Is Sabretooth the son of Dog Logan?

[squeekness]

Wait, is that the arc that Loeb wrote? The one where he tries to say that Logan and Sabes are descended from Wolves? I don't even aknowlege that arc, that idea was horrible.

Yes it was, but actually enjoyed that arc very much even if was a bit.. implausible.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Loeb's not a bad writer, he's written some of the best Batman stories out there (in my opinion) I just didn't like the whole wolf angle. I mean, why don't we just have Wolverine's origin revert back to a mutated Wolverine like Stan wanted?

I've never been a fan of the mutated from animals origin theme. Even though that's not exactly what Loeb said, it was along the same lines.

 

[Congo Jack]

Loeb's not a bad writer, he's written some of the best Batman stories out there (in my opinion) I just didn't like the whole wolf angle. I mean, why don't we just have Wolverine's origin revert back to a mutated Wolverine like Stan wanted?

Stan didn't want that - he was the one who stopped Wolverine from being a mutated Wolverine. One of many things that I'm thankful to Stan for.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Stan didn't want that - he was the one who stopped Wolverine from being a mutated Wolverine. One of many things that I'm thankful to Stan for.

You're right, I got it mixed around. My bad.

 

[Gallagher]

I read through Origin last night for the first time.

In my mind Dog was Sabes. Even the name Dog suggests the animality that manifests itself later on. The savagery was present, the looks, the ability to track, the pure hatred for Wolverine.

Granted this is all just my opinion, I'm not trying to persuade anyone to think otherwise, I'm just throwing in what I think.

 

[cerealkiller182]

I always saw Rose, Smitty,and Dog to be early archetypes that Jean, Xavier, and Sabes would later be forced into by Wolvies subconscious.

 

[experiment x]

For some reason I always got the impression that the Logan and Creed famlies came together with Thomas Logan and Elizabeth (Creed) Howellet. that idea came after Jenkins stated that Dog was not intended to be Sabretooth. Its just one impression I got.

 

[ant3ros]

I always saw Rose, Smitty,and Dog to be early archetypes that Jean, Xavier, and Sabes would later be forced into by Wolvies subconscious.

Exactly, those feelings were buried in his subconscious while he had amnesia. Dog isn't Sabretooth.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Exactly, those feelings were buried in his subconscious while he had amnesia. Dog isn't Sabretooth.

Well, we can't state that as a fact since we don't know for sure.

I've also heard about the whole archetypes thing. I personally never really liked it. I don't mind if a few characters are archetypes for people he would later meet. (Rose explaining his love for Jean, Smitty being the archetype for Xvaier/Scott and explaining Wolverine's anger at authoritive types) But I thought it felt a little too scripted that Wolverine encountered archetypes for every character he feels strongly for.

Not only that, but I think it's a waste to have Dog only function as an archetype for Sabertooth. Making Dog Sabertooth would add quite a bit to Sabertooth's character.

 

[ant3ros]

Well, we can't state that as a fact since we don't know for sure.

I've also heard about the whole archetypes thing. I personally never really liked it. I don't mind if a few characters are archetypes for people he would later meet. (Rose explaining his love for Jean, Smitty being the archetype for Xvaier/Scott and explaining Wolverine's anger at authoritive types) But I thought it felt a little too scripted that Wolverine encountered archetypes for every character he feels strongly for.

Not only that, but I think it's a waste to have Dog only function as an archetype for Sabertooth. Making Dog Sabertooth would add quite a bit to Sabertooth's character.

The fact is that Dog wasn't stated as Sabretooth. So until he is revealed to grow up into Sabretooth, it is safe to safe Dog is his own character, separate from Sabretooth. The archetypes thing isn't just to explain Wolverine's interest in people. It makes his current relationships have more meaning. I mean it's something everyone can relate to. I'm attracted to certain kinds of girls and they all remind me a little about my first crush. Same deal.

In my opinion, if Dog is eventually revealed as Sabretooth, that would be too convenient and far fetched. Wolverine has been all over the place and live a long life, but somehow Sabretooth ends up being that close to him from the start. I don't think it's a waste. It's interesting to me if Wolverine sees bits of his childhood friend in a merciless killer who doesn't deserve it.

 

[experiment x]

If Dog is independant of Sabretooth I would really be interested in finding out what became of Dog after Origin. I wish Marvel would take the time to craft a worthy sequal to Origin. I would also like to see if John Howellet Jr. will show up in the 616 continuity. I think John will end up being Romulus from the evolution arc in Wolverine.

 

[TheVileOne]

Dog being Sabretooth would be the least convenient and far fetched thing to ever happen in the Marvel universe in like 20 years.

ant3ros, I don't mean to sound like a jerk, but have you been asleep to some of the craziest and dumbest crap that editorial has allowed or mandated in the past several years alone?

Nothing is too convenient or far fetched in a comic universe where some of the most weird out wacky crap to ever be printed has happened. Dog being Sabretooth would make more sense than anything else I've seen from Marvel for a long time.

Do you guys know what happens with Wolverine now? Wolverine can lose his ENTIRE HEART and grow it back. He was blown away to skeleton in an explosion and it all grew back in MINUTES. This all happened months ago or last year.

So all the crap about Dog being Sabretooth not working or not making sense is getting tiresome.

 

[Infinity9999x]

The fact is that Dog wasn't stated as Sabretooth. So until he is revealed to grow up into Sabretooth, it is safe to safe Dog is his own character, separate from Sabretooth. The archetypes thing isn't just to explain Wolverine's interest in people. It makes his current relationships have more meaning. I mean it's something everyone can relate to. I'm attracted to certain kinds of girls and they all remind me a little about my first crush. Same deal.

In my opinion, if Dog is eventually revealed as Sabretooth, that would be too convenient and far fetched. Wolverine has been all over the place and live a long life, but somehow Sabretooth ends up being that close to him from the start. I don't think it's a waste. It's interesting to me if Wolverine sees bits of his childhood friend in a merciless killer who doesn't deserve it.

Well it all comes down to opinion, but I always felt that the archetypes idea was just too contrived. Like I said, I don't mind if a few characters are archetypes for latter ones, but to have Wolverine meet an archetype for basically every person that would play a major role later in his life just felt too contrived too me. It's an artistic choice I never really liked.

And like Vile said, Dog being Sabertooth is not nearly as far fetched as some of the things that have happened in comics before this. And I agree with you in one aspect. Sabertooth has been close to Wolverine from the start, and I prefer it if it's the very start.

I also think it makes more sense for the character of Sabertooth, and it could open up many doors for the character. Sabertooth has grown a bit stale over the years, and revealing him to be Dog could open up new doors to explore for writers.

 

[ant3ros]

Well it all comes down to opinion, but I always felt that the archetypes idea was just too contrived. Like I said, I don't mind if a few characters are archetypes for latter ones, but to have Wolverine meet an archetype for basically every person that would play a major role later in his life just felt too contrived too me. It's an artistic choice I never really liked.

And like Vile said, Dog being Sabertooth is not nearly as far fetched as some of the things that have happened in comics before this. And I agree with you in one aspect. Sabertooth has been close to Wolverine from the start, and I prefer it if it's the very start.

I also think it makes more sense for the character of Sabertooth, and it could open up many doors for the character. Sabertooth has grown a bit stale over the years, and revealing him to be Dog could open up new doors to explore for writers.

Every person?... more like 3 people. Dog being Sabretooth is far-fetched considering the care of attention Wolverine's origin was written under. Did Origin seem like a far-fetched story? No, it was pretty solid and rational. There was a lot of thought put into it.

Also, the most obvious evidence is Dog has dark brown hair, almost black hair. Sabretooth is a blonde. Please don't tell me his mutation makes him blonde.

 

[TheVileOne]

Hair color is irrelevant in the Marvel Universe.

Do you know how many times Wolverine's eye color has changed? His eyes have been everything from black, to blue, to brown, to just about every color.

 

[experiment x]

In my family that was common for the kids. My hair started out red when I was a kid and changed to black by the time I was twenty. My brother was blonde as a child and his hair also changed to black in adulthood.

 

[wolfboy]

Hmm, I'll jump in on this. Let's face the facts.

Paul Jenkins said he didn't intend for Dog to end up being Sabretooth.

Since no other writer has clarified or written about Dog especially in relation to Sabretooth, there is no link between those two characters.

Any assumption that Dog is Sabretooth would be no more than wishful fan theory. It may so happen that a writer will decide to choose that origin for Sabretooth, but until then there is no official basis.

The only clear, undeniable thing is that there is no link between Dog and Sabretooth. It has yet to be written. It's like how many people guessed Wolverine's birth place was Japan or elsewhere. They can make their own opinions, but Marvel has the official voice. That voice has been silent in regards to Dog and Sabretooth.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Every person?... more like 3 people. Dog being Sabretooth is far-fetched considering the care of attention Wolverine's origin was written under. Did Origin seem like a far-fetched story? No, it was pretty solid and rational. There was a lot of thought put into it.

Also, the most obvious evidence is Dog has dark brown hair, almost black hair. Sabretooth is a blonde. Please don't tell me his mutation makes him blonde.

I really don't think that Dog being Sabertooth would be far fetched at all. It fits easily really.

For one, Sabertooth has always seemed to hate Logan intensely, more then any other of Wolverine's villains. He obviously has some sort of deep seeded hatred for him. It would make a lot of sense if that dates back to the relationship dog had with young Wolverine. Dog was jealous of what James had. James had a father who loved him, a mother, he was rich, and most of all, James is always around the girl Dog had a crush on.

Second, Sabertooth has memories of an abusive father, but we obviously don't know how accurate those memories are because of Weapon X. Dog had an abusive father. Weapon X is known for taking memories and tweaking them a bit, so it's not too hard to see that they could have done the same thing there.

Thirdly, Sabertooth has made it a point to try and destroy almost anything good in Wolverine's life, especially his girlfriends. This would make sense if he was still harboring deep seeded feelings of jealousy because Wolverine had all the things he didn't as a boy. Not only that, but Wolverine had the attention of the girl Sabertooth (if he was Dog) had a crush on, so Sabertooth tries to take away every girl Wolverine ever has.

And the hair color actually supports my theory.

That doesn't look like black hair to me. In fact, it looks very similar to the dirty blond hair Sabertooth sports.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Hmm, I'll jump in on this. Let's face the facts.

Paul Jenkins said he didn't intend for Dog to end up being Sabretooth.

Since no other writer has clarified or written about Dog especially in relation to Sabretooth, there is no link between those two characters.

Any assumption that Dog is Sabretooth would be no more than wishful fan theory. It may so happen that a writer will decide to choose that origin for Sabretooth, but until then there is no official basis.

The only clear, undeniable thing is that there is no link between Dog and Sabretooth. It has yet to be written. It's like how many people guessed Wolverine's birth place was Japan or elsewhere. They can make their own opinions, but Marvel has the official voice. That voice has been silent in regards to Dog and Sabretooth.

Yes, there is no definite answer to Dog or Sabertooth, and I'm not trying to say that I think Sabertooth is Dog and that there is no arguing about it. It's only my preference.

I would like it if Sabertooth turns out to be Dog. I think it furthers the character and explains the deep link he has with Logan even more.

I'm not saying I'm right, I'm just saying it's what I prefer. But it also doesn't mean I'm wrong either. There is no link between Sabertooth and Dog right now (besides the inferences one can make) but there is also nothing to contradict a link between them.

 

[wolfboy]

How come Dog's face scar doesn't heal? If Dog was Sabretooth, wouldn't it have healed immediately?

Do you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

 

[Infinity9999x]

How come Dog's face scar doesn't heal? If Dog was Sabretooth, wouldn't it have healed immediately?

Do you believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

We addressed this a while back. Mutations don't always come in one package. Usually they take affect at puberty, but it's possible for them to take affect later. It's very possible that Dog (if he is indeed Sabertooth) didn't develop his mutation until later in life. At that point in Origins he wasn't any older then his early twenties anyways.

And really, Dog could very well have already had his other mutations developing. He's already as big as Sabertooth (or at least he's drawn about that size in Origins) and he seems very strong. Not only that, but he displayed the same expert tracking abilities Sabertooth displays, being able to track Logan out into the Canadian wilderness with no other lead then a train ticket. Dog also may have even already had an accelerated healing ability, but it just hadn't grown as powerful as it would later become. It may have only been able to quickly heal small wounds, but not completely repair deep tissue damage.

 

[TheVileOne]

What Paul Jenkins intended means nothing.

Do you know what J. Michael Stracynski intended? He intended Peter Parker to have fathered Gwen Stacy's two twins. Also he intended at the end of his Amazing Spider-man run to retcon the Gwen Stacy/Norman Osborn affair and the Stacy twins.

The road to hell is pathed through good intentions.

Once again, until there is irrefutable proof saying Dog is not Sabretooth, then I will continue believing he was Sabretooth.

Jenkins could also be lying.

 

[the dmg]

We addressed this a while back. Mutations don't always come in one package. Usually they take affect at puberty, but it's possible for them to take affect later. It's very possible that Dog (if he is indeed Sabertooth) didn't develop his mutation until later in life. At that point in Origins he wasn't any older then his early twenties anyways.

And really, Dog could very well have already had his other mutations developing. He's already as big as Sabertooth (or at least he's drawn about that size in Origins) and he seems very strong. Not only that, but he displayed the same expert tracking abilities Sabertooth displays, being able to track Logan out into the Canadian wilderness with no other lead then a train ticket. Dog also may have even already had an accelerated healing ability, but it just hadn't grown as powerful as it would later become. It may have only been able to quickly heal small wounds, but not completely repair deep tissue damage.

I'm pretty sure that healing factors have always been a secondary mutation, so this is pretty plausible. Mutations can also manifest when the person's life is in danger, so Dog could have been dead when Wolverine left with the mutation having kicked in to save him.

 

[experiment x]

Personnally I always preferred Sabretooth to be a lot older than Wolverine. It gives him the upper hand in their fights but if he is Dog then that does give the emotional impact of brother vs. brother that doesent come any other way now that Creed as Logan's father has been dispelled.

 

[the dmg]

Personnally I always preferred Sabretooth to be a lot older than Wolverine. It gives him the upper hand in their fights but if he is Dog then that does give the emotional impact of brother vs. brother that doesent come any other way now that Creed as Logan's father has been dispelled.

While it's true that there is no father-son relationship, it was never ruled out that they are half-brothers or related in some way.