The Amazing Spider-Man So now we've seen both, which was the best? - Part 1

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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]388591[/split]

 

[Silvermoth]

Raimi's Spiderman or Webb's? For me it's a no brainer. Raimi's was spectacular.

 

[spider-neil]

The CG of Spider-man was poor AT THE TIME. I remember watching in 2002 and being completely taken out of the movie when he starts running and jumping over rooftops and not ONE SCENE of that sequence couldn't have been done with practicle stunts.

 

[Spideyfan93]

Tell that to us people who were under 10 years old when it came out.

But then there are other sequences that have CGI and are seamless, like the burning apartment building when Spidey is avoiding Gobby's flying weapons. That little sequence is all CGI. And I didn't even know till 2 years ago.

 

[spider-neil]

Tell that to us people who were under 10 years old when it came out.

But then there are other sequences that have CGI and are seamless, like the burning apartment building when Spidey is avoiding Gobby's flying weapons. That little sequence is all CGI. And I didn't even know till 2 years ago.

When the CG is good it's really bad and when it's bad it's a disgrace.
As a movie I still think the climax is the best in any comic book movie I have seen. The end fight is brutal. Sure there have been better movies than SM but the climaxes leave me cool.
Bored by the climaxes of TDK, IM, SM2, X2, X:FC.
Great movies that peak in the middle whereas SM peaks at the end.

 

[Picard Sisko]

The CG of Spider-man was poor AT THE TIME. I remember watching in 2002 and being completely taken out of the movie when he starts running and jumping over rooftops and not ONE SCENE of that sequence couldn't have been done with practicle stunts.

There were only one or two scenes were the CGI was THAT bad. The scene with him chasing after Ben's killer (running into the alley, climbing up the wall, and some swinging) and a shot of Spider-Man trying to catch the tram car at the end of the movie. Those shots needed to be CGI, I don't see how these entire scenes could be practical. The movie is still one of my favorites, and the bad CGI doesn't ruin the experience at all.

The only time the movie could be ruined is if I'm watching with someone else who keeps pointing out the bad CGI to me. That could get really annoying. You can't ruin the illusion! lol

 

[Spiderdevil]

It was released in 2002,ofcourse the CGI would be of that level.Plus raimi had limited funds

Overall,Best origin movie ever,without a shadow of a doubt

 

[Spiderdevil]

I am the one who said 'it doesn't matter' if you're trying to say a hero and a villain is different because you clearly said if a movie is successful then such an interpretation of a character is the "best" version simply because a film is successful, and that's clearly not true.

A hero can be better and a villain can be better. We haven't seen PERFECT interpretations of any comic book character, hero or villain, but at least Nolan's Batman was much closer than Raimi's Green Goblin.

We dont need any perfect interpretations,we need interpretations perfect for the film which Dafoe's Goblin was
Its like saying Ledger's Joker wasnt perfect because he didnt fall into pit of chemicals

Once again, the idea that he just took said mask from his home is one of the most illogical things you've said.

Why is it illogical?

I am not being ridiculous actually because a giant lizard in New York should create equivalent amount of panic. You're ridiculous to suggest otherwise

It didnt because very few people actually saw the Giant Lizard in the first place while a ****load of them got exposed to the Gas in BB

 

[Anno_Domini]

It was released in 2002,ofcourse the CGI would be of that level.Plus raimi had limited funds

Overall,Best origin movie ever,without a shadow of a doubt

Second best.

We dont need any perfect interpretations,we need interpretations perfect for the film which Dafoe's Goblin was
Its like saying Ledger's Joker wasnt perfect because he didnt fall into pit of chemicals

Dafoe's Goblin wasn't perfect either and you only assume it is because the film is "successful".

And it's nothing like Ledger's Joker, because the origin fit to Nolan's hyper-realism basis for his characters. For Raimi's GG? The actual costume could have worked simply because a same kind of material was used with Spidey's costume and there is even an alien in Raimi's universe. Creating a goblin persona through a fascination of folklore is not that far of a stretch.

Why is it illogical?

You see nothing illogical about saying Norman Osborn found this:

Spoiler

in his home when all of his other masks looked like masks from cultures around the world?

A metallic green mask would be an oddball with his collection and would be illogical for him to possess.

It didnt because very few people actually saw the Giant Lizard in the first place while a ****load of them got exposed to the Gas in BB

It's called a television. It's called the radio.

And it's called mass hysteria when cops tell you to leave your home.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

Watched ASM on bluray twice this past weekend and also went back and watched SM1. I still prefer ASM...overall, it's the better movie imo.

 

[AF3619]

Watched ASM on bluray twice this past weekend and also went back and watched SM1. I still prefer ASM...overall, it's the better movie imo.

 

[LegendAssemble]

The problem with saying AMS is a better movie is you really need to be a big fan of Spider-Man to appreciate it. Like I've said it was a solid Spider-Man adventure but it was all over the place. A movie should have a solid theme that carries it beginning to end. Web did a good job directing Peter and it's a different take from the Raimi films, but it's just so weak as a stand alone film. It's not bad, it's definitely Captain America good, but this is Spider-Man it's not hard to make a really meaningful and emotional Spider-Man movie.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

The problem with saying AMS is a better movie is you really need to be a big fan of Spider-Man to appreciate it.

My wife is not a Spider-man fan and qualifies ASM as a better movie than SM1...and she has impeccable taste.

 

[AF3619]

My wife is not a Spider-man fan and qualifies ASM as a better movie than SM1...and she has impeccable taste.

My MOM and my SISTER said this was waaaaaaaaaay better than SM1

 

[Anno_Domini]

My brother enjoyed it more than any of Raimi's films.

So I don't know how one could say you'd have to be a Spidey fan to like TAS-M, lol.

I'm a Spidey fan and I only think TAS-M is better than S-M 3 myself, so it's not really a "you have to be a Spidey fan to like TAS-M" deal.

 

[AF3619]

My brother enjoyed it more than any of Raimi's films.

So I don't know how one could say you'd have to be a Spidey fan to like TAS-M, lol.

I'm a Spidey fan and I only think TAS-M is better than S-M 3 myself, so it's not really a "you have to be a Spidey fan to like TAS-M" deal.

is like saying that you have to know every single Avenger to enjoy the movie MANY of the general audience didn´t know many of the characters before the Marvel CU started , because not everyone has seen every movie

or you can´t Enjoy TDKR without knowing Batman, well in this case because is a little different from the comics(every movie based on comics is) but MOST of the people love this franchise

 

[Spiderdevil]

Second best.

Yeah I would agree that Iron Man has less flaws and is more perfect
But considering the iconic status and moments in SM1,the 'Wow' factor and how it totally changed the scene of the CB universe on the big screen.Best origin movie imo

Dafoe's Goblin wasn't perfect either and you only assume it is because the film is "successful".

I dont want any perfect interpretation,I want interpretations that are perfect for the film.Molina Doc Ock wasnt perfect either,but he was perfect for the film

And it's nothing like Ledger's Joker, because the origin fit to Nolan's hyper-realism basis for his characters. For Raimi's GG? The actual costume could have worked simply because a same kind of material was used with Spidey's costume and there is even an alien in Raimi's universe. Creating a goblin persona through a fascination of folklore is not that far of a stretch.

Its better for him to wear a pilot's suit,while wearing a mask resembling a Goblin's face which is a nice nod to his resemblance
Much more realistic

And please bring the symbiote into this to show the unrealism,keep SM3 out of it

You see nothing illogical about saying Norman Osborn found this:

Spoiler

in his home when all of his other masks looked like masks from cultures around the world?

A metallic green mask would be an oddball with his collection and would be illogical for him to possess.

No I dont think so
Not more illogical that a villian creating a skin tight costume

It's called a television. It's called the radio.

And it's called mass hysteria when cops tell you to leave your home.

The Lizard was never filmed by the media,we see the ****in bugle beggin for photos
And no matter how you twist,nothing causes more panic than ****loads of hallucinogenic gases released in the air

 

[Spiderdevil]

I consider the first hour of TASM the best first half in an origin movie to date.Serious

But the movie's quality just nosedived after that,only good things remaining were the school fight and the final 10 minutes(Uncle Ben's speech and all)
While SM1 was wonderful throughout the 2 hours and never had a dull moment

A different villian would have done a whole lot of good to TASM,I always knew Lizard wont be able to carry a film.Webb and co put to much confidence into a combined origin of the villian and hero theme which no one felt in the end

 

[Spider-X]

Let me start out by saying I'm in my late 20's and I'm a big fan of Spidey's and movies in general. I've been collecting the comics off and on since 2nd grade (skipped the clone saga...that killed me). I loved the Raimi movies when they came out, though they were cheesier than I'd wanted (but it was all the live action spidey we had and they were good movies all in all...until SM3, but we all know how that goes).

But I digress...To me it's pretty simple...they both have their strengths and weaknesses:

AMS
- Far better action
- Far better CGI
- Stronger acting
- More emotional and consistantly engaging
- Peter Parker/Spider-Man is edgy and handled much better in comparison to his comic book likeness
- Mechanical Webshooters (positive or negative depending on which side of the fence you stand on)
- Can be taken more seriously/not nearly as many cheesy parts
- In general, it's a smarter movie...there's more going on and you need to pay attention to catch some important details
- Story structure is clearly weaker
- Weaker villain
- For the younglings, it takes too long for Spidey to show up so it doesn't hold their attention as well (this comment comes from a woman working at my local Blockbuster...i'd already seen the movie twice, thoroughly enjoying it, and i ask her what movies she's seen lately and right off the bat she says "don't waste your time with ASM, that movie sucks...takes to long for SM to show up. My kid almost wanted to leave"...i can see her point, though i don't consider that a negative for the movie what so ever personally)

Raimi Spider-Man
- Much better/clearer story structure/movie flow
- more iconic scenes/memorable lines
- The Villain is handled better
- Very kid friendly
- Cheesy/hard to take seriously much (unless you're young)
- Weaker action
- Weaker CGI
- The love story scenes between Pete and MJ drag the movie pace and make me want to fast forward
- Socially ******ed Peter Parker who doesn't act as much like his comic book counterpart
- Organic Webshooters (positive or negative depending on which side of the fence you stand on)


Summary
I may not have touched on every main facet of each movie here...but to me, again, it's this simple:

Raimi's is, as far as general movie quality goes, a better (more well-rounded/cohesive) movie....though not by a massive margin. I also think the kids will like it more.

ASM is more like the comics (a massive plus in my book because of how much better the character of Peter Parker/Spider-Man is treated), has the superior main actor/Peter Parker and love interest/story, has more going on, and is more emotionally engaging. I also think that the general movie going public will like this one more.

So my ball is in Mark Webb's court. Though I wish ASM were a more cohesive/fleshed out movie, I still enjoy it more, and I'm optimistically looking forward to what Webb will do with the character next.

 

[Anno_Domini]

Yeah I would agree that Iron Man has less flaws and is more perfect
But considering the iconic status and moments in SM1,the 'Wow' factor and how it totally changed the scene of the CB universe on the big screen.Best origin movie imo

Once more, you're still talking about the second best origin film. Spider-Man and Iron Man are tied at 2nd.

I enjoy Spider-Man more and more these days(which is odd, but I guess it's me realizing how much the '02 film is superior to TAS-M) and it's becoming even with Iron Man's origin these days.

I dont want any perfect interpretation,I want interpretations that are perfect for the film.Molina Doc Ock wasnt perfect either,but he was perfect for the film

CB fans should want perfect, or at least near perfect interpretations and that's what can be said for Molina's Doc Ock, which can't be said for Dafoe's Green Goblin.

Its better for him to wear a pilot's suit,while wearing a mask resembling a Goblin's face which is a nice nod to his resemblance
Much more realistic

And please bring the symbiote into this to show the unrealism,keep SM3 out of it

Much more realistic? This isn't Webb's reboot that kept trying to push the "grounded" tone. This is Raimi's version which didn't have any limitations and having a better Green Goblin wouldn't have hurt. Instead, we only get a nod to the comics because of a dumb mask and just a green pilot suit the neck down. Pathetic.

And I will bring in S-M 3 when it's all in one universe.

No I dont think so
Not more illogical that a villian creating a skin tight costume

The things you say make me laugh. Thanks.

I suppose it's illogical to you for a hero to create a skin tight costume then, yes?

The Lizard was never filmed by the media,we see the ****in bugle beggin for photos
And no matter how you twist,nothing causes more panic than ****loads of hallucinogenic gases released in the air

The Lizard was filmed as he entered OsCorp. Didn't pay attention to the movie I see.

Although I'm not twisting anything. Panic is panic, fear is fear. Some gas shouldn't be the only reason to cause panic and mayhem.

I consider the first hour of TASM the best first half in an origin movie to date.Serious

But the movie's quality just nosedived after that,only good things remaining were the school fight and the final 10 minutes(Uncle Ben's speech and all)
While SM1 was wonderful throughout the 2 hours and never had a dull moment

A different villian would have done a whole lot of good to TASM,I always knew Lizard wont be able to carry a film.Webb and co put to much confidence into a combined origin of the villian and hero theme which no one felt in the end

You were talking about how you thought Spider-Man was the best origin film, but now TAS-M's first hour is the best in an origin film?

 

[<(o_o)>]

I like both.

I've only watched Amazing Spider-Man twice so far but feel that they could have focused a little more on Uncle Ben's death, both Peter & Aunt May seemed to get over it too easily or are just dealing with it in their own way that wasn't shown enough especially with Aunt May.

Field's Aunt May just seemed stupid in general. They didn't have to make her all preachy & everything like the Rosemary Harris Aunt May version in the original trilogy but they could have made her a little more wiser. When Peter would come home all beat to hell Field's Aunt May just acted like it was natural & wasn't very concerned about what happened or how he got like that either way.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

It was released in 2002,ofcourse the CGI would be of that level.Plus raimi had limited funds

Overall,Best origin movie ever,without a shadow of a doubt

Second best.

1. Batman Begins
2. Iron Man
3. Robocop (1987)
4. Superman (1978)
5. Spider-Man

 

[Spider-Aziz]

CB fans should want perfect, or at least near perfect interpretations and that's what can be said for Molina's Doc Ock, which can't be said for Dafoe's Green Goblin.

When it comes to Green Goblin persona he was near perfect, same goes for Norman loving his son. More faithful than Molina's Doc Ock
Can't say the same about the split personality part

 

[spider-neil]

Amazes me why Batman Begins is rated so highly, I was completely checked out of that movie for the entire 3rd act (THE ENTIRE THIRD ACT!!). TDK derserves all the praise it recieves but BB is just plain boring.

For superhero origins if I'm completely honest I'm going to give it to Iron Man but the 3rd act of that movie decends into a cliched mess.
Spider-Man (2002) starts slowly but ends with a bang and ASM has a weak 3rd act. Superman the Movie ends superbly but I wasn't engaged when he was Clark Kent. so...

1. IM
2. SM/ASM
3. Superman the movie
4. Batman Begins

Going back to BB, I'm not going to apologise for wanting great action in a superhero genre movie and the action in BB (car chase aside) is TERRIBLE and thus no WAY can I say BB is the best superhero origin movie. No chance.

 

[optimus2861]

ASM is more like the comics (a massive plus in my book because of how much better the character of Peter Parker/Spider-Man is treated),

ASM is more like the Ultimate comics. SM1 is more like the original comics. Since I was never much of a fan of the Ultimate comics (and I really disliked their spin on the "burglar runs past Peter" scene which was the basis for ASM's), I tend to come down on the other side of the "closer to the comics" opinion.

In any event, I know of no Peter Parker in any prior interpretation who revealed his secret ID to a girl he barely knows just so he can score a makeout session with her. That was my tipping point for the film; I just couldn't buy it after that.