Shang Chi and Iron Fist (SPOILERS)

[WBwins]

Watched the move and loved it

However I cant but notice that the movie took some elements of Iron Fist origin and added them to Shang Chi.

For example Shang Chi in the comic becomes a Hero by joining MI6 as a secret agent

In the movie however

Shang Chi is now a Warrior of a Mystical Asian city in another Dimension Guarded by a Dragon. He practices a Magical Martial art that originated from the Dragon.

All of this changes is straight from Iron Fist comic story.

It seems to me that Marvel has decided to swap origin story elements for Shang Chi with Iron Fist.

If Im correct that means that when the MCU reboot of Iron Fist happens,he wont become the protector of an Asian Magical city. Rather he will be an MI6 agent just like Shang chi was in the comics.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

Maybe Feige decided the MCU didn't need two different martial arts themed heroes, especially when the other one uses the "white savior" trope, which I imagine Disney sees as less than ideal in the modern social climate.


At any rate, I definitely think that if the MCU brings in Iron Fist, he won't be some white dude protecting a magical Asian city.

 

[Iceman]

It worked well for me and maybe part of the reason is that they are planning Iron Fist without that background. I’d like to see a future Iron Fist interact with Shang Chi and get some martial arts scenes together.

 

[MbJ]

I suspect that like Eternals and the Inhumans, part of the impetus for this may have been just how badly received the Iron Fist TV show was. So they may just have folded some of those elements into Shang-Chi's origin since we probably won't be seeing Danny Rand in the MCU anytime soon.

 

[metaphysician]

I suspect that like Eternals and the Inhumans, part of the impetus for this may have been just how badly received the Iron Fist TV show was. So they may just have folded some of those elements into Shang-Chi's origin since we probably won't be seeing Danny Rand in the MCU anytime soon.

Pretty much my take, as well. Though I do note that while they borrowed some thematic territory, they didn't actually directly steal specific elements. Thus, if they wanted to introduce Kun Lun or Iron Fist, they could do so ( presumably as other remnants of the old civilization, though it'd probably be less "city" and more "monastery with outlying villages" ).

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

feige said in way older interviews that he loved iron fist and hopefully if things went well we might get a dr strange, black panther, and iron fist movies down the line

then the netflix deal happened with ike, and well.....lol

i'm sure feige still had some ideas and folded them into shang-chi..when they were talking about the mystical cities (i know it's a common cliche) but i couldn't help but think of the brubaker/fraction run of iron fist with the capital cities of heaven

 

[TheVileOne]

I definitely got some heavy Iron Fist comic vibes in the second half of this movie. But things like Ta Lo were in the comics as well.

Also, they used the wrong monster as a final boss.

Spoiler

Ying Nan (Michelle Yeoh) did speak about I think something to the effect of how spread out the world of Ta Lo used to be. I took that as meaning maybe there could be other hidden cities or worlds hidden behind our own that are also like K'un L'un.

Not sure if we will ever see Iron Fist get an MCU revival. But honestly, I'm fine if it doesn't for now so we can avoid all the Mighty Whitey/white savior stuff. It's tiresome. And then if they recast Danny Rand with someone who is a minority or mixed race, people will rage out as well.

 

[Punisher_MAX]

He sucked in MK but Lewis Tan should definitely be looked at for Danny Rand.

 

[Detective Conan]

I really don’t think we’ll ever see Iron Fist in the MCU. Shang-Chi is more or less his replacement as the MCU’s martial arts master.

 

[metaphysician]

Eh, they could use Iron Fist, its just he would ultimately be a secondary character in the Martial Arts World to Shang Chi, someone who shows up in group fights or tournaments or whatnot, as champion of a different 'city' than Ta-Lo. He's a different enough character to be distinct, both in personality and fighting style.

That said, I've said it before and I'll say it again: Danny Rand really does need to be a white dude. Two of his more defining character traits are "Is a complete outsider growing up in Kun-Lun" and "Is a privileged rich white dude whose best friend is a streetwise black ex-con". If you are going to deemphasize or abandon both aspects, you might as well just use a completely different martial arts character.

 

[Punisher_MAX]

Eh, they could use Iron Fist, its just he would ultimately be a secondary character in the Martial Arts World to Shang Chi, someone who shows up in group fights or tournaments or whatnot, as champion of a different 'city' than Ta-Lo. He's a different enough character to be distinct, both in personality and fighting style.

That said, I've said it before and I'll say it again: Danny Rand really does need to be a white dude. Two of his more defining character traits are "Is a complete outsider growing up in Kun-Lun" and "Is a privileged rich white dude whose best friend is a streetwise black ex-con". If you are going to deemphasize or abandon both aspects, you might as well just use a completely different martial arts character.

He doesnt NEED to be a white dude, he can easily be as much an outsider as an Asian minority who grew up in a white dominated world who ends up not knowing what to do with his "privilege" because he is of two vastly different worlds. It works just fine if he is mixed Asian or something.

 

[NotNickFury]

At this point, I say just introduce Iron Fist and Luke Cage together. Especially if there's no guarantee that the Netflix folks come back, beyond Cox since many say or claim that he's in No Way Home. Do a Heroes for Hire film. It'd be a nice change of pace to have a team-up film, rather than on a solo character. Then if it does well, you spin the two off into their individual corners.

Especially with the similarities to Shang-Chi, having Danny partnered with someone else would help differentiate him.

 

[WBwins]

I think that Iron fist should lose the Asian mythology and leave it all to Shang chi.


Iron Fist can revolve around Irish Mythology instead. That way Danny rand can still be white

 

[NotNickFury]

I think that Iron fist should lose the Asian mythology and leave it all to Shang chi.


Iron Fist can revolve around Irish Mythology instead. That way Danny rand can still be white

They do that and I'm going to demand that he be referred to as the Immortal Blarney Fist.

 

[WBwins]

They do that and I'm going to demand that he be referred to as the Immortal Blarney Fist.

Good one

 

[TheVileOne]

I think that Iron fist should lose the Asian mythology and leave it all to Shang chi.


Iron Fist can revolve around Irish Mythology instead. That way Danny rand can still be white

Yeah I don't think that's gonna work out.

 

[henzINNIT]

Iron Fist can revolve around Irish Mythology instead. That way Danny rand can still be white

You could keep Finn Jones too. Say he was using an ancient form of drunken Irish boxing the whole time.

 

[Iceman]

I really don’t think we’ll ever see Iron Fist in the MCU. Shang-Chi is more or less his replacement as the MCU’s martial arts master.

The MCU seems to be happy with having multiple characters with similar abilities and seeing how those play off each other. The original 6 will all soon have equivalents to take on the mantle for a while. Iron Man in fact will have had War Machine and Rescue as well as the upcoming Ironheart. Who knows given the rate the MCU is expanding.

 

[Iceman]

You could keep Finn Jones too. Say he was using an ancient form of drunken Irish boxing the whole time.

Even the Irish don't drink that much lol.

 

[metaphysician]

While I do find the idea of introducing Irish Fianna as western kung fu warriors appealing, its 100% unnecessary. Iron Fist's abilities really don't overlap meaningfully with Shang-Chi, beyond "is a super kung fu warrior".

 

[eon001]

Watched the move and loved it

However I cant but notice that the movie took some elements of Iron Fist origin and added them to Shang Chi.

For example Shang Chi in the comic becomes a Hero by joining MI6 as a secret agent

In the movie however

Shang Chi is now a Warrior of a Mystical Asian city in another Dimension Guarded by a Dragon. He practices a Magical Martial art that originated from the Dragon.

All of this changes is straight from Iron Fist comic story.

It seems to me that Marvel has decided to swap origin story elements for Shang Chi with Iron Fist.

If Im correct that means that when the MCU reboot of Iron Fist happens,he wont become the protector of an Asian Magical city. Rather he will be an MI6 agent just like Shang chi was in the comics.

Shang Chi and the Eternals are Feige's surrogates for Iron Fist and Inhumans. He couldn't get his hands on the A list characters so he's once again, working his magic on the C listers.

Inhumans and Iron Fist really needed the big screen treatment.

 

[WBwins]

While I do find the idea of introducing Irish Fianna as western kung fu warriors appealing, its 100% unnecessary. Iron Fist's abilities really don't overlap meaningfully with Shang-Chi, beyond "is a super kung fu warrior".

The issue isn't with abilities.

The Issue is that the MCU shang chi has taken some key elements from Iron Fists origin and placed it in Shang chi.
So an Iron fist reboot will feel like a Rehash if the origin is faithful to the comics.

 

[metaphysician]

The issue isn't with abilities.

The Issue is that the MCU shang chi has taken some key elements from Iron Fists origin and placed it in Shang chi.
So an Iron fist reboot will feel like a Rehash if the origin is faithful to the comics.

I mean. . . not really? Shang-Chi isn't an orphan, he wasn't raised his entire life in a monastery, he wasn't a cultural outsider, he didn't gain powers by fighting a dragon, he didn't return to the world to find a life of wealth and privilege waiting for him, his primary superhuman schtick isn't "magic super punch". About the only thing they have in common is "lost a parent", "kung fu magic world", and "wanted revenge". Which are. . . super common themes to the point that any number of characters share some of them.

 

[Mike Murdock]

It definitely felt like there were some elements of Iron Fist borrowed for this movie but certainly no more than what was borrowed from the Mandarin. There's a mystic land in another dimension, but it isn't Kun Lun (and Ta-Lo is from Marvel comics so this isn't Kun Lun with a different name). There's a dragon but the dragon isn't used the same way and Shang-Chi doesn't get his powers from the dragon. The closest we get is there's a comment that he has the heart of a dragon or something like that.

After this movie, it's hard to imagine that Iron Fist could compare. Honestly, if they make him Asian to try to distance himself from the problematic elements, he'll be completely redundant. I suppose they could cast an Asian actor in a Heroes for Hire movie just to avoid questions about why there's a white guy doing martial arts, but I think they can just call him out for his privilege and address it rather than recast and ignore it.

 

[Spider-Fan]

At this point, I say just introduce Iron Fist and Luke Cage together. Especially if there's no guarantee that the Netflix folks come back, beyond Cox since many say or claim that he's in No Way Home. Do a Heroes for Hire film. It'd be a nice change of pace to have a team-up film, rather than on a solo character. Then if it does well, you spin the two off into their individual corners.

Especially with the similarities to Shang-Chi, having Danny partnered with someone else would help differentiate him.

I think Heroes for Hire was made for D+ as a series. I think that would be it's best landing place as opposed to a movie.