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People at both by IMAX screenings cheered when "616" was revealed to be the MCU's designation. Not sure why anyone would think that's a bad thing or better yet expect the MCU not to be designated as 616.Eh, I don't get bogged down in things like that. Movies are movies, comics are comics, etc. So the movies call itself 616 now, that doesn't invalidate the comics books. They are 2 different things regardless
No. she isn’t dead, at least not in the permanent sense.Some speculate that she’ll make her return on the Agatha Disney Plus show. Nothing has been confirmed, but she is definitely coming back.So is Wanda dead or...?
I mean, even Spider-Verse, Peter B. Parker’s universe was designated as 616, and that clearly isn’t actually the same comic book 616 Peter Parker. 616 is just something that refers to the prime/main universe of a continuity’s multiverse. Nothing more. The movies and comics exist in different branches of the multiverse as far as I see it. So it’s fine.People at both by IMAX screenings cheered when "616" was revealed to be the MCU's designation. Not sure why anyone would think that's a bad thing or better yet expect the MCU not to be designated as 616.
If we're getting a bunch of stuff with Incursions/Kang/Doom/Beyonder I think that can be a bigger threat.Also, I really don't know how Marvel plans on introducing the next big threat in a believable fashion. They made Wanda/Scarlet Witch so OP in this film that it's difficult to believe anyone else could be portrayed as a bigger threat than her to the whole Multiverse.
If we're getting a bunch of stuff with Incursions/Kang/Doom/Beyonder I think that can be a bigger threat.
But also, I don't see why every threat should be bigger than the last. That just causes power creep and such. Better to just have a good story than to worry about constantly trying to raise the stakes further.
Because things just didn't get out of hand?I wonder why they cut the “Things just got out of hand” line that was in the trailer.
Yeah. She was real selfish when she crushed Vision's head or released the town at the end of WandaVision.
Tony and Vision tried, did not work. Agatha tried, again did not work. Who has pulled it off?
1. With the Darkhold destroyed some of her abilities that came from that will be gone or lessened, such as how she lost her abilities to view the multiverse and to dreamwalk when Sara destroyed the Darkhold.If Wanda comes back later on, then how do they make the likes of Kang/Doom/Galactus into serious threats if she's capable of defeating all of them without much effort?
In what way was Wanda brainwashed in AoU? Ultron lied to her about his intentions, but he didn't control her at all. And she and Pietro volunteered for Hydra's experiments as a path to getting revenge on Tony Stark. And also didn't really follow Strucker's orders very well, anyway.
Michael Waldron says that her fate is left ambiguous. He says he hopes she is not dead.So is Wanda dead or...?
If Wanda comes back later on, then how do they make the likes of Kang/Doom/Galactus into serious threats if she's capable of defeating all of them without much effort?
I don't think so, but only because she's a popular character. The fact that she's a loose cannon is a big part of what makes her so interesting (to me anyway).So is Wanda dead or...?
Who was Charlize Theron's character supposed to be? That mid-credits cameo lost me since I'm not very familiar with every Marvel character.
Who was Charlize Theron's character supposed to be? That mid-credits cameo lost me since I'm not very familiar with every Marvel character.
Dormammu’s niece and the daughter of Umar. This opens up some really cool storylines from the early Doctor Strange comics. Plus, if Charlize Theron is going to be in MCU, by definition, it’s a good movie.Clea, Sorceror Supreme of the Dark Dimension and traditionally the love of Dr. Strange's life.
Thats what the ending led us to believe. She'll likely be back but for all intents and purposes, she's deadSo is Wanda dead or...?
She's currently the Sorcerer Supreme in the books falling the death of Dr. StrangeDormammu’s niece and the daughter of Umar. This opens up some really cool storylines from the early Doctor Strange comics. Plus, if Charlize Theron is going to be in MCU, by definition, it’s a good movie.
I believe Clea was at times sorcerer supreme, but Dormammu was clearly the most powerful ruler of the dark dimension.
what makes you think it would be without effort? Do you know how powerful the likes of Kang, Galactus and/or Doom are in the MCU?If Wanda comes back later on, then how do they make the likes of Kang/Doom/Galactus into serious threats if she's capable of defeating all of them without much effort?
yeah it was a big WTF and has to be one of the worst post credit scene from any of the films bc of what preceeded itYeah, I hated the post-credit scene, but mostly because it ruined Raimi's ending. Instead, they could have shown Clea watching Strange through some sort of portal in the Dark Dimension, establishing who she is and where she's from, before she's heads off to retrieve him. That would have accomplished the same things without undercutting the last shot of the actual movie.
Hmmmmmm.... i kind of agree and kind of disagree with you there.
I guess we can say that the Darkhold certainly amplified her negative aspects.
Its tough, because in AOU she's on a revenge trip, and sets an enraged Hulk loose in a populated area, which probably resulted in hundreds of casualties. Her actions are villainous, no question
Sure, she's manipulated by Ultron, but she still does some pretty nasty stuff. She does draw the line at wiping out humanity, which is why she starts helping the Avengers, and after that she acts heroically for a while - and shows genuine remorse for accidentally killing those Wakandans in Nigeria ( Civil War).
Later she helps the Avengers fight Thanos and sacrifices Vision for the greater good, because he asks her to - kind of got the feeling that if he hadn't, she would never have done something like that simply for the greater good itself.
Of course she cant deal with the grief and enslaves a town - straight up villain move there.
I think Wanda's biggest flaw is selfishness and being overly emotional. She'll do heroic things as long as she feels good about it, and it aligns with her interest but she's kind of weak - that she's easily manipulated and when things are difficult she'll use her powers to do whatever makes her feel better, and isnt really willing to accept responsibility for the consequences of her evil actions.
All in all I'd say Wanda is a very relatable and complex character because she's deeply flawed and capable of both good and bad ( really bad) actions. I mean, most people given that kind of power would probably misuse it as Wanda does.
Her arc is definitely an interesting one, and she's probably the best developed character of phase 4.
A brainwashed villain though. My take on her is that she has always been somewhat fragile psychologically and it started with the early brainwashing. I think she's "basically" a good, caring person (although the good part rather split), but is a loose cannon when things get difficult. Her compass is kind of screwed up.
but why? I can understand not wanting her to be a superhero again but why should she remain a villian? What would even be her motivation?With Ultron and Strucker I agree, she was brainwashed. At this point she's too far gone. She needs to stay a villain.
She'll likely pop up in Agatha's show in some capacityI wonder if they might shelve her until X-men? I kind of think she’s too popular of a character to wait that long.
If Wanda comes back later on, then how do they make the likes of Kang/Doom/Galactus into serious threats if she's capable of defeating all of them without much effort?
Fair enough. Also thank you for being civil and not hostile.
Does she end up as a villain in MOM, absolutely- but overall she's a complicated character, who does both heroic and monstrous things.
I think that was the case as I was watching the movie. It reminded me of what the scientist in CA:TFA said about the serum amplifying what's already there. I took it as that with Wanda because Strange does use the Darkhold at the end and while there's consequences to him using it, I doubt it corrupted him.
I agree with all the above. My post wasn't directed to you tbh but my main point was Wanda was introduced in the MCU as a villain. And tbh, I only know surface level stuff about Wanda when it comes to the source material but from what I know, yeah she's unhinged, emotional and makes irrational decisions. After she killed Vision in IW, I knew it was all downhill from there.
I agree. She truly did love Vision and if I can project here, I think if Thanos hadn't used the time stone in that moment, do you think she'd have been a villain regardless? I mean she had to see him die again after killing him and that just adds to her trauma.
I think she was always gonna go down that route anyways. Now with the X-Men in the MCU (depending on how soon they introduce them), it's pure chaos from here on out.
Ditto. Well said. I mean she was cold af in this movie goddamn.
Agreed with all of this. I can see people having problems with the character and her arc but to say it's not well established or she did a 180 I totally disagree with those people.
Do you think they'll give her a redemption? I hope not. She needs to be a villain going forward. There's no coming back from what she did in MoM.
With Ultron and Strucker I agree, she was brainwashed. At this point she's too far gone. She needs to stay a villain.
but why? I can understand not wanting her to be a superhero again but why should she remain a villian? What would even be her motivation?
She'll likely pop up in Agatha's show in some capacity