WandaVision Spoilers!: Evan Peters

[Dark Raven]

The only thing I would've liked is some closure between Wanda and Fietro. It's as if she immediately dismissed the idea of it even being her brother once Agatha said so and didn't cling to the slim hope it could still be. And then she didn't get a chance to see who he really was and didn't really care either. I think it would've been good for her to see it was Ralph rather than Monica seeing it.

 

[Da-Scribe]

I'm not even too mad about it now because it was clever and if it was any other actor playing "Fietro" we, as an audience would not have believed it to be Pietro or understand why Wanda thinks it is.

I'm curious if they would have been able to use Peters if they didn't buy Fox though or if the deal wasn't completed yet.

But the audience always knew it wasn’t Pietro. Pietro is dead after all. So it’s not like we ever were seeing things as Wanda saw them.

 

[The Batman]

I thought it was a weak twist. Why they would want to emulate the Mandarin twist, which was so polarizing that they ended up retconning it, I have no idea.

The crazy part is how some apologists are actually blaming fans for being disappointed. Even if I liked the twist, I wouldn't blame fans for being annoyed.

 

[Web-Head]

But the audience always knew it wasn’t Pietro. Pietro is dead after all. So it’s not like we ever were seeing things as Wanda saw them.

Right, but it still made it more believable. If it were any other actor in the role it wouldn't have worked as well.

 

[Da-Scribe]

Right, but it still made it more believable. If it were any other actor in the role it wouldn't have worked as well.

I guess I just don't see the connection. Wanda thinks it's her dead brother. We as the audience knew it definitely wasn't from the jump because it wasn't ATJ in the role. So it's not like some twist was preserved by casting Evan Peters.

 

[Web-Head]

I guess I just don't see the connection. Wanda thinks it's her dead brother. We as the audience knew it definitely wasn't from the jump because it wasn't ATJ in the role. So it's not like some twist was preserved by casting Evan Peters.

The fact that they both played Quicksilver is the connection. We as the audience knew it wasn't but with the continuous talk of multiverse shenanigans made us think it could be some version of Pietro.

 

[Mike Murdock]

If the studio's only intention was to convey that the audience knows as much as the protagonist and mislead narratively as well as canonically, then they shouldn't/wouldn't have cast an actor who played the character he has been playing in a different franchise. We know about the Fox film universe, Wanda doesn't. If the studio just wanted us to wonder why Quicksilver looks different (and not think too deeply about the difference in actor choices), then they would have cast someone who has not yet been in any Marvel movie to be Bohner.

Except the audience has a skepticism Wanda doesn't have. If it was a random brand new actor, the audience wouldn't buy that he could be Pietro.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Except the audience has a skepticism Wanda doesn't have. If it was a random brand new actor, the audience wouldn't buy that he could be Pietro.

Well yeah, the studio was pushing skepticism narratively and canonically - and by that I mean both to the viewer and to the protagonist.

However to counter your point, myself as an audience member, I was never skeptical that the Pietro that showed up in episode 5 was the same Pietro that died in Av2. I knew 100% that was a different person.

And I hoped that it was a real Pietro from the Fox universe. There was no need to add an extra layer of multiverse skepticism for the audience for reasons I already explained, but firstly because for fans of the Fox universe, it sets the audience up for disappointment. We the audience are aware that this actor has a history but Wanda as the protagonist has no awareness of this stranger having the likeness of someone who has the same identity as her twin brother in an alternate reality. To her, all she sees is a stranger claiming to be her brother while appearing as a different person.

 

[Da-Scribe]

The fact that they both played Quicksilver is the connection. We as the audience knew it wasn't but with the continuous talk of multiverse shenanigans made us think it could be some version of Pietro.

Meh, if the point was for us to think it was some other Pietro then they could’ve just cast ATJ or some other guy and avoided duping fans into thinking the Fox-Men were part of the MCU’s multiverse.

It was just a needless bait and switch that added nothing to the narrative.

 

[CaptainWagner]

It does kind of feel like a troll. But overall I don't mind it, I just wish they'd had the time to fully resolve this and actually give Ralph's story some sort of conclusion. Like others said, Wanda needed an emotional pay-off of interacting with him post-reveal, and we didn't get that. And then COVID made things worse by getting him cut from most of the finale due to unfinished VFX.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

The fact that they both played Quicksilver is the connection. We as the audience knew it wasn't but with the continuous talk of multiverse shenanigans made us think it could be some version of Pietro.

No. I couldn't disagree with you more. You're making it sound like the audience should have the same knowledge and reaction to episode 5 as Darcy did, but again, we the audience have an extra awareness that the characters don't have, and that's the Fox X-Men Universe. Most people watching episode 5 weren't thinking the same thing as Darcy (just a recast), we were thinking maybe this character was pulled into the hex from a different universe, which would be a case of the audience knowing something that the character, which would be a case of dramatic irony.

If the studio wanted the audience to be on the same page as the protagonist and only be thinking "why does Pietro look different?" and not "why is this Pietro from a different universe?" then they would have cast someone new and completely unrelated.

Meh, if the point was for us to think it was some other Pietro then they could’ve just cast ATJ or some other guy and avoided duping fans into thinking the Fox-Men were part of the MCU’s multiverse.

It was just a needless bait and switch that added nothing to the narrative.

if you watch the interview on the previous page, the director made the excuse not to use Aaron Taylor Johnson because they already had one lost love one come back to life in the form of Vision, and thus made Agatha come up with some random explanation of not being able to reanimate MCU Pietro's dead body. But to me that explanation doesn't even work here because Vision coming back was Wanda's own doing; if MCU Pietro appeared on her doorstep on episode 5, not only would her reaction be even more emotional because it would have been unexpected, but also, the audience would not jump to the suspicion of multiverse theories immediately since it would be the same actor from 2015 returning in the role.

 

[Mike Murdock]

However to counter your point, myself as an audience member, I was never skeptical that the Pietro that showed up in episode 5 was the same Pietro that died in Av2. I knew 100% that was a different person.

Right, but the audience was never going to accept that he was the same character in a brand new body. The question is whether the audience would believe he was Pietro vs. a trick by the ultimate big bad of the show. If you thought he might be the Fox X-Men character, they succeeded in distracting you from thinking he was fake.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Right, but the audience was never going to accept that he was the same character in a brand new body. The question is whether the audience would believe he was Pietro vs. a trick by the ultimate big bad of the show. If you thought he might be the Fox X-Men character, they succeeded in distracting you from thinking he was fake.

But who is "they"? Do you mean the studio, or do you mean Agatha? Because that is the point that I keep trying to make to you as I keep saying narratively misleading vs. canonically misleading. If they ended up revealing that this really was Peter from the Fox universe, it's not like Wanda would breathe a sigh of relief or be overcome with joy or anything...he still isn't her brother. She would have no emotional attachment to him either way. But we the fans (those who are fans of the X Men) do have that emotional attachment, so such a reveal would be a reason to get more excited.

If you mean Agatha, well, neither Agatha nor Wanda nor anyone in the MCU this far that we know of knows about the Fox universe so for her to choose Bohner to be Fietro is broken fourth wall levels of coincidental. No one in the audience was thinking he was MCU Quicksilver recast. I am pretty sure Agatha was just trying to trick Wanda of that.

If you mean the studio, then you are proving my other point and the point others have said in the thread that this was all stupid trolling by the studio. The "distracting" in this context is just "trolling" for lack of a better term. Again, the director himself even said they could have gone with Aaron Taylor Johnson for the narrative they were going for but instead chose a different actor but it just so happens that this different actor also has a history of playing the same character in a different franchise. This was a casting and narrative decision that I neither like or respect. It's a point against the show for sure.

 

[Mike Murdock]

But who is "they"? Do you mean the studio, or do you mean Agatha?

If you mean the studio, then you are proving my other point and the point others have said in the thread that this was all stupid trolling by the studio. The "distracting" in this context is just "trolling" for lack of a better term. Again, the director himself even said they could have gone with Aaron Taylor Johnson for the narrative they were going for but instead chose a different actor but it just so happens that this different actor also has a history of playing the same character in a different franchise. This was a casting and narrative decision that I neither like or respect. It's a point against the show for sure.

I meant the studio. To me, trolling suggests that the purpose was to piss off the audience. I don't think that was the purpose. To me, the purpose was to get the audience to accept that he could actually be a Pietro rather than a random stranger but any other actor besides Aaron Taylor Johnson would have caused people to think he was actually not Pietro.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

I meant the studio. To me, trolling suggests that the purpose was to piss off the audience. I don't think that was the purpose. To me, the purpose was to get the audience to accept that he could actually be a Pietro rather than a random stranger but any other actor besides Aaron Taylor Johnson would have caused people to think he was actually not Pietro.

But that's the thing though, Evan Peters is an actor who portrayed this character in an alternate cinematic universe and the audience is aware of this - the audio file of episode 5 even made sure of this for folks who may not have even seen X-Men films, and therefore, no one in the audience watching that episode would ever accept that he could be Wanda's Pietro. It's interesting that you wrote "a Pietro" instead of just "Pietro" as if the Fox universe Quicksilver is actually something that the studio wanted the audience to believe but again, that just goes into the narrative vs. canonicity divide in the storytelling. Because again, Wanda doesn't know about the Fox universe and if she found out she still wouldn't care because it's not her brother. Yet the audience knows, and you say that the purpose of trolling is to piss people off but that wasn't the studio's intention but that kind of contradicts this line of thinking; the studio absolutely wanted the viewer to believe this was Peter Maximoff from the X-Men films and then revealed that he wasn't, which effectively, pissed off a considerable amount of the audience in the same vein as the Mandarin twist. The fact that the director even states that Aaron Taylor Johnson could have been brought back further corroborates the studio's intentions.

 

[Mike Murdock]

But that's the thing though, Evan Peters is an actor who portrayed this character in an alternate cinematic universe and the audience is aware of this - the audio file of episode 5 even made sure of this for folks who may not have even seen X-Men films, and therefore, no one in the audience watching that episode would ever accept that he could be Wanda's Pietro. It's interesting that you wrote "a Pietro" instead of just "Pietro" as if the Fox universe Quicksilver is actually something that the studio wanted the audience to believe but again, that just goes into the narrative vs. canonicity divide in the storytelling. Because again, Wanda doesn't know about the Fox universe and if she found out she still wouldn't care because it's not her brother. Yet the audience knows, and you say that the purpose of trolling is to piss people off but that wasn't the studio's intention but that kind of contradicts this line of thinking; the studio absolutely wanted the viewer to believe this was Peter Maximoff from the X-Men films and then revealed that he wasn't, which effectively, pissed off a considerable amount of the audience in the same vein as the Mandarin twist. The fact that the director even states that Aaron Taylor Johnson could have been brought back further corroborates the studio's intentions.

I think the studio wanted the audience to believe it was either our Pietro resurrected with a different appearance or the Fox Pietro. For story reasons, they didn't want to use Aaron Taylor Johnson because they wanted to emphasize dead is dead and he can't be brought back, but they also didn't want to use a completely new actor since the audience would immediately go to the theory that it was a random stranger who wasn't Pietro.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

I think the studio wanted the audience to believe it was either our Pietro resurrected with a different appearance or the Fox Pietro.

Okay but why would the studio want the audience to believe that? It's only something the audience, not the characters, would be attached to and ultimately that is what ended up happening with the portion of the audience and that same portion ended up very disappointed.

And again, there is no way the studio wanted the audience to believe this was MCU Pietro. By casting the other actor portraying the character coupled with the audio file, it was obvious they were only going for the contrary.

For story reasons, they didn't want to use Aaron Taylor Johnson because they wanted to emphasize dead is dead and he can't be brought back, but they also didn't want to use a completely new actor since the audience would immediately go to the theory that it was a random stranger who wasn't Pietro.

The director explained the story reasons not to use Aaron Taylor Johnson and I already explained why I see a fallacy in his explanation. He said they could have brought back ATJ, but didn't, because the show already had a loved one brought back to life in the form of Vision. But bringing Vision back was all Wanda's own doing, we literally saw her bring him back. She was aware that it was her own power as the causation for that action. But if MCU Pietro was at her doorstep at the end of episode 5, she would have been astonished to the tenth degree because it was not her own doing, and it comes right off of the heels of the heated conversation she and Vision were having on the couch in the preceding scene.

Again...to Wanda, the Fox Pietro in the X-Men universe might as well be a stranger. If it was eventually revealed to her that this stranger really was a person with the same identity as her brother from alternate universe, she would remain emotionally unchanged because that person is still not her brother. She would not care. The only party that would/did care was the audience. The studio was banking on this fact, they were counting on it and what ended up happening was that that portion of the audience was left disappointed. If that isn't the studio trolling the audience, then I don't know what it is.

 

[Primal Slayer]

They went out of their way to do all of these red herrings and this one was the worst. It will forever annoy me.

 

[Zarex]

Fietro coming for a visit was an absolutely fantastic moment on a show filled with them. I never much cared for INO Foxy Pete in the Kinberg-verse, so my initial hope was that this was just a dude pretending to be Quicksilver. But Peters was so great in the role, by the end of episode 6 I was kinda hoping he would stick around.

The casting stunt worked on a lot of levels. We got a classic actor recast in a show based on classic sitcoms. And because viewers buy Evan Peters as Pietro Maximoff, they had the same confusion regarding this fellow's identity as the star of the show after the door opened. The reveal would have been a smidge less impactful if, say, Kieran Culkin walked in.

After the year we've had I am especially appreciative of entertainment moments that are exciting and get these boards buzzing. Kudos to Schaeffer and Shakman and the entire WandaVision team.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Fietro coming for a visit was an absolutely fantastic moment on a show filled with them. I never much cared for INO Foxy Pete in the Kinberg-verse, so my initial hope was that this was just a dude pretending to be Quicksilver. But Peters was so great in the role, by the end of episode 6 I was kinda hoping he would stick around.

The casting stunt worked on a lot of levels. We got a classic actor recast in a show based on classic sitcoms. And because viewers buy Evan Peters as Pietro Maximoff, they had the same confusion regarding this fellow's identity as the star of the show after the door opened. The reveal would have been a smidge less impactful if, say, Kieran Culkin walked in.

After the year we've had I am especially appreciative of entertainment moments that are exciting and get these boards buzzing. Kudos to Schaeffer and Shakman and the entire WandaVision team.

nah, it was not the same confusion. Wanda did not for one second contemplate whether the stranger at her door was someone with her brother's identity from an alternate universe. that's only something the audience pondered.

 

[Zarex]

nah, it was not the same confusion. Wanda did not for one second contemplate whether the stranger at her door was someone with her brother's identity from an alternate universe. that's only something the audience pondered.

Yah, it was the same confusion. As confirmed by Agatha in the penultimate episode, Wanda was willing to buy Bohner (Heh!) as her brother, just as many audience members were willing to buy that Evan Peters would be the new Quicksilver in the MCU.

I can understand folks being upset that this didn't signal the opening of the MCU multiverse, but the pearl clutching over being "tricked" by writers simply trying to give us an entertaining TV show is a tad much.

 

[Dark Raven]

In these murder mysteries, particularly those by Agatha Christie, there are lots of red herrings and people who seem like they're suspects or significant to both the audience and the detective. They're designed to mislead the audience down a particular path. Sometimes they even cast actors against type. Typical villains turn out to be heroes and vice versa, and some are completely insignificant. There are always twists and turns.

Now all of these stunt castings or red herrings could be seen as trolling the audience, but the audience realise at the end of the story that it's all part and parcel of the mystery genre and people don't complain they were misled.

Well that's what they've done here. In addition to being a sitcom, this is also a mystery. It's been described in several places as a puzzle box mystery. So all these red herrings designed to deliberately mislead the audience are part of the genre. And that includes Fietro.

 

[TheVileOne]

Yah, it was the same confusion. As confirmed by Agatha in the penultimate episode, Wanda was willing to buy Bohner (Heh!) as her brother, just as many audience members were willing to buy that Evan Peters would be the new Quicksilver in the MCU.

I can understand folks being upset that this didn't signal the opening of the MCU multiverse, but the pearl clutching over being "tricked" by writers simply trying to give us an entertaining TV show is a tad much.

To me it's just a bunch of spoiled brats who are upset their theories or scoops on the show were wrong.

 

[XtremelyBaneful]

Yah, it was the same confusion.

Nah, it was not, and I literally just explained to you why it was not the same and you ignored it completely. So I'll say it again. The confusion that the audience had was why Peter from the Fox universe was at her doorstep. That was not at all the confusion going through her mind. So no, you are dead wrong to say it was the same confusion.

As confirmed by Agatha in the penultimate episode, Wanda was willing to buy Bohner (Heh!) as her brother, just as many audience members were willing to buy that Evan Peters would be the new Quicksilver in the MCU.

First of all, Agatha is not the fourth wall breaking type of character like Deadpool to play a trick on the audience and be aware that there is another cinematic universe of Marvel characters out there that houses this character. After the director explained that they could have brought ATJ back but just opted not to proves that her expository dialogue of not reanimating MCU Pietro's dead body was just a directorial choice. They could have done it. Instead they chose an actor whose role in the narrative and portrayal on the show would deceive the audience.

Second of all, I've explained in this thread about three or four times now that Agatha playing a trick on Wanda does not equate to the studio/the director as the storyteller playing a trick on the viewer. You can go back and read the discussion if you want, but I'll quote IGN here since their explanation sums up my sentiment as well:

Absent any other apparent explanation, the surprise reveal of Quicksilver’s appearance seems to serve a purpose not for the story or characters, but for the audience. Wanda opening the door and seeing the Evan Peters version of Pietro Maximoff doesn’t really mean anything to her, but it does mean something to the people watching, because the show is expecting them to know that he’s the actor who played that same character in Fox’s X-Men franchise. It’s a hollow move, because it simultaneously dilutes what should be an important character beat into an “I know him!” cameo, while also opening up a well of speculation that doesn’t really go anywhere. It also isn’t necessary, because using the MCU version of Quicksilver as a ghost, vision or reincarnation could have added to the main thematic thread of Wanda processing her grief.

Why Doesn't Quicksilver Matter in WandaVision? - IGN

I can understand folks being upset that this didn't signal the opening of the MCU multiverse, but the pearl clutching over being "tricked" by writers simply trying to give us an entertaining TV show is a tad much.

I don't know what you mean by pearl clutching here but it sounds like you're just downplaying the disappointment of the Fox X-Men fans. We have a right to be disappointment just as Mandarin fans were when Iron Man 3 came out and it is a little demoralizing that others who don't care much for this fakeout are blaming fans for not not appreciating it.

WandaVision is a good show but it's not perfect nor is it immune to criticism. It's totally fine for people to love the whole show, it's totally fine for people to not care or like the fakeout, but it should be totally fine for people to hate it too.

 

[TheVileOne]

Pietro fans should be more disappointed with how little he had to do in Dark Phoenix.