The Amazing Spider-Man Moviehole scoops details on both scripts...

[Reikowolf]

/\ I think you're on to something Ace.

I think the franchises greatest villain is Avi Arad

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Yea but he doesn't just crack for the sake of it. It's a weapon all in itself. It annoys his enemies to the point where they are blinded by rage. IT distracts enemies etc etc.

He doesn't have to be constantly babbling. But making cracks can be useful.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

/\ I think you're on to something Ace.

I think the franchises greatest villain is Avi Arad

Yea don't get me wrong I'm not giving the studios interference a free pass.

But c'mon guys, Raimi wasn't perfect either.

Honestly IMO SM4 was looking to be a turd. And some of those ideas were Raimi's, some were the studios.

And even though I didn't like Raimi's ideas either, I respect him more for walking rather than just playing "yes man".

 

[BillyZaned]

it will be interesting in teh nesxt year when the real info on SM4 comes out.....
interested in what villians sony wanted... and why exactly Raimi left...

 

[Ace of Knaves]

I'm sure it will all come out eventually. **** like this usually does.

 

[BillyZaned]

Yea don't get me wrong I'm not giving the studios interference a free pass.

But c'mon guys, Raimi wasn't perfect either.

Honestly IMO SM4 was looking to be a turd. And some of those ideas were Raimi's, some were the studios.

And even though I didn't like Raimi's ideas either, I respect him more for walking rather than just playing "yes man".

people forget that the movie industry is a business... and no matter what.. the studio execs are there to make MONEY.... they have stock holders to look out for... they are looking at everything... toys, merchandise, DVD sales... everything...

i

 

[BillyZaned]

I'm sure it will all come out eventually. **** like this usually does.

I really got a feeling they were pushing either Morbeus, or carnage as teh villians...

Morbeus because of the current vampire craze...

and carnage because of the fanboy interest...

 

[Ace of Knaves]

people forget that the movie industry is a business... and no matter what.. the studio execs are there to make MONEY.... they have stock holders to look out for... they are looking at everything... toys, merchandise, DVD sales... everything...

i

Yea I agree with that.

It's the studio's money at the end of the day. It's like getting a builder in to renovate your house, giving them a load of money, and not checking up on them. That's stupid.

But, film makers know more about making films that suits who sit in an office all day.

There has gotta be a balance.

 

[spider-neil]

/\ I think you're on to something Ace.

I think the franchises greatest villain is Avi Arad

I watched the making of SM3 with avi boasting how he suggested to sam they use venom because the 'fans' wanted him. that had me seething

well done avi, WELL DONE

 

[MadVillainy]

people forget that the movie industry is a business... and no matter what.. the studio execs are there to make MONEY.... they have stock holders to look out for... they are looking at everything... toys, merchandise, DVD sales... everything...

i

and people always get angry at a studio for trying to make money

 

[spider-neil]

and people always get angry at a studio for trying to make money

true but there is a clear precident that when creative people are left the **** alone they 'usually' deliver a quality product and quality products 'usually' make loads of money

 

[MadVillainy]

true but there is a clear precident that when creative people are left the **** alone they 'usually' deliver a quality product and quality products 'usually' make loads of money

not necessarily true

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Yea... there has been plenty of brilliant films where the director has made the film he/she wanted that have completely bombed.

 

[BillyZaned]

Yea I agree with that.

It's the studio's money at the end of the day. It's like getting a builder in to renovate your house, giving them a load of money, and not checking up on them. That's stupid.

But, film makers know more about making films that suits who sit in an office all day.

There has gotta be a balance.

there has to be a balance... but, when you have two forces pushing equally hard for something... one has to get the upper hand... and obviously last time out, the studios did with the inclusion of Venom....

this, IMO, was going to be Raimis appology movie, and I think he really wanted teh vulture as teh villian... but the studio is looking at comic sales, popular culture, etc... and obviously pushed a different villian or plot at raimi... sam seeing he wasn't going to win, and not be able to make the movie he wanted... walked...

 

[BillyZaned]

true but there is a clear precident that when creative people are left the **** alone they 'usually' deliver a quality product and quality products 'usually' make loads of money

not at all man... not at all....

your mostly talking about movies with small scale budgets... but this is a 300 million dollar investment by the studio...

Ace made a great analogy.... it would be like giving someone 50k to create a home theater for you... of course you want to be there, give imput, and sway the people so that it's something you like

 

[DACrowe]

I just don't get why they don't use Lizard and Kraven in a KLH/savage Lizard story. It is so simple and would work. Old Man Potter...er Vulture taking over the Building and Loan...er Bugle and turning into a supervillain was beyond lame. Even moreso that they would savage a character like Felicia Hardy and pull Schumaucher level change and make her his daughter and a different character all together.

Just lame.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

^Yup.

People will bring out the excuse that the studio wanted a villain with a face and that the Lizard doesn't meet that criteria. But correct me if I'm wrong, but Kraven doesn't wear a mask does he? He's got a human face right?

Well there you go. One monster villain, one human villain. And one kick ass ****ing story.

If that was the plan for SM4 I'm 100% positive EVERYONE would be against it getting scrapped and the reboot.

 

[BillyZaned]

^Yup.

People will bring out the excuse that the studio wanted a villain with a face and that the Lizard doesn't meet that criteria. But correct me if I'm wrong, but Kraven doesn't wear a mask does he? He's got a human face right?

Well there you go. One monster villain, one human villain. And one kick ass ****ing story.

If that was the plan for SM4 I'm 100% positive EVERYONE would be against the reboot.

I think Raimi stated not to long back, that he likes the Lizard, just not for the movies... something about it not being realistic, and the "no face" thing, so the audience wouldn't be able to relate

 

[BillyZaned]

Plus, we all know that it will turn out that Sandman worked for Doctor Connors, and that Doctor Connors fired him, causing him to turn to crime to pay for his duaghters medical treatments..

Spiderman "you remember Ben Parker"

Connors "no... Parker, ...... is that you Peter"

Spiderman "oh crap... well, you killed him,.... kind of... you caused it, technically.... "

 

[Ace of Knaves]

That totally wouldn't surprise me if something like that happened.

But honestly, an adaptation of Kravens Last Hunt, but featuring the Lizard to, with Spidey caught in the middle would of been brilliant. Surely everyone would agree with that?

Kraven hunting Lizard. Spidey trying to both stop the Lizards rampage, AND stop Kraven from outright killing his friend Doc Conners. Peter would be torn because Kraven would get this vicious monster out of the way, but by killing his friend. Then Kraven would also want to challenge himself by hunting the famous Spider-Man.

****... that **** writes itself. It would of been epic.

 

[BillyZaned]

That totally wouldn't surprise me if something like that happened.

But honestly, an adaptation of Kravens Last Hunt, but featuring the Lizard to, with Spidey caught in the middle would of been brilliant. Surely everyone would agree with that?

Kraven hunting Lizard. Spidey trying to both stop the Lizards rampage, AND stop Kraven from outright killing his friend Doc Conners. Peter would be torn because Kraven would get this vicious monster out of the way, but by killing his friend. Then Kraven would also want to challenge himself by hunting the famous Spider-Man.

****... that **** writes itself. It would of been epic.

it would be good... but lets not kid ourselves here guys... Raimi wasn't perfect... nor close... alot of Spiderman 3's problems were because of him... we all complain about Venom being jammed in there... but there was so much crap that Raimi did

The dancing sequence.
The Jazz Club Dance off
The Emo Peter
The pie scene

and the worst element of all... taking Sandman, and inserting him into the Ben Parker's death plot... that didn't need to happen, nor added any emotional wieght to the story... all it did was make you roll your eyes, and slightly tarnish Spiderman 1.

 

[Ace of Knaves]

Agreed.

People will say Raimi made Sandman Ben's killer so it could emphasize the "forgiveness" thing.

But we already had that with Harry's arc. Harry would eventually forgive Peter for killing his dad.

There was absolutely no need to tarnish Spider-Man 1 by making Sandman Ben's killer. In fact, it tarnishes PEte's whole reason to become Spidey. He becomes Spidey because he felt guilty about letting Ben's killer go. Well, he didn't let Ben's killer go, it wasn't even him!

 

[BillyZaned]

Agreed.

People will say Raimi made Sandman Ben's killer so it could emphasize the "forgiveness" thing.

But we already had that with Harry's arc. Harry would eventually forgive Peter for killing his dad.

There was absolutely no need to tarnish Spider-Man 1 by making Sandman Ben's killer. In fact, it tarnishes PEte's whole reason to become Spidey. He becomes Spidey because he felt guilty about letting Ben's killer go. Well, he didn't let Ben's killer go, it wasn't even him!

it would have been funny to go...

"****, you killed my uncle... wow, that changes things... I guess one man can't make a difference, because even if I stopped blondie, Ben would have died. Infact, I'm the reason Ben died, because I lied to him by not telling him what I was doing. ****, I'm causing more death by lieing to my loves ones... I"M SPIDERMAN EVERYONE, MY NAME IS PETER PARKER"


also, I love it that the Police found out Flint was the killer after he transformerd into Sandman...

 

[Reikowolf]

"he fits the description"

 

[Ace of Knaves]

A nice coincidence wasn't it?

But seriously, I loved SM1 and 2. I'm not a Raimi hater. All these complaints I had long before this news broke.