8.11 - Legion - Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

Status
Not open for further replies.
My mom - who got me started on SV in the first place - and my husband hated this episode. They both asked me, "What's the deal with Smallville lately? It's so... weird." They're NOT into the comics and they think it has gotten not just obscure and silly but stupidly so. Hubby loves Stargate, so the cheese factor isn't the only issue. I wasn't crazy about the cheese in this episode, although there were excellent bits.

Excellent bits:
TW looked fantastic through most of it.
Some primo glares from him at other characters.
His heat-vision control when autographing the ball (much more original and in character than using a Sharpie).
His aversion to the idea of wearing any/a combination of tights, a cape, or glasses.
His insistence that the Legion not kill Chloe.
Davis' fight to feel human.
The forming of Balliac. Though I initially wondered why they didn't immediately destroy it (with Clark using his heat vision), I figured maybe they'd try to extract all of Brainiac's accumulated knowledge from it using their future tech.
My first impression of this episode... I was confused and frustrated with the "comic-booky" cheese and the MANY eye-rolling references to destinies. Seriously, it was getting ridiculous. :whatever:

They are dancing on a thin line here... Trying to keep the fanboys happy while not alienating the bigger audience. Introducing a bunch of super powered characters, who are time traveling, galaxy hopping, aliens - who unlike Superman are only known to comic book geeks - risks making the show silly.

It's also distracting. Too much of this is going to take away from the interesting and relatable struggle that has made up Clark's journey so far...

That said, I liked the episode better the second time I watched it.
 
8 seasons is a good run....I say end it on top....what bothers me is that (regardless of quality) no one shows reruns of it anywhere....ABC Family did for about 3 months but I haven't seen it anywhere else
 
yea wb used to do reruns during the weekend on the early seasons, then i did see it on what used to upn local network for awhile too a few yrs back. Then as u said bl abc family used to air reruns of it too but then stoped for some reason. I guess no networks has the rights to do reruns besides cw at this time.
 
But you realize that once he becomes Superman, the show is over, right?

The series has never, ever been better.

So, I'm willing to see where else they'll go with Clark and company next season if they keep this level of quality up.

If they jump the shark, I'm still going to watch, but I don't see them doing that yet.

If they do have a 9th season, hopefully they can do it gracefully, so they don't have some lame-ass season ender this year. I think Arctic sorta failed because of the open-endedness and the hacked up end of the season they had.

If they know going into the final set of episodes that there will be one more season, I doubt it will happen.

I hope they give us one more year, if not, this year being the last would work too.

They'd seriously go out on a high note.

So end the show, 8 seasons is a damn good run, especially for a show like this. Plus, I haven't even found this season to be all that great, I think I've missed two episodes, but I don't understand the praise. Seriously, what's so great about the season, a complete and total bastardization of Doomsday?
 
well at the start of the season we didnt really know what they were doing with dd but his story has come around nicely. Yes its not comics dd to the t but its smallville they mix and match various elements together while throwing in their own flavor into things. Heck take the new spider-man cartoon its more based on the classic lee/ditko era of spider-man but the shows creators have mixed ultimate,classic comics, and elements of the movies into the show and it has been great.
 
But you realize that once he becomes Superman, the show is over, right?

The series has never, ever been better.

So, I'm willing to see where else they'll go with Clark and company next season if they keep this level of quality up.

If they jump the shark, I'm still going to watch, but I don't see them doing that yet.

If they do have a 9th season, hopefully they can do it gracefully, so they don't have some lame-ass season ender this year. I think Arctic sorta failed because of the open-endedness and the hacked up end of the season they had.

If they know going into the final set of episodes that there will be one more season, I doubt it will happen.

I hope they give us one more year, if not, this year being the last would work too.

They'd seriously go out on a high note.

There. Right there. You just summed it up. End the show with a bang and not a whimper. Don't pull a Lois and Clark (jesus christ, did that show get weird).

I know people want more adventures but he's a grown man now, out of college (I think) and working at the Daily Planet...Now what? We gonna stretch this out for three more seasons before he decides he should put on a costume while saving people instead of civilian gear?
 
So end the show, 8 seasons is a damn good run, especially for a show like this. Plus, I haven't even found this season to be all that great, I think I've missed two episodes, but I don't understand the praise. Seriously, what's so great about the season, a complete and total bastardization of Doomsday?

You know, my son has a friend who sounds exactly like you.

'But doomsday isn't a guy, he's a bone covered monster...'

I know that and anyone who's read those books or seen that Sueprman/Doomsday movie knows that, but in the end does it really matter?

They made this a different kind of doomsday, but he's still a monster inside... A real full-time doomsday that didn't have the problem Davis has, thinking he's human, wouldn't have worked nearly as well.

The dramatic irony is awesome. It's like Lex Luthor fighting his destiny to becoming a villain, but ten times better.

Davis is a tormented character who is fighting his destiny, like Lex did, but it'll be impossible for him to do in the long-run: he isn't fighting some inner demons, a bad childhood or crummy homelife. He's going to be a monster no matter what he wants.

They've given Davis a strong 'villain's journey' to counter Clark's hero's journey.

I LOVE Davis and Sam is a terrific actor.

I like what they've done to "Smallville-ize" the character, so I have no complaints.
 
There. Right there. You just summed it up. End the show with a bang and not a whimper. Don't pull a Lois and Clark (jesus christ, did that show get weird).

I know people want more adventures but he's a grown man now, out of college (I think) and working at the Daily Planet...Now what? We gonna stretch this out for three more seasons before he decides he should put on a costume while saving people instead of civilian gear?

I don't see it going more than one more year, but I think you missed my primary point:

If they don't go one more year, that'll be okay since they'll be able to end strong, but I hope they do since this season has been so awesome.

And Lois & Clark's last season sucked, IMO. I stopped watching before the end that season, so I agree with you there....

If there is even the slightest chance they don't have enough story left for another full season, end it now or do a short season next year to make sure it ends right.
 
Did anyone notice that in both the superman The Animated Series episode ""New Kids In Town" and the Smallville episode "Legion" Saturn Girl kisses Clark Kent goodbye. I wonder if Imra Ardeen has a crush on the young Man of Steel.:woot:
 
You know, my son has a friend who sounds exactly like you.

'But doomsday isn't a guy, he's a bone covered monster...'

I know that and anyone who's read those books or seen that Sueprman/Doomsday movie knows that, but in the end does it really matter?

They made this a different kind of doomsday, but he's still a monster inside... A real full-time doomsday that didn't have the problem Davis has, thinking he's human, wouldn't have worked nearly as well.

The dramatic irony is awesome. It's like Lex Luthor fighting his destiny to becoming a villain, but ten times better.

Davis is a tormented character who is fighting his destiny, like Lex did, but it'll be impossible for him to do in the long-run: he isn't fighting some inner demons, a bad childhood or crummy homelife. He's going to be a monster no matter what he wants.

They've given Davis a strong 'villain's journey' to counter Clark's hero's journey.

I LOVE Davis and Sam is a terrific actor.

I like what they've done to "Smallville-ize" the character, so I have no complaints.

Hey, as long as it culminates in both characters reaching Superhero and Supervillain status at the same time I'm happy.
 
too bad Davis can't kill Chloe.....or maybe that is still a possibility.....mwahahahahaha
 
You know, my son has a friend who sounds exactly like you.

'But doomsday isn't a guy, he's a bone covered monster...'

I know that and anyone who's read those books or seen that Sueprman/Doomsday movie knows that, but in the end does it really matter?

They made this a different kind of doomsday, but he's still a monster inside... A real full-time doomsday that didn't have the problem Davis has, thinking he's human, wouldn't have worked nearly as well.

The dramatic irony is awesome. It's like Lex Luthor fighting his destiny to becoming a villain, but ten times better.

Davis is a tormented character who is fighting his destiny, like Lex did, but it'll be impossible for him to do in the long-run: he isn't fighting some inner demons, a bad childhood or crummy homelife. He's going to be a monster no matter what he wants.

They've given Davis a strong 'villain's journey' to counter Clark's hero's journey.

I LOVE Davis and Sam is a terrific actor.

I like what they've done to "Smallville-ize" the character, so I have no complaints.

But to be fair would you agree you are a bigger fan of Smallville than the Superman mythos?

I have grown to have little problem with this Doomsday, but I don't think its better. Geoff John's describing Smallville as an "Ultimate DC Universe" is by far the best description of Smallville and puts it in a term that a comic fan should be able to not only understand - but accept.
 
it was interesting that the history books have no mention of chloe sullivan.....hmmm
 
i still say they throw that line in for the comic fans and how the chloe character doesnt exist in the comics.
 
it was interesting that the history books have no mention of chloe sullivan.....hmmm

well to be fair, in the LOSH comics Batman is merely a small blurb in the history books, so I dont think that necessarily means Chloe will be completely irrelevant.
 
I actually liked that, considering Batman is supposed to be a myth anyway.
 
I liked that too. I'm tired of DC kissing the ass of the big three and their fans.
 
it was interesting that the history books have no mention of chloe sullivan.....hmmm

Which is why I thought last week's episode would have been the best time to kill her off. But Clark had to be all "Clark" about it :D

well to be fair, in the LOSH comics Batman is merely a small blurb in the history books, so I dont think that necessarily means Chloe will be completely irrelevant.

As well he should be :o
 
sorry to dissect your post but I want to make a few comments while making it easy to know what I'm referring to

Legion never says another word about DD;

That was part of the code though. They cannot influence the past. Don't touch, don't say. Its when persuader influenced the past that they had to fix it.

they blithely return to the future with Balliac and leave Clark on his own with DD (if they even remember that there is a DD) and the darkened FoS (which you'd think they would have graced with their presence while they were in town, given their fanboy rankings).

they weren't in town for the Superman memory tour. They had a job to do and do it as hands off as possible. Its clear cosmic boy knows about Doomsday but he can't interfere. history has to play out. Not only are these time travel rules they are basic sci-fi rules.'you step on a butterfly...'

They all just left him in the FoS with not a look back. Left him encased in Brainiac's crystal cocoon.

No one knew he was there except chloe and she must not remember.

Someone mentioned using the Legion ring to send DD to the future. Can the future deal with DD, or would he just learn new ways to not die a second time?

Sure the future can. Mon-El and Ultra Boy of the legion are superman's equal. Actually Mon-El is considered mightier because he has no weakness to kryptonite. Then you add the entire legion on top of that and you have a pretty resounding victory.

The baseball:
How would the Legion have heard about the baseball if it wasn't in their museum?

A diary from later in superman's life where he refers to it. Someone else writing about Superman's life when he sees fit for his secret to be revealed?

Now that it has "CK" burned into it with heat vision, it *can't* be shown to anyone in active Superman's time or it would likely give away his secret.
Wouldn't taking the baseball to the future - past the time when it wasn't in the museum - mess with the timestream somehow? It just seems like it should, unless Garth is planning to put it in the museum. Fanboy that he is, I imagine he'll instead be sleeping with it under his pillow.

Not at all. Garth said that the ball was missing, it was missing because he gave it to Garth to take back to the 31st century in the 21st century so the time loop is complete.

Too much Lana-love, especially from the future.

this ties in with lack of lois but this was a Superboy story in essence. there were no characters here that in the comics superman meets later. In smallville's own continuity Geoff was able to stay truthful and do a Smallville episode in a show that is becoming Metropolis. Legion should have been done 5 years ago at least but he really works with what he has right now as far as characters go. I think the Lana love is a part of that. Lana is going in 3 episodes and this episode is an appreciation letter for her character. Now I don't like Kreuk's Lana but there is no doubt the character help shaped clark. Also as a comic writer I got the distinct impression Geoff was writing about the red head he usually writes about more that Kristen's portrayal.

This one might have been an oversight on my part, but - the busted crystal that could have gotten Brainiac out of Chloe w/o killing her - how did Clark get that again? Was that the messed-up one that took him to the Phantom Zone?

It was the Martian's crystal I think. In the recap they showed Kara using it on Faora.

I wasn't crazy about the cheese in this episode, although there were excellent bits.

What was cheesy again? when I think cheese I think really tired cliches and other than the rules of time travel that have been used in every other sci fi show ever I can't put my finger on it. As for obscure, I don't think it should really matter. Who cares if people aren't aquainted with Legion. this was their opportunity to get aquainted. Non-comic fans would be surprised how influential the Legion is in superman lore.

superfam.jpg

See them in the time bubble at the top with the main superman cast of the silver age? This is what Geoff Johns is trying to restore in the comics, minus the superhorse, supermonkey and the mermaid

To me the non comic reader sees the reeve movies as 'canon'. that is the myth for them but when you pick up the comic its really so much bigger and better than we have seen on screen. Smallville's best quality is that it gives people a glimpse of that.


The forming of Balliac. Though I initially wondered why they didn't immediately destroy it (with Clark using his heat vision), I figured maybe they'd try to extract all of Brainiac's accumulated knowledge from it using their future tech.

Balliac is this guy
http://www.majorspoilers.com/archives/1907.htm/
Legion Scientist
 
Someone mentioned using the Legion ring to send DD to the future. Can the future deal with DD
if he sends him far enough in to the future (to where the world is nothing, but, a barren wasteland) no one will have to deal with him
 
it was interesting that the history books have no mention of chloe sullivan.....hmmm

Will TPTB have the guts to kill her off or send her away, maybe changing her name to protect her from Doomsday? This would explain her absence from the "history books".
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"