The Dark Knight Rises Why is Dick Grayson NOT embraced?

[CConn]

A few reasons...

1). Robin - as portrayed by Dick Grayson - is very largely associated with gay stereotypes and jokes, thusly, peoples who aren't familiar with the comics, and Dick Grayson's actual personality, they assume him to be "gay" and little more.

2). It appears most Batman fans are terrified that a Batman movie even slightly resemble something for children or something that's anything but totally serious and painfully adult. Having a young teenager like Grayson in the film would/could make the film appear more for younger audiences.

3). Dick Grayson's inclusion into Joel Schumacher's movies further associate the character with ridiculousness and low-quality and campy stories.

Personally, I'm simply not a very big fan of Dick Grayson's personality at all. I'd have no problem with Robin in a film, but I'd much prefer it to be Tim Drake (a character I actually am quite a fan of).

 

[Two-Face]

If Nolan or another director does it TAS version like killer is Tony Zucco not Two-Face.

 

[The Kid]

Robin is a staple of the comics whether you people like it or not. I think he's an excellent character full of potential for drama between the Dark Knight and his young ward as he copes with being a superhero and father figure to someone who mirrors him. The beauty of the relationship is that batman tries to mold robin in his image but at the same time tries to heal him of the same darkness that consumed himself. It's really ****ed up ****.

 

[GregComicFan]

I also like the route that the DC Animated Universe took. From B:TAS, to The New Adventures of Batman, to Justice League/Unlimited, to Batman Beyond, the writers did a good job (especially in the finale "Epilogue") of showing that Bruce Wayne made a surrogate family (Alfred, Dick, Tim, Babs), but because they were not as obsessed as he was, he eventually pushes them all away and becomes/dies a very lonely, very great man.

So I think the tension between Bruce/Dick is interesting. He brings him in to re-create his family, but ends up pushing him away because Dick doesn't grow up to be as obsessed as he is.

 

[Sun_Down]

Why is Dick Grayson not embraced by this one director? Simple. Because we've only scratched the surface of Batman as a character. Think about it. Begins gave us a good insight into the why and how of Bruce becoming Batman. But we've yet to see really any of his Rogues, his detective skills, most of his gadgets or his general genius as a crimefighter. There's SO much Batman left to explore and people want to take time away from that for Robin? Seems kinda odd to me.

And even though I like Robin as a character, I've always thought that Batman was at his best when he was going it alone. Perhaps Nolan feels the same way.

 

[Cadetak4712]

The reasons why people dismiss Robin is because of his age, costume, and one-liners.

The age and costume issue can easily be fixed. Robin doesn't need to be a little kid he just needs to be young. I would put him at around 18 or so...which means he's not really an adult but not a really a child either...needing guidance but able to make decisions on his own.

They can update or do whatever they want with the costume to make it fit into Nolan's universe.

As for the humor part, it is needed to a degree but that doesn't mean it has to be campy. I imagine Robin to be somewhat humorous out of the costume but when he puts it on he would get serious.

Overall though at this time Robin wouldn't fit into Nolan's universe at this time.
Batman himself is still young and Robin isn't needed from a story perspective at this point.

We won't see Robin for the third movie but if there is a fourth I think that would be the time to introduce him. I would have the fourth movie take place a few years after the third anyways.

Robin is a important character and if this franchise goes past three movies he will have to be put in somewhere down the line...eventually people will just be asking "Where the hell is Robin?".

Its almost like not putting Mary Jane into a Spider-man franchise.

 

[wellsy]

We're talking Dick Grayson, not Robin.

Slight difference.

 

[MaskedManJRK]

A few reasons...

1). Robin - as portrayed by Dick Grayson - is very largely associated with gay stereotypes and jokes, thusly, peoples who aren't familiar with the comics, and Dick Grayson's actual personality, they assume him to be "gay" and little more.

Those immature little s**ts will already be making jokes with this franchise because the guy who's playing The Joker in it happened to play a gay cowboy once. Hell, the same s**ts would make fun of Christian Bale because of his role in Velvet Goldmine. Does that mean that neither should be in this franchise?

2). It appears most Batman fans are terrified that a Batman movie even slightly resemble something for children or something that's anything but totally serious and painfully adult. Having a young teenager like Grayson in the film would/could make the film appear more for younger audiences.

It's not like Robin would instantly make the movie a camp-fest. If the character is written well, and the story is written in a dark fashion, so will Robin.

3). Dick Grayson's inclusion into Joel Schumacher's movies further associate the character with ridiculousness and low-quality and campy stories.

I'm sorry, but that's just a s**t excuse.

Gordon was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean he shouldn't be in this?

Two-Face was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean he shouldn't be in this?

Hell, BATMAN was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean we shouldn't have a movie about him?

Excluding Robin because of those s**t movies pretty much eliminate every other character Batman has--including himself.

Personally, I'm simply not a very big fan of Dick Grayson's personality at all. I'd have no problem with Robin in a film, but I'd much prefer it to be Tim Drake (a character I actually am quite a fan of).

Then just give him Tim Drake's personality and call him Dick. Hell, Robin the Schumacher movies was pretty much an amalgamation of Dick and Jason Todd, anyway.

 

[griffolyon12]

Hi,

I think Nolan once mentioned Dick Grayson would never appear in any of his Batman films, and I think Christian Bale once mentioned he didn't like the idea of Robin at all. Then, on a lot of message boards, I notice fans do not embrace the idea of Robin in Batman Begins 3 (the third film in the triology) at all. So I'm just wondering...

why?

I dont care about Robin. What I'm talking about here is just "Dick Grayson", not "Robin". Why not introduce Dick Grayson in Batman Begins 3?

It's ironic/funny how Nolan cites The Long Halloween as a major influence on his Batman storyline, yet its sequel Dark Victory, which introduces Dick Grayson, is never mentioned at all.

I think introducing Dick Grayson (not Robin, just Dick Grayson) opens a plethora of exciting and interesting character development ideas for Bruce Wayne's character. To me, Dick has always been a fascinating character for Batman to bounce off of, because the writer can suggest Bruce is 1) trying to rebuild his family by making a surrogate family (Alfred as Bruce's father, Dick as Bruce's son, etc.) 2) Bruce needs Dick Grayson in order to not go over the edge. Bruce grows darker and darker in the role of Batman, but when he's forced to become a role model (for Dick), he's forced to mend his dark ways and become a positive role model. So in a way, Dick Grayson (having a surrogate son) keeps Bruce sane. 3) The end of isolation - I always found it interesting how Bruce discovers by accident a little boy who is EXACTLY like him (both Bruce and Dick's parents were murdered when they were very young). So this is a wake up call to Bruce - he's not alone...little kids have their parents/loved ones stolen from them every day. Bruce realizes he's not special. And because of this, Bruce begins to believe other kids have ever right as he does to make the world a less crime-driven place. So in other words, Bruce decides to take proteges and build an army of crime fighters.

So, as you can see, I think there's a lot that Dick Grayson offers Bruce Wayne, as far as character development and story potential. Not to mention, Dick Grayson by himself is an interesting character, but he'd offer the supporting cast a lot too.

So why do you think Nolan seems dead set against ever introducing him in the franchise?

I dont care about ever seeing a little boy in red and green spandex fighting Gotham criminals. But what I don't get is why introducing just Dick Grayson seems so .... out of the question/out of the realm of possibility.

thoughts?

Greg

I'd be all for it.I like the character of Dick/Robin if done right.I feel though Robin would never work in Nolan's realistic world,but Dick would.

 

[griffolyon12]

Whether most people want to believe it or not Robin is almost as big of a pop culture icon as Batman himself and leaving him out just doesn't make sense.Robin has been with Batman since Batman #1,that was the year 1940 and has endured.I think Robin if handled right could be really cool and add an extra emotional layer to the movies,and Nolan I feel could do it right which is why it makes me so upset that he probably wont include the character.I'm a Robin fan and just want to see the character done justice(or maybe even just Dick),and I want it to happen in a Batman film and not a Teen Titans movie.But I have a feeling that most Robin fans will just have to wait until the next series of films to see him.

 

[Gotham22]

I like to see Dick Grayson. maybe appear in the 4th film and in the 5th film becomes Robin if a 4th and 5th film does happen. Every time I watch BB I see that little boy I think Jason Todd.

 

[FCEEVIPER]

I like Grayson in the comics and in animation just fine, but not in films.

I feel he doesn't work on the silver screen. imo

 

[Texas Zombie]

i like the nightwing character, what about a spin off

 

[ThaMuzicAddict]

I don't mind him. He's in a lot of the major stories that everyone likes and I don't think he compromises them at all. The only times he's gay and suggestive is when he's written that way and that was mostly in the 60s. I don't find him too gay lately... except for his costume.

I think the movies could tell his story in a way that's new and credible. Not Nolan's movies, but eventually if they wanted to introduce him again I wouldn't object.

And regarding Nightwing, I hear they're planning a Teen Titan movie with Nightwing instead of Robin. ...don't know how serious they are about it though.

 

[Texas Zombie]

I don't mind him. He's in a lot of the major stories that everyone likes and I don't think he compromises them at all. The only times he's gay and suggestive is when he's written that way and that was mostly in the 60s. I don't find him too gay lately... except for his costume.

I think the movies could tell his story in a way that's new and credible. Not Nolan's movies, but eventually if they wanted to introduce him again I wouldn't object.

And regarding Nightwing, I hear they're planning a Teen Titan movie with Nightwing instead of Robin. ...don't know how serious they are about it though.

new costume agree but they need to get better stories

 

[MaskedManJRK]

I don't mind him. He's in a lot of the major stories that everyone likes and I don't think he compromises them at all. The only times he's gay and suggestive is when he's written that way and that was mostly in the 60s. I don't find him too gay lately... except for his costume.

I think the movies could tell his story in a way that's new and credible. Not Nolan's movies, but eventually if they wanted to introduce him again I wouldn't object.

And regarding Nightwing, I hear they're planning a Teen Titan movie with Nightwing instead of Robin. ...don't know how serious they are about it though.

What's "gay" about the costume? I mean, I can kind-of get the original pixie-boots and booty shorts look, but the current costume is almost exactly what I'd want to see in a movie.

 

[Texas Zombie]

What's "gay" about the costume? I mean, I can kind-of get the original pixie-boots and booty shorts look, but the current costume is almost exactly what I'd want to see in a movie.

i would like an all black costume for a movie and moves like dardevil spiderman and batman combined
jumpin off walls stuff like that
he would act like a mix of batman and punisher

 

[CConn]

i would like an all black costume for a movie and moves like dardevil spiderman and batman combined
jumpin off walls stuff like that
he would act like a mix of batman and punisher

So, in short, he'd be a totally different character.

Yeah, that makes a whole lotta sense.

 

[CConn]

Those immature little s**ts will already be making jokes with this franchise because the guy who's playing The Joker in it happened to play a gay cowboy once. Hell, the same s**ts would make fun of Christian Bale because of his role in Velvet Goldmine. Does that mean that neither should be in this franchise?

It's not like Robin would instantly make the movie a camp-fest. If the character is written well, and the story is written in a dark fashion, so will Robin.

I'm sorry, but that's just a s**t excuse.

Gordon was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean he shouldn't be in this?

Two-Face was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean he shouldn't be in this?

Hell, BATMAN was in the Schumacher movies, does that mean we shouldn't have a movie about him?

Excluding Robin because of those s**t movies pretty much eliminate every other character Batman has--including himself.

You misunderstand.

I don't believe the reasons I listed to be at all rational or well made points against the character, I was simply explaining the actual reasons why most people have a problem with Dick/Robin. And yes, those reasons are ******ed.

Then just give him Tim Drake's personality and call him Dick.

But then he'd be Dick not Tim.

Yeah, that doesn't seem to make sense, but still.

Hell, Robin the Schumacher movies was pretty much an amalgamation of Dick and Jason Todd, anyway.

Dick was Dick in BF, Dick was Jason in B&R.

 

[Texas Zombie]

So, in short, he'd be a totally different character.

Yeah, that makes a whole lotta sense.

no keep him kinda the same but what he does when he is nightwing is like batman,the comic character(nightwing), and punisher. but mostly like the comic charcter

 

[MaskedManJRK]

i would like an all black costume for a movie and moves like dardevil spiderman and batman combined
jumpin off walls stuff like that
he would act like a mix of batman and punisher

No offence, man, but that sounds really dumb. If you have to change the character that much, then you shouldn't be involved in it in the first place.

So, in short, he'd be a totally different character.

Yeah, that makes a whole lotta sense.

Exactly, sir.

I am curious, however, if you have retorts to my post concerning your previous post.

 

[Texas Zombie]

No offence, man, but that sounds really dumb. If you have to change the character that much, then you shouldn't be involved in it in the first place.

what im sayin is he has to be bad*** and be in black

 

[CConn]

No offence, man, but that sounds really dumb. If you have to change the character that much, then you shouldn't be involved in it in the first place.

what im sayin is he has to be bad*** and be in black

Then you change the character.

Get out of town.

 

[CConn]

Exactly, sir.

I am curious, however, if you have retorts to my post concerning your previous post.

I beat you to it, ha.

And no reply?! Bah.

 

[MaskedManJRK]

You misunderstand.

I don't believe the reasons I listed to be at all rational or well made points against the character, I was simply explaining the actual reasons why most people have a problem with Dick/Robin. And yes, those reasons are ******ed.

Ah. I see what you mean.

But then he'd be Dick not Tim.

Yeah, that doesn't seem to make sense, but still.

No, it doesn't, but it's okay, I forgive ya.

Dick was Dick in BF, Dick was Jason in B&R.

But Jason wasn't gay.

...

Was he...?