The Daily Planet - Superman News and Speculation Thread

[SwordOfMorning]

I’ve been around this stuff for a long time too. There was a ton of negativity toward The Dark Knight for a time, people treated its tweaks to Joker like ****ing heresy. What really impressive, interesting franchise movie wasn’t kinda divisive? It remains divisive but the whole idea of Phillip’s Joker was an internet-wide laughing stock.

The Snyder movies were also closer to straight negative with a devoted minority than ‘divided’. You’re underestimating the incredibly good publicity this is going to get in the mainstream as well, especially if they nail the right director and star.

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

A divided fan base this early is meaningless. Fans are intensely conservative creatively. Any bold choice is divisive.

but it's better to have a united fan base

the only time i can remember the superman fanbase being truly united was when henry was announced as casting and kevin spacey being announced as lex back on returns.

right now the MCU fanbase is sitting pretty with all the announcements, if there is any doubt in them it always falls back to "in feige we trust" and quite frankly, he has delivered time and time again and has earned that trust against many odds; there's no way you can make cap relevant after what america is seen post-9/11, space viking gods? that's not gonna work. a tree and a racoon? directed by the dude who did slither? yeah ok. you're getting some directors from arrested development? to do action?!, etc and etc.

WB hasn't even give the fans what they want out of a superman film. snyder's version is obviously still very divisive. if i don't have faith in WB to deliver a proper superman film, which they haven't, why should a fan have any faith in this decision with JJ/Coates? the race angle is just putting lipstick on WB's pig. they haven't been able to deliver the core superman for over 2 generations

WB NEEDS a singular vision/dude in charge but JJ is def not it, and neither is Coates

 

[SwordOfMorning]

but it's better to have a united fan base

the only time i can remember the superman fanbase being truly united was when henry was announced as casting and kevin spacey being announced as lex back on returns.

right now the MCU fanbase is sitting pretty with all the announcements, if there is any doubt in them it always falls back to "in feige we trust" and quite frankly, he has delivered time and time again and has earned that trust against many odds; there's no way you can make cap relevant after what america is seen post-9/11, space viking gods? that's not gonna work. a tree and a racoon? directed by the dude who did slither? yeah ok. you're getting some directors from arrested development? to do action?!, etc and etc.

WB hasn't even give the fans what they want out of a superman film. snyder's version is obviously still very divisive. if i don't have faith in WB to deliver a proper superman film, which they haven't, why should a fan have any faith in this decision with JJ/Coates? the race angle is just putting lipstick on WB's pig. they haven't been able to deliver the core superman for over 2 generations

WB NEEDS a singular vision but JJ is def not it, and neither is Coates

Most fanbases are never united and trying to unite them is a fools errand, the MCU only mostly is because it's an at times suffocatingly uniform vision. If you like part of the MCU, you'll probably like all of it because all of them are to some extent of a piece with each other.

What fans want is a almost always a terrible thing to listen to. Most of the really, really great franchise movies are nothing like what fans were demanding at the time. Empire Strikes Back was divisive and controversial upon release, a big hunk of old school fandom was ****ing outraged at Wrath of Khan.

Fans have wildly specific ideas of what they want and fandom has only grown more toxic, entitled and possessive - no matter what you do, a huge portion of them will hate this movie because it isn't their ideal vision of a Reeve like Superman while a chunk will hate it because it's not Snyder and Cavill. Most fandoms will never be unified because they're made of sub-groups who don't want the same things.

Find writers and filmmakers with unique voices and visions. Let them do their thing. As a fan, I have faith in Coates because he's a better writer than almost anyone who has worked on a superhero film and I have faith in JJ as a producer because he has an incredible eye for things like casting, so his voice in the room is an awesome thing to have when you don't also then have to deal with his wonky storytelling.

 

[Eddie Dean]

Fan bases are divided until the trailer comes out and then are like "wow, just like I always said, I love this different choice!".

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I mean, hell, Batman fandom is sorta united on The Batman and even that has a portion of people who either hate it for not being Affleck or hate it for not being super fantastical.

I don't want all these franchises to be cloyingly dedicated to trying to please everyone and cater to fandom whims. It's actively embarrassing watching Star Wars do it and that's quite enough of that for me.

 

[writer0327]

The bigger the fanbase, the bigger the division. I don't think divided fanbases are a problem as long as they aren't trying to attack and cancel those they don't care for

 

[Longshot777]

I am all for a Black Superman and even a black Clark Kent. I am for fresher takes on all superheroes.

Just Do NOT say you CAN’T do the same thing to Spawn, Blade or White Panther!!! Because I’m down for race swapping there too. Since it’s NOT about race.

Do NOT SAY .... a white Spawn or a Chinese Blade is just NOT right. Even a South African Caucasian can dress up as a Black Panther. As long as the stories are great then I am down.

 

[dhandler01]

I mean...that bait attempt wasn't exactly subtle. What's next asking why there isnt a "White History Month"?

But if they made Blade Asian you wouldn't hear a complaint from me. I am not Black however.

 

[batman44]

I wonder how long WB takes to confirm whether it's Clark, Calvin, or Val. Possibly at Fandome 2 ( if they're doing that this year).

 

[Boy Scout]

I am all for a Black Superman and even a black Clark Kent. I am for fresher takes on all superheroes.

Just Do NOT say you CAN’T do the same thing to Spawn, Blade or White Panther!!! Because I’m down for race swapping there too. Since it’s NOT about race.

Do NOT SAY .... a white Spawn or a Chinese Blade is just NOT right. Even a South African Caucasian can dress up as a Black Panther. As long as the stories are great then I am down.

Yeah, no, not the same thing. If we lived in a world where black, whites, Latinos, Asians, Native Americans, and other races I’m probably forgetting were recognized on every level as equal, you’d be right. To your point: as far as I know, Blade and Spawn aren’t defined by their races, so in a perfect world where racial injustice didn’t exist, casting white actors to play them wouldn’t be a problem. But we don’t live in that world. Casting white actors for black characters necessarily undermines the idea and purpose of representation. We need more minority representation, not less, and not the amount that we have now. Since whites occupy a different space in culture - one that is, by design, superior to other races - putting them in roles assigned to POC, whether their race is important to their mythology or not, is an action that further supports the status quo. There’s no net gain for minorities in that scenario.

 

[Boy Scout]

I wonder how long WB takes to confirm whether it's Clark, Calvin, or Val. Possibly at Fandome 2 ( if they're doing that this year).

I suspect they didn’t clarify in the first place because they didn’t anticipate having to do so at all. Going with Clark is the obvious (and I’d bet from their perspective, only) choice. The logic? The General Audience knows Superman as Clark Kent, so it should be Clark Kent. I’d be excited for Calvin, but I’m expecting Clark.

 

[BobJM]

SUPERMAN
directed by J.D. Dillard
written by Ta-Nehisi Coates
produced by J.J. Abrams

Clark Kent / Superman: Stephan James

Lois Lane: Naomi Scott
Lana Lang: Taylor Russell

Lex Luthor: Bradley Cooper
Mercy Graves: Jodie Turner-Smith
Sgt. John Corben / Metallo: Glen Powell

Jonathan Kent: Denzel Washington
Martha Kent: Aunjanue Ellis
Pete Ross: Lewis Pullman

Jorel: David Oyelowo
Lara: Gugu Mbatha-Raw

Perry White: Nick Offerman
Jimmy Olsen: Finn Wolfhard
Cat Grant: Kelly Marie Tran
Ron Troupe: Rob Morgan

Dr. Emil Hamilton: Courtney B. Vance
Bibbo Bibbowski: Greg Grunberg

In my opinion, the only choice is Clark Kent as Superman—even if Coates & Abrams add in elements of Calvin Ellis’s story or use Val-Zod’s costume to further differentiate this version of Clark from past adaptations.

Use Mark Waid’s Birthright and Jeph Loeb & Tim Sale’s Superman For All Seasons as the base of the plot with elements of Grant Morrison’s Calvin Ellis story from Action Comics #9. And just a pinch of Geoff Johns and Gary Frank’s Secret Origin.

Clark Kent aspires to be an investigative reporter, blogging his travels as he exposes injustice around the world—fighting for truth, justice, liberty and equality. The assassination of a political revolutionary in Africa propels Clark to chase a lead back to Metropolis where he dons the cape and becomes Superman.

Corporate CEO Lex Luthor is the main antagonist, seeing Superman’s arrival in Metropolis as a challenge to his power and the status quo. Luthor tries to use the Daily Planet to turn the city against Superman after revealing that he’s an extraterrestrial, and “not one of us.”

Luthor discovers and then later perverts Kryptonian technology—in essence, Clark’s very culture/heritage/identity—to create an elaborate “alien invasion” to justify his state-of-the-art security force led by Sgt. John Corben to patrol the skies of Metropolis and replace Superman.

As in Superman for All Seasons, the story should bounce between Metropolis and Smallville with Clark seeking guidance from the Kents—especially after Lex Luthor calls him an alien—and still pining after his high school sweetheart, Lana.

The film is still pure Superman, and a skillful writer like Ta-Nehisi Coates can couch Luthor’s anti-Kryptonian rhetoric in the real-world racism and discrimination that Black Americans face every day in an eloquent & powerful way. Couple that with a security police force—directly funded by Luthor, the 1%—that is created to target beings like Superman and Coates has more parallels to draw from to further make this film stand out & really resonate with audiences.

comic sources / concept art

origin
https://******************.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/2019.11.27-01.40-******************-5dde7cd3b8474.jpg

costume

lois lane

lana lang

lex luthor

lexcorp

lexcorp security force

sgt. john corben / metallo

star labs

metropolis

 

[thangaran]

This is an interesting concept. Let’s see how it turns out. It would have been really great as well to have an Asian or South Asian as Superman at some point. I would love to see a South Asian (exception Kamala Khan) take on an iconic role

 

[Vaibow]

Yeah, no, not the same thing. If we lived in a world where black, whites, Latinos, Asians, Native Americans, and other races I’m probably forgetting were recognized on every level as equal, you’d be right. To your point: as far as I know, Blade and Spawn aren’t defined by their races, so in a perfect world where racial injustice didn’t exist, casting white actors to play them wouldn’t be a problem. But we don’t live in that world. Casting white actors for black characters necessarily undermines the idea and purpose of representation. We need more minority representation, not less, and not the amount that we have now. Since whites occupy a different space in culture - one that is, by design, superior to other races - putting them in roles assigned to POC, whether their race is important to their mythology or not, is an action that further supports the status quo. There’s no net gain for minorities in that scenario.

Don't get confused with western culture being the only culture.

Bollywood, successful... historic and culturally relevant - any diversity there?

China, need I say any more.

Korean... lol ok.

Hollywood - African American make up around 12% of the population in real time, there are other minorities and they have less a percentage, yet media and celebrities tell us western culture needs to be presented equally, not represented accurately and that African Americans are poorly represented.

NBA, NFL, MBL, MTV, day time tv, politicians.... very well represent diversity.
As Morgan Freeman once said... we stop talking about it, it'll go away. Make it American history, not just one month for black history.

Kids aren't born racist.

Identity politics, don't let it fool ya.

Peace out.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

No one said Hollywood was the only racist entertainment industry. I'm quite certain he was speaking of North America.

 

[Boy Scout]

No one said Hollywood was the only racist entertainment industry. I'm quite certain he was speaking of North America.

Yup.

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

Most fanbases are never united and trying to unite them is a fools errand, the MCU only mostly is because it's an at times suffocatingly uniform vision. If you like part of the MCU, you'll probably like all of it because all of them are to some extent of a piece with each other.

What fans want is a almost always a terrible thing to listen to. Most of the really, really great franchise movies are nothing like what fans were demanding at the time. Empire Strikes Back was divisive and controversial upon release, a big hunk of old school fandom was ****ing outraged at Wrath of Khan.

Fans have wildly specific ideas of what they want and fandom has only grown more toxic, entitled and possessive - no matter what you do, a huge portion of them will hate this movie because it isn't their ideal vision of a Reeve like Superman while a chunk will hate it because it's not Snyder and Cavill. Most fandoms will never be unified because they're made of sub-groups who don't want the same things.

Find writers and filmmakers with unique voices and visions. Let them do their thing. As a fan, I have faith in Coates because he's a better writer than almost anyone who has worked on a superhero film and I have faith in JJ as a producer because he has an incredible eye for things like casting, so his voice in the room is an awesome thing to have when you don't also then have to deal with his wonky storytelling.

that's the problem, he's not a better writer than almost anyone who has worked on superhero films. top-selling =/= good

he IS working on comics as we speak and they're mediocre. JJ's positives are 100% outweighed by his negatives. his overreliance on nostalgia and gimmicks. thinking he's too clever for his own good. every single one of his movies isn't an original. they're derivative of groundwork laid before him.

this isn't about fan service for the sake of fan service, it's about can WB deliver a proper superman film. track record is more than on the doubters' side. and now they are putting unnecessary hurdles to even deliver that.

it doesn't need to be like the reeve version, but it'd be nice to actually have a non-brooding, "conflicted" superman for the first time since...well the reeve version. there is no chance we're going to get that with coates.

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

I mean, hell, Batman fandom is sorta united on The Batman and even that has a portion of people who either hate it for not being Affleck or hate it for not being super fantastical.

I don't want all these franchises to be cloyingly dedicated to trying to please everyone and cater to fandom whims. It's actively embarrassing watching Star Wars do it and that's quite enough of that for me.

the reason star wars fans are so divided right now is because......JJ Abrams to begin with lol. his constant overreliance on nostalgia and mystery boxes made the sequel trilogy completely hollow from the beginning. TFA is just a remake of ANH, we all know it. 35+ years after ROTJ and it's still the same x-wings vs TIEs because remember those? lol.

it took a singular and talented vision like jon favreau to get the fandom back on board again with mandalorian. that's what superman/WB needs, but they are still stuck in their old studio ways

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Favreau is just as nostalgic as Abrams, dude, the only writer on Mando who strikes me as having much of a unique voice is Famuyiwa. There's nothing singular about his vision. The Mandalorian is every bit as much empty calorie fan service as TFA but without any of the interesting subtext about generational failure/conflict Kasdan's screenplay for TFA had. It's not as similar in terms of plot obviously but the second season in particular is pure, pure pandering. I like Mandalorian, but I don't need anything else like it - content like Mando should be a fun treat, not the norm. The only thing really special about it is the unique, touching relationship between Mando (who isn't any more complex or unique a character than Rey) and Grogu but apart from that it's... pretty shallow.

Let's put the Star Wars stuff to bed though, the last thing the Internet needs is more Star Wars debates.

And, no, I'm quite confident saying Coates is a better writer than most of of the relatively mediocre screenwriters who get superhero gigs. His comics work is excellent and he's a beautiful novelist and memoirist. Doesn't always translate to screen, Michael Chabon is transparently a better writer than most yet his screenwriting is inconsistent, but it's certainly encouraging.

 

[emielaen]

Is Mandalorian that of a singular vision? Lol idk

How is hiring Coates them stuck in their old ways though? Why are you assuming his Superman will be brooding the whole time? & couldn’t there be an arc if he started that way, like most stories? And plenty would say Coates is a singular voice; without a doubt. He’s not a screenwriter, no, but his voice goes beyond that. We’ll have to see how he does. He may even tap a co-writer who has experience.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

Coates has, if I’m not mistaken, done some screenwriting including something for Coogler. Haven’t been filmed, but that’s not abnormal.

 

[emielaen]

I did see someone mention that.

 

[Nemeres]

Even with his screwups, which I see and acknowledge, I can't help but like Abrams for the same reasons people liked him after Star Trek 09 and TFA. He can create a good premise, he's good with characters, he's fantastic at casting. For my money, this project is better off already just by having him in charge of those.

As for the costume, I can definitely see them changing it to the Val-Zod colors. Even though I really wouldn't want them to.

 

[dhandler01]

Don't get confused with western culture being the only culture.

Bollywood, successful... historic and culturally relevant - any diversity there?

China, need I say any more.

Korean... lol ok.

Hollywood - African American make up around 12% of the population in real time, there are other minorities and they have less a percentage, yet media and celebrities tell us western culture needs to be presented equally, not represented accurately and that African Americans are poorly represented.

NBA, NFL, MBL, MTV, day time tv, politicians.... very well represent diversity.
As Morgan Freeman once said... we stop talking about it, it'll go away. Make it American history, not just one month for black history.

Kids aren't born racist.

Identity politics, don't let it fool ya.

Peace out.

Jesus...take a Sociology Class or two and then get back to us. This is so hilariously wrongminded I actually thought it was parody.

 

[GreenKToo]

I’ve been around this stuff for a long time too. There was a ton of negativity toward The Dark Knight for a time, people treated its tweaks to Joker like ****ing heresy. What really impressive, interesting franchise movie wasn’t kinda divisive? It remains divisive but the whole idea of Phillip’s Joker was an internet-wide laughing stock.

The Snyder movies were also closer to straight negative with a devoted minority than ‘divided’. You’re underestimating the incredibly good publicity this is going to get in the mainstream as well, especially if they nail the right director and star.

I hope you are right. I'd love to see this be a hit and scare a billion, or even pass it, at the b.o.

Like I said, I'm open to this and will see where it leads.
If I don't like the direction it takes, I will bow out without crying and moaning about it, and leave it to those who do like it.