Daredevil Daredevil: FULL SEASON THREE Discussion Thread (Beware, Spoilers Galore!)

[Enriquespy]

Full disclosure: I didn't quite noticed if DD was making Nadeem only injure the attackers, so maybe he was indeed just injuring them.

 

[Spider-Fan]

The more I think about this cancellation, the more it sucks. Like, seriously. This show I stand firm is not just the best superhero TV show ever, I still say that it is easily one of the MCU's overall gems, and ignoring that would be a complete waste. I loved Avengers: Infinity War, but the 3rd Season of Daredevil is just simply better. Which says a lot for me, as IW is one of the MCU's best films. The 1st & 3rd seasons of Daredevil I would put up there with the best of any Marvel film (as well as episodes 1-4 of season 2). Simply put, Daredevil is not just a show: it's art. Some of the best superhero storytelling ever told outside the comic book panels.

I have no faith a rebooted version of the character (should that ever happen) will come even close to this quality. Most of the MCU movies don't come near this level of quality, and that is not a knock on the movies. That's a compliment to what the people who worked on Daredevil were able to achieve. The MCU movies are some of the things that bring me the most joy to watch, so for me to say that shows how highly I think of this show and it's cast/crew.

There is an old saying: lightning doesn't strike twice in the same place, guys. Remember that should they ever attempt to swap out this brilliant show and character for "just another one of the guys." Until something like a reboot happens though, I am going to keep hoping that Daredevil (and his fellow Defenders in all honesty) are preserved and used in the future and that we eventually see a DD S4, etc. But again as I said before elsewhere, should another version of Daredevil come about, this show is solidly my MCU Daredevil. Always will be. I don't care who tries to tell me otherwise, even if it is Kevin Feige himself.

 

[Random490]

The more I think about this cancellation, the more it sucks. Like, seriously. This show I stand firm is not just the best superhero TV show ever, I still say that it is easily one of the MCU's overall gems, and ignoring that would be a complete waste. I loved Avengers: Infinity War, but the 3rd Season of Daredevil is just simply better. Which says a lot for me, as IW is one of the MCU's best films. The 1st & 3rd seasons of Daredevil I would put up there with the best of any Marvel film (as well as episodes 1-4 of season 2). Simply put, Daredevil is not just a show: it's art. Some of the best superhero storytelling ever told outside the comic book panels.

I have no faith a rebooted version of the character (should that ever happen) will come even close to this quality. Most of the MCU movies don't come near this level of quality, and that is not a knock on the movies. That's a compliment to what the people who worked on Daredevil were able to achieve. The MCU movies are some of the things that bring me the most joy to watch, so for me to say that shows how highly I think of this show and it's cast/crew.

There is an old saying: lightning doesn't strike twice in the same place, guys. Remember that should they ever attempt to swap out this brilliant show and character for "just another one of the guys." Until something like a reboot happens though, I am going to keep hoping that Daredevil (and his fellow Defenders in all honesty) are preserved and used in the future and that we eventually see a DD S4, etc. But again as I said before elsewhere, should another version of Daredevil come about, this show is solidly my MCU Daredevil. Always will be. I don't care who tries to tell me otherwise, even if it is Kevin Feige himself.

I completely agree, the Defenders shows at their worst are still, overall, a worthy inclusion into the MCU canon and Daredevil is the pinnacle of quality for it. But I will say if Marvel Studios reboots it, then it will be amazing. I don't how they could possibility top it I just have that much faith in the studio and know they are smart enough to only try if they know they can pull it off. Feige is smart enough not to even think about it unless he's 100% sure they can do it.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I don't question Feige's ability to make a quality product. But this isn't like going from the craptastic TASM to Homecoming. While Homecoming was great, just decent was good enough to win people over because we largely hated TASM universe. In this case, DD was created with being in the MCU in mind and fans love it, and it is critically acclaimed. The only way you could win me over is to make something better than the show, and I just don't think they can. The bar is too high.

 

[Kane52630]

It's going to be hard to see someone other than Charlie Cox wear that DD outfit. It's almost like recasting RDJ as Iron Man.

 

[Whatupman]

It's going to be hard to see someone other than Charlie Cox wear that DD outfit. It's almost like recasting RDJ as Iron Man.

Especially when Cox just got better and better in the role. It would be so sad if he didn't get to continue when he considers it his dream role. To have an actor of his calibre who actually loves the character and is so hungry for telling more stories as him ... it would be a crime not to give him the chance. He's just so ... perfect

 

[TheVileOne]

Cox was perfect as Matt Murdock. It's very unfortunate.

 

[WhoMani]

Charlie Cox was totally believable as a blind guy. I'm a idealist so I do hope that one day we will see Charlie Cox reprise the role again.

 

[Iceman]

Netflix's canceled Marvel shows? Disney may revive them after all

 

[Spidey17]

Imo, Daredevil got better each season. I thought the second season was slow at the beginning, and then became the greatest thing ever, so it's funny to see a lot of people here think the opposite. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that. With season 3, only the first episode was just pretty good. After that the season was perfection. Kingpin's speech to the media was amazing and I loved Bullseye as the secondary villain. I was sad when I heard Daredevil got cancelled, but with Disney possibly reviving The Defenders, there might be hope yet. Idk why they'd go for that first over Daredevil or Luke Cage (my favorites, with Jessica Jones a close third), besides it being the one ensemble show.

 

[The Infernal]

Season 2 with The Punisher was awesome. I just love that scene where Frank walks back into the pawn shop to kill that guy.

 

[hitmanyr2k]

So I finally got some time over the holidays to binge on Season 3 and my wife and I enjoyed it thoroughly. This show really just keeps getting better and better. Stellar performances all around and I loved Bullseye's build up to the finale. I'm hoping they find a way to bring'em all back for Season 4 but even if they don't they went out in fine fashion.

 

[hellblazer103]

Especially when Cox just got better and better in the role. It would be so sad if he didn't get to continue when he considers it his dream role. To have an actor of his calibre who actually loves the character and is so hungry for telling more stories as him ... it would be a crime not to give him the chance. He's just so ... perfect

He even made that court trial scene in the first episode of The Defenders ****ing awesome. When I was rewatching it recently (for no real reason other than needing some Cox in my life again if ya know wut I mean lololol ) I saw that scene and thought to myself " yeah, NO ONE could've played the role better than this guy". He breathes so much life into the character. Every little nuance,tic, etc.... He just nails it.

 

[dmcreif]

If you haven't signed the petition, here's the link: Sign the Petition

 

[dmcreif]

One thing that bothered me about the season is that Matt doesn't go around being the hero he's supposed to be, which is a weird complaint to be making since the season focuses so much on the conflict with Fisk, but that I find an important thing to point out, because the "hero" part of the show kinda gets put to the side for this season to focus on that conflict alone. And by that, I refer to stuff like Matt saving civilians, helping out the people of Hell's Kitchen, that kind of stuff, which we only see once in this season, and even then it directly connects to Fisk either way.

It would have been nice to have an explanation for Ghost Fisk at some point. I know, people are going to tell me "Matt was hallucinating Fisk due to his compromised mental state", but the show never addresses it. He just kinda hallucinates the guy for most of the season, then suddenly drops, and no explanation for that is ever given. It never coincides with anything in the story, it just happens, and then suddenly stops happening, for no apparent reason. I get that Matt's not the kind who actively seeks out help or would want to admit he's not well, but I feel this bit would've worked out if we had a scene where Matt said to Karen or Foggy or Maggie, "I'm having hallucinations."

One thing they could've done with the hallucinations would be to have Matt in a fugue state after the cab drowning, which would've been a perfect justification for him to stumble into some random fights and do some off-kilter street-level heroism with the spectre of Fisk looking on. Seems to me they could have done more with the idea if they were going to do it, and at the same time trimmed down the "Dex backstory" stageplay. (The stageplay is nice, but I think it overstays its welcome. It took way too long to make one single point about Dex.)

 

[Spider-Fan]

The hallucinations begin because Matt has isolated himself from everyone, so he is working things out on his own in his own head. They stop because he decides to not isolate himself anymore.

 

[dmcreif]

The hallucinations begin because Matt has isolated himself from everyone, so he is working things out on his own in his own head. They stop because he decides to not isolate himself anymore.

I feel it's more a criticism of the writers for not clarifying what’s going on. I'm not saying that they should spoonfeed us this stuff, but they should at the very least offer a little clarification. Are Matt's hallucinations a result of his mental state? Is he just playing out a conversation with Fisk in his head (sorta like Karen's nightmare after she killed Wesley)? Or is it just a more imagetic way for Matt to struggle with his inner thoughts than just show him in silent brooding? I dunno. It just feels like they could have done more with the idea if they were going to do it, because as a device in superhero storytelling it feels pretty played out at this point. (The only thing that I know for certain is that Matt is NOT literally talking to the abject nothing. I know this because if he was talking out loud, someone would have noticed it during his brief stint trying to infiltrate Fisk's building in episode 3, where he occasionally chats with his vision of Fisk mere feet away from others).

Speaking of things they could've done more with, Foggy's District Attorney campaign. There should have been way more press coverage of his DA campaign. Would've been nice to see Foggy handling the press a bit (which is a skill of his in the comics, and one that I absolutely don't understand why the writers didn't give us, given that across seasons 2 and 3, there were so many situations where the writers could have had Foggy verbally throw down with reporters). During Frank's trial in season 2, there were quite a number of scenes of Foggy and Karen approaching reporters but then walking away or not being accosted by them. In season 3, we should have gotten things like Foggy being asked about his affiliation with Daredevil and Luke Cage, or being asked to comment on his stances on vigilantism.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I feel it's more a criticism of the writers for not clarifying what’s going on. I'm not saying that they should spoonfeed us this stuff, but they should at the very least offer a little clarification. Are Matt's hallucinations a result of his mental state? Is he just playing out a conversation with Fisk in his head (sorta like Karen's nightmare after she killed Wesley)? Or is it just a more imagetic way for Matt to struggle with his inner thoughts than just show him in silent brooding? I dunno. It just feels like they could have done more with the idea if they were going to do it, because as a device in superhero storytelling it feels pretty played out at this point. (The only thing that I know for certain is that Matt is NOT literally talking to the abject nothing. I know this because if he was talking out loud, someone would have noticed it during his brief stint trying to infiltrate Fisk's building in episode 3, where he occasionally chats with his vision of Fisk mere feet away from others).

Speaking of things they could've done more with, Foggy's District Attorney campaign. There should have been way more press coverage of his DA campaign. Would've been nice to see Foggy handling the press a bit (which is a skill of his in the comics, and one that I absolutely don't understand why the writers didn't give us, given that across seasons 2 and 3, there were so many situations where the writers could have had Foggy verbally throw down with reporters). During Frank's trial in season 2, there were quite a number of scenes of Foggy and Karen approaching reporters but then walking away or not being accosted by them. In season 3, we should have gotten things like Foggy being asked about his affiliation with Daredevil and Luke Cage, or being asked to comment on his stances on vigilantism.

I don't think his mental state needed outright stated. Ambiguity in a film or show can be better. I'd rather they not give me a 10 minute scene of Matt explaining to someone he is hearing voices in his head or something. Film is a show don't tell medium. So, I don't agree with your assessment. Not everything needs explained or given a 20 minute monologue.

 

[dmcreif]

I'm not saying there needed to be a ten minute scene of Matt explaining that he's hearing voices (not to mention it would be a bit out-of-character, since the vigilantes/superheroes of the Netflix shows are seriously messed up people with HORRIBLE coping mechanisms and aren't in the habit of reaching out to others for help). Just a line or two of dialogue explaining what the show's intended stance on Matt's hallucinations is supposed to be. Again, I don’t mean that they need to spoonfeed us everything. But there are some things that are better left open to interpretation than others (like, it would've been nice to see the conversation Matt had with Nadeem in between episodes 11 and 12 where he explained how his heightened senses worked, but it wouldn't really add much to the story, so it's better offscreen).

 

[TheVileOne]

I would've actually much rather scene more visuals of his radar sense, which was depicted in this show a grand total of ONCE I think.

 

[flickchick85]

I feel like the whole "hallucinated character talking to the protagonist as a representative of their inner demons" is such a common trope at this point that it doesn't really need any clarification.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I feel like the whole "hallucinated character talking to the protagonist as a representative of their inner demons" is such a common trope at this point that it doesn't really need any clarification.

 

[dmcreif]

I would've actually much rather scene more visuals of his radar sense, which was depicted in this show a grand total of ONCE I think.

I think it's for the best they never went that route because I think some people were left with the impression Matt could see in shades of red or something.

 

[dmcreif]

I am curious of two things regarding Karen's visit to Fisk (didn't know whether to put this in the episode 8 discussion thread or here, so I'm just settling for here; apologies for the double post):

1. How would things have gone if Matt, not Foggy, had been the one to intervene? Personally my opinion of how that would've gone is "Fisk gets up as Karen reveals she killed Wesley, and he begins choking her to death, prompting Matt to attack Fisk (coming in through the secret bunker). Fisk lets go of Karen and fights Matt, Matt, enraged at Fisk for putting a hand on Karen, is distracted by Karen nearly getting hurt, and Fisk easily beats him. He then has his FBI guards take Matt and Karen away to be killed, and they fight off these guards in the elevator before escaping.
   
   
2. What do you think would have happened to Karen if no one had intervened? Would Fisk have killed her there and then or would he have had his men take her away to be killed elsewhere?
   

 

[dmcreif]

I mean, that's just one of a few things I'd have changed: I'd have had Matt be the one to intervene on Karen's visit to Fisk (giving us another Matt vs. Fisk fight scene), and I'd have had Matt be Karen's lawyer after the Bulletin attack.