, so why would they complain.

To that affect, I've yet to see anybody complain about Harley's tattoos, even though they make even less sense than Joker's and are there just because.

That there also proves your point about this tattoo bias is invalid. Nobody complained about Harley's tattoos either. She is a fan favorite character. Nobody slammed them because they didn't look stupid on her. Just like El Diablo's don't. If a design works and is a departure from the comics (e.g. Ledger's Joker make up, DeVito Penguin design, Molina's Doc Ock trenchcoat look etc), people will embrace it. If it looks stupid, like Letoker's, then they won't. That's not bias against tattoos or what ever elements makes up the eyesore look. That's just people having good taste to dislike an ugly design.

Simple as that. Believe it or not people don't hate nipples just because they don't want them on the Batman suit

There's certainly a bias here against Leto and his Joker. That much is undeniable.

When you provide proof of it, then it will be undeniable.

 

[Joy in J-Land]

That's a contradiction. If the general audience's only complaint was he wasn't in it enough then it wouldn't be "fashionable" to hate him if that was the dominant complaint.

Actually, it's not a contradiction. I meant it was fashionable to hate on Jared Leto in general, not just in his role as the Joker, among a lot of critics and media people. And I didn't say the general audience's only complaint was the length of time the Joker was in the movie, but it was the predominant complaint I saw. I thought Razzie nominations were for actors whose performances were almost universally panned. I didn't see that for Jared's Joker. I did see that for Cara Delevingne's Enchantress, but she wasn't even nominated.

 

[The Joker]

Actually, it's not a contradiction. I meant it was fashionable to hate on Jared Leto in general, not just in his role as the Joker, among a lot of critics and media people. And I didn't say the general audience's only complaint was the length of time the Joker was in the movie, but it was the predominant complaint I saw. I thought Razzie nominations were for actors whose performances were almost universally panned. I didn't see that for Jared's Joker. I did see that for Cara Delevingne's Enchantress, but she wasn't even nominated.

Now there's a bias against Jared Leto in general, too? This just gets better and better. If that's the case you might as well accept then that he's never going to be loved in the role. Which it isn't. Leto's casting here alone was met with universal enthusiasm and excitement.

If the predominant complaint is he wasn't in it enough, that would imply audiences wanted to see more of him. If they hated the character, then they'd be glad to see as little as possible of him. So yeah it's a contradiction to say it's fashionable to hate him, but people wanted to see more of him. Who wants to see more of a character they loathe?

Cara Delevingne's character was a CGI'ed, voice modulated caricature. She barely got to give a performance. She was a cog in a CGI machine.

 

[Wildcard]

So that's your excuse as to why she shouldn't have been nominated even though it's clear she gave one of the worst performances in the movie? Voice modulation and CGI or no CGI, there's no way she shouldn't have been nominated while Leto was. Pure bias b.s., like you blaming her shoddy acting on her "being a cog in a CGI machine."

 

[DeadStroke]

Love that shot. This one here reminds me so much of the Crow:

 

[Wildcard]

Haha nice. t:

Btw, I still wonder if Jared intentionally used his real voice for that scene or if he had his own little slip up.

 

[King23DC]

Ledger's was a decent performance of a kind of elseworlds Joker. Shame about the stupid facepaint, though. Leto was similar: okay performance, dumb design choices.

We have still yet to see a great on-screen Joker.

 

[harlequinade]

Now there's a bias against Jared Leto in general, too? This just gets better and better. If that's the case you might as well accept then that he's never going to be loved in the role. Which it isn't. Leto's casting here alone was met with universal enthusiasm and excitement.

If the predominant complaint is he wasn't in it enough, that would imply audiences wanted to see more of him. If they hated the character, then they'd be glad to see as little as possible of him. So yeah it's a contradiction to say it's fashionable to hate him, but people wanted to see more of him. Who wants to see more of a character they loathe?

Cara Delevingne's character was a CGI'ed, voice modulated caricature. She barely got to give a performance. She was a cog in a CGI machine.

There is. And Jared can blame himself for a large chunk of it. His whole method thing was met with ridicule and mocking and that was for other roles too, not just Squad. But once the movie was released it was even worse. When it was announced he is gonna be in Blade Runner most reactions were jokes about his method acting and that we can await Harrison Ford punching him.

Add to that the fact that he is occasionally stunningly humorless (he just had to shoot down that green coat meme that happened) and people in general don't like him very much and like to make fun of him

 

[TheFuture]

Are people seriously bothered about fake award ceremonies?

 

[The Joker]

So that's your excuse as to why she shouldn't have been nominated even though it's clear she gave one of the worst performances in the movie? Voice modulation and CGI or no CGI, there's no way she shouldn't have been nominated while Leto was. Pure bias b.s., like you blaming her shoddy acting on her "being a cog in a CGI machine."

I just told you the reason why. Her character was a CGI'ed voice modulated entity. She barely got to do any real acting in the part. It was like Thomas Haden Church in SM-3 when he played Sandman. He spent most of that movie as a CGI sand storm or sand moster. He hardly got to do any acting.

Whereas Letoker was all there dishing out a bad performance in all his scenes.

There is. And Jared can blame himself for a large chunk of it. His whole method thing was met with ridicule and mocking and that was for other roles too, not just Squad. But once the movie was released it was even worse. When it was announced he is gonna be in Blade Runner most reactions were jokes about his method acting and that we can await Harrison Ford punching him.

Add to that the fact that he is occasionally stunningly humorless (he just had to shoot down that green coat meme that happened) and people in general don't like him very much and like to make fun of him

Nobody cared a toss about his method acting enough to hate the chracter. In fact the only mocking that came from that after the movie was people couldn't figure out why he did all those things to his cast mates when he never shared a scene with any of them except Harley.

The Blade Runner announcement came after SS was released and people had already made up their minds after judging what they saw in the movie.

Furthermore if there was a general bias against Leto then he wouldn't only be getting his first Razzie nomination this late in his career. Haters would have nominated him a long time ago. Probably more than once, too.

 

[King23DC]

There is. And Jared can blame himself for a large chunk of it. His whole method thing was met with ridicule and mocking and that was for other roles too, not just Squad. But once the movie was released it was even worse. When it was announced he is gonna be in Blade Runner most reactions were jokes about his method acting and that we can await Harrison Ford punching him.

Add to that the fact that he is occasionally stunningly humorless (he just had to shoot down that green coat meme that happened) and people in general don't like him very much and like to make fun of him

What we think of Letoker ...

Nicholson and Ledger's takes on the character would eat this love sick, ghetto Joker for breakfast.

 

[Wildcard]

What we think of Letoker ...

Nicholson and Ledger's takes on the character would eat this love sick, ghetto Joker for breakfast.

Erm, the same version that hurt his own hand punching Batman and got killed minutes later is gonna wipe the floor with Leto's Joker, whose been active for decades?

 

[2kt09]

Nobody really cares about El Diablo, though.

Like among the couple-few good performances out of this, though.

 

[King23DC]

Erm, the same version that hurt his own hand punching Batman and got killed minutes later is gonna wipe the floor with Leto's Joker, whose been active for decades?

You mean injuring his hand on a punch to body armor?

There is no indication how long Letoker has been active. And he does NOTHING menacing or substance the entire movie besides be [()] whipped.

Ledger
Nicholson
Leto

Both in performance, and the level of menace to each Joker. Leto was a grown up Justin Bieber with clown makeup and stupid tattoos.

We're all laughing at this clown ass excuse for a Joker. In the DCEU, Harley Quinn is described as being more crazy and volatile than the Joker.

SMH

 

[TheRedWraith]

Nobody really cares about El Diablo, though.

I care, I care enough that I want him to be the villain of JLD, or at least be in it in some manner.

 

[Wildcard]

You mean injuring his hand on a punch to body armor?

Ledger's Joker didn't injure his hands, and he was throwing straight shots at Bale's Batman at the end of the film.

There is no indication how long Letoker has been active. And he does NOTHING menacing or substance the entire movie besides be [()] whipped.

Given the fact that he killed Robin, I'd say that is an indication of him having been around for quite some time. And the fact that he has major pull in Gotham as a mob boss.

Ledger
Nicholson
Leto

Both in performance, and the level of menace to each Joker. Leto was a grown up Justin Bieber with clown makeup and stupid tattoos.

We're all laughing at this clown ass excuse for a Joker. In the DCEU, Harley Quinn is described as being more crazy and volatile than the Joker.

SMH

Yeah, she was, and then she starts freaking out about not being able to swim right after when he crashes the car.

And yet again, the only people who have major beef with Leto's Joker are a select few hardcore Batman fans. Otherwise, the general audiences responded positively to him. We're talking millions of people versus a small group. And no matter how much angst you have towards him or how many irrevocably pointless and inane Justin Bieber comments you make, that won't change.

 

[King23DC]

Ledger's Joker didn't injure his hands, and he was throwing straight shots at Bale's Batman at the end of the film.

I thought you were referencing Nicholson, otherwise, what the hell are you talking about?

Given the fact that he killed Robin, I'd say that is an indication of him having been around for quite some time. And the fact that he has major pull in Gotham as a mob boss.

Joker is more than a mob boss. He's the antithesis to organized crime. So they didn't get that correct either. And we don't see him kill Robin. At least not Leto's take on the character. Of screen stuff doesn't count.

Yeah, she was, and then she starts freaking out about not being able to swim right after when he crashes the car.

Harley > Joker in the DCEU. And more dangerous. More fearless. Pathetic.

Hunka Hunka

And yet again, the only people who have major beef with Leto's Joker are a select few hardcore Batman fans. Otherwise, the general audiences responded positively to him. We're talking millions of people versus a small group

Well hardcore Batman fans is where the respect would actually be earned. Just like the love and admiration Nicholson, Hamill, and Ledger earned. Through production, not method acting hype.

And what are you talking about the majority of the public responded well to him?

He's nominated for a Razzie.

No one was out there praising Leto's Hot Topic Joker performance. Especially in the wake of Ledger.

 

[Wildcard]

I thought you were referencing Nicholson, otherwise, what the hell are you talking about?

I was referencing Nicholson. You're the one who tried to defend him being far inferior to Batman by saying the latter was wearing armor. I merely pointed out that Bale's Batman was wearing (better) armor and Ledger's Joker didn't hurt his hand when striking him, thereby invalidating your argument that Nicholson's Joker could "destroy" Leto's in an encounter. Something that wouldn't happen. Ledger? Sure, I could buy that. But Nicholson? Don't make me laugh. Oh wait...

Joker is more than a mob boss. He's the antithesis to organized crime. So they didn't get that correct either. And we don't see him kill Robin. At least not Leto's take on the character. Of screen stuff doesn't count.

Except no. There have been many iterations of the Joker that have depicted him as a straight up mob boss, Nicholson being one of them. He isn't always directly portrayed as the "antithesis" of organized crime. There are many times where he's front and center in that regard.

In Robin's case, perhaps you missed the spray painted Robin suit stating "HA HA! JOKE'S ON YOU" and the fact that Harley is listed as an accomplice to said murder in SS. Don't have to count off-screen scenes with that being taken into consideration.

Harley > Joker in the DCEU. And more dangerous. More fearless. Pathetic.

Hunka Hunka

You're basing this on what? A line of dialogue that gets disproven seconds after it's uttered? Try again.

Well hardcore Batman fans is where the respect would actually be earned. Just like the love and admiration Nicholson, Hamill, and Ledger earned. Through production, not method acting hype.

And what are you talking about the majority of the public responded well to him?

He's nominated for a Razzie.

I made myself abundantly clear with my initial. Yes, I'm aware there are those that don't care for his performance (the same can be said for Nicholson and Ledger) but there are more that favored him than hated. Especially where general audiences are concerned.

A pointless nomination for an award that holds no merit doesn't matter. Especially when they skimmed over Cara Delevigne's performance and chose him.

No one was out there praising Leto's Hot Topic Joker performance. Especially in the wake of Ledger.

Better take a second look then. All that hate is making you delusional, brah.

 

[THE WOLF]

Ghetto Joker? smh

 

[Wildcard]

Ghetto Joker? smh

Yeah, considering the connotations that come with that, I was going to point that out and go in entirely on that alone but decided to leave it be.

But yes, it was very extraneous.