Eternals Flying too close to the sun - The Ikaris (Richard Madden) Thread

[Deck Rickard]

Yeah, Cyke’s optic beams have been garbage even in the GOOD X-Men movies. I think Superman’s looked pretty good in MOS (see, I can compliment Zack Snyder when he does something well!) but Ikaris’s beams are just on another level. So awesome.

 

[Mysteryman]

Yeah, Cyke’s optic beams have been garbage even in the GOOD X-Men movies. I think Superman’s looked pretty good in MOS (see, I can compliment Zack Snyder when he does something well!) but Ikaris’s beams are just on another level. So awesome.

Weren't they COOL?

 

[samsnee]

The fight in the finale was amazing.

 

[Batmannerism]

I liked Ikaris as a character. He's a bit wooden in the first act of the film, and initially his relationship with Sersi feels a bit forced

Also, once you find out about him killing Ajak, it puts all his earlier scenes in a different light.

However, in the third act he really comes into his own, particularly in conflict with the other Eternals.

That moment where his eyes glow and he's about to blast Sersi, but decides not to and helps the others kill Tiamut - no dialogue necessary, it just works and that scene with Sersi has genuine pathos, and makes up for all the earlier awkwardness.

Of all the characters he has the best arc IMO and his final scene is understandable. I was sad to see him go.

However, even Gemma Chan mentioned in an interview that his memories have been preserved, and he can be remade. I'm hoping that if sequels occur, that we see him again.​

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I saw a really good quote from Chloe Zhao about Ikaris that summed up his arc, which was basically (paraphrasing) "Without Sersi in his life, Ikaris is disconnected from humans. She was always the grounded one and with her, he floats too high" or something like that.

Thought it was an interesting insight into where he drifted as a character.

 

[Batmannerism]

I saw a really good quote from Chloe Zhao about Ikaris that summed up his arc, which was basically (paraphrasing) "Without Sersi in his life, Ikaris is disconnected from humans. She was always the grounded one and with her, he floats too high" or something like that.

Thought it was an interesting insight into where he drifted as a character.

From what he said in the film, I believe that he left her in order to disconnect from humanity because he knew our time was almost up and he would have to witness our destruction. He also knew that she cared about humans, and in turn he cared for her.

That's why he doesn't kill her at the end - because his love for her is greater than his mission. And he's destroyed by this conflict, He can't live with the guilt that he's failed both the Celestials and the Eternals.

If you think about it, he doesn't betray the Eternals, the Eternals betray him by turning against their fundamental purpose.

I really want to see some IKARIS WAS RIGHT! t shirts. The death of Tiamut means that countless other star systems, won't be born - so a lot was sacrificed to save Earth.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

He also said that line that he could never lie to Sersi and he knew if he stayed he'd have to reveal to truth to her, so he left to protect her.

And then I guess by Zhao's reasoning, because he's been so cut off from Sersi for 5,000 years, he's totally lost that connection to the human race.

If you think about it, he doesn't betray the Eternals, the Eternals betray him by turning against their fundamental purpose.

My read on that too is a lot of internalised anger... Because Ikaris gave up the one thing he cared about more than anything - Sersi - In order to fulfil that purpose. So to see your family so easily turn their back on that purpose, would make his sacrifice feel completely for nothing. That's how I interpreted it anyway.

I know Ikaris was very wooden in this film, and it put people off, but I actually kind of loved it for the character. He reminded me a lot of Scott Summers - The leader who's totally emotionally stunted and keeps everything bottled up. To me it made his scene at the end that much more powerful because it was a completely break down of that emotional wall he'd built up to protect himself.

 

[Batmannerism]

He also said that line that he could never lie to Sersi and he knew if he stayed he'd have to reveal to truth to her, so he left to protect her.

And then I guess by Zhao's reasoning, because he's been so cut off from Sersi for 5,000 years, he's totally lost that connection to the human race.



My read on that too is a lot of internalised anger... Because Ikaris gave up the one thing he cared about more than anything - Sersi - In order to fulfil that purpose. So to see your family so easily turn their back on that purpose, would make his sacrifice feel completely for nothing. That's how I interpreted it anyway.

I know Ikaris was very wooden in this film, and it put people off, but I actually kind of loved it for the character. He reminded me a lot of Scott Summers - The leader who's totally emotionally stunted and keeps everything bottled up. To me it made his scene at the end that much more powerful because it was a completely break down of that emotional wall he'd built up to protect himself.

I think Ikaris and Sersi only split up ( he left) 100 years before present day. So they were together
for a very long time.

I had a very similar take, that he bottled up his emotions - and I too found his breakdown at the end had a lot more impact because of that. I wouldn't call him wooden ( as in Hayden Christensen wooden) but he was probably a bit too restrained to charm audiences.

Also, some of the present day scenes where he's a bit aloof, he's also grappling with the guilt of killing Ajak - so thats wearing away at him during his interactions with the others e.g. when he tells Kingo, who nearly worships him as a hero, "I'm not who you think I am".

He's caught in an impossible situation between Sersi and the other Eternals, and his duty to the Celestials ( and arguably the greater good). Because he and Ajak know about the Emergence, and that they've done the same thing many times before he just sees us as one more species that's reached the end of our cycle, and now it's time to start again.

Guess it didn't work for some folks , but Ikaris was my favorite character by far.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I think Ikaris and Sersi only split up ( he left) 100 years before present day. So they were together
for a very long time.

I had a very similar take, that he bottled up his emotions - and I too found his breakdown at the end had a lot more impact because of that. I wouldn't call him wooden ( as in Hayden Christensen wooden) but he was probably a bit too restrained to charm audiences.

Also, some of the present day scenes where he's a bit aloof, he's also grappling with the guilt of killing Ajak - so thats wearing away at him during his interactions with the others e.g. when he tells Kingo, who nearly worships him as a hero, "I'm not who you think I am".

He's caught in an impossible situation between Sersi and the other Eternals, and his duty to the Celestials ( and arguably the greater good). Because he and Ajak know about the Emergence, and that they've done the same thing many times before he just sees us as one more species that's reached the end of our cycle, and now it's time to start again.

Guess it didn't work for some folks , but Ikaris was my favorite character by far.

I'm pretty sure it was closer to 500 years right? It was right after the period in the Aztec city when Ajak told Ikaris, and he left after that.

And yeah, that version of Ikaris totally landed for me, for most of the reasons you list above. How he seems in modern day I think is a very deliberate choice (especially when we see him straight after meeting the far more charming and friendly Dane). I think it's to make him seem a bit more aloof and otherworldly. The vibe I basically got was Superman, if he was never raised by a human family, whereas Sersi is the opposite.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I thought Ikaris left Sersi after learning the truth from Ajak and that was during the Spanish Conquest era so they were apart for quite a few centuries.

 

[Deck Rickard]

Didn’t he say that Ajak told him after Babylon? So he would have already known at the time of the Spanish conquest.

Anyway, I thought Madden did a great job in this and I ended up liking the twist with his character because he’s becomes a compelling antagonist.

 

[Batmannerism]

Going to see film again, sooner or later and will work it out.

Ikaris and Sersi hook up while the Eternals are in Babylon - 5000 years ago. They're together for thousands of years. That kind of relationship doesn't fade away quickly- which made me wonder why Dane was in the film.

I thought I heard Sprite say they broke up 100 or so years ago - but will look for that, it's a long film and hard to follow the precise timeline.

 

[Shuri]

If I didn't see this movie, I would love Ikaris just from you guys take on the character. It's a shame the writing and the performance was lacking and it fell flat. This character was boring AF and I dislike him. If they do bring him back, I hope it's a different version of him, preferably played by another actor. I love Madden, but it seems like he lacks the charisma to carry a movie.

 

[Prison Mike]

I don’t know, I don’t think he needed a lot of charisma for the role anyway. In his heart, he was a soldier, ready to follow orders no matter the consequences. On some level I agreed with him and on another, I was with Sersi.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

I can't believe it took me until I read this topic title to make the connection that...

Spoiler

...Ikarus ends up committing suicide by "flying too close the the sun". Way too close.

 

[Bren]

I really enjoyed Madden as Ikaris... Only issue was the lack of chemistry with Sersi (maybe planned?) and the moments

Spoiler

where he went a little bit too villainish.

I can imagine they were going for the idea he was trying to ignore his inner conflict utterly, but a tiny bit more nuance of his 'movie bad guy' between 'going with Sersi's plan' and 'realization' stages imo would have been nice.

Can forgive even that because my reading of him was that he was emotionally and socially naive, or even stunted.

 

[Dark Raven]

Leave it to Marvel to give us a better Superman than DC could.

I don't think so. If DC gave us a Superman that was exactly like Ikaris in this movie, it still wouldn't be Superman at all. It's not like he took pleasure in saving people or had a warmth or was heroic. The Superman in Superman and Lois is still a better and more faithful Superman than Ikaris. Ikaris is more inspired by Man of Steel but just had more personality than Henry Cavill, but still wouldn't be a good Superman.

It's precisely because he wasn't Superman that you appreciated the parts that were like him, but if he were actually Superman as he was, then he would be definitely lacking.

 

[metaphysician]

My own read on Ikaris. . .

Spoiler

I think his intended motivation, ultimately, was "Bitterness over his duty". He didn't *like* being informed the truth about the Eternal's mission, but he swallowed it, kept quiet about it, for centuries or millenia, because he was a good soldier, he was the strongest, he had to carry this burden. He just quietly resented and envied the innocence of the others, and also quietly resented Ajak for having told him the truth. Which is why he had the nasty edge to his treatment of the others during the present. He wasn't just calmly or sadly doing his duty when he killed Ajak, he was legitimately angry at her. "You made me bear this burden for centuries, and now your just going to up and change your mind at the last second?! How dare you!" Of course, since he's *also* not a soulless monster, when he hates and resents his family, he also hates and loaths himself too.

Naturally, only pieces of this is strictly speaking present in the movie itself. This is me reading apparent intent as much as actual execution. In a better version of this story, one thing Ikaris would *absolutely* have needed are flashbacks to what *he* had been doing in the last five hundred years.

 

[Babillygunn]

Leave it to Marvel to give us a better Superman than DC could.

Ummm no. If this was Superman, it was the worst Superman ever created. Maybe Marvel gave us a better Zack Snyder Superman than Zack Snyder did. But this Ikaris is NOT Superman.

 

[gandlalf3]

What about Henry Cavill in that role? Who do you think is bigger mass wise?