Superman & Lois General News & Discussion Thread (TAG SPOILERS!)

[Iceman]

As per IMDB, the titles for the penultimate episode and season finale are as follows: "Injustice" and "What Kills You Only Makes You Stronger."

You're on a roll, Helbing! Please don't muck it up with "Evil Superman" BS now.

Oh oh *nervous*

 

[elgaz]

There have been so many Superman/Clark identity discussions over the years, on this forum and many others, I don't think anyone will ever get past the believability aspect of it lol.

I think you just have to employ some suspension of disbelief and align with one of the theories about how he isn't recognised; I like the one where it's postulated that because Superman doesn't wear a mask, no-one suspects he has any other identity at all other than the audience - the movie characters just assume he's Superman 24/7 and always flying round saving people.

And even if they did suspect it, only a relatively small number of people in the world who see him in Clark guise and they'd maybe just put it down to a resemblance - I remember passing a celeb once in the street and as I didn't expect to see them there, I honestly thought it was just a person who looked like them. It's only when I saw on social media the next day they were filming in my city that I realised it was them. Add in some glasses, some slouching, a hairstyle change, maybe it's not so crazy.

 

[Dr.]

There have been so many Superman/Clark identity discussions over the years, on this forum and many others, I don't think anyone will ever get past the believability aspect of it lol.

I think you just have to employ some suspension of disbelief and align with one of the theories about how he isn't recognised; I like the one where it's postulated that because Superman doesn't wear a mask, no-one suspects he has any other identity at all other than the audience - the movie characters just assume he's Superman 24/7 and always flying round saving people.

And even if they did suspect it, only a relatively small number of people in the world who see him in Clark guise and they'd maybe just put it down to a resemblance - I remember passing a celeb once in the street and as I didn't expect to see them there, I honestly thought it was just a person who looked like them. It's only when I saw on social media the next day they were filming in my city that I realised it was them. Add in some glasses, some slouching, a hairstyle change, maybe it's not so crazy.

I suppose there are different levels of willingness in the "willing suspension of disbelief." The scenario you describe seems superficially plausible. I.e., many of us have had the experience of failing to recognize someone (even a close friend or relative) due to a novel context or some minor physical difference (new hairstyle, clothing, etc.). So on that basis, we imagine that the Clark/Superman ruse could be effective. But while this sort of "hiding in plain sight" is often able to fool on the first glance, it typically fails on the second or third. Thus, the notion that a main character (Perry, Lana, et. al.) could have extended interactions with both Supes and CK and not see through the minimalist disguise strikes many as, well, silly.

More generally: I'd claim that we, as audience, are usually fine with suspending our own disbelief — because that's a typical requirement of engaging with fiction (especially fantasy fiction). But it's harder, I think, to suspend disbelief on behalf of in-universe characters. So when these characters display less than expected levels of common sense or observational skill, the implausibility (of, e.g., the glasses disguise) becomes more conspicuous.

 

[Iceman]

Is the new episode not out yet?

 

[flickchick85]

Is the new episode not out yet?

No they took a 1-week break. New episode next week. Sucks they took their week off on Supes’ big day, but oh well.

 

[Iceman]

No they took a 1-week break. New episode next week. Sucks they took their week off on Supes’ big day, but oh well.

Oh damn, the first time all season I've been totally ready for it! Yeah that is a shame. Would have wanted a great episode on that day. Thanks for the info, will stop trying then (mine is usually delayed for some reason on the CW site anyway).

 

[Slick]

So Matteo is definitely Bruno Mannheim‘s son right?

 

[flickchick85]

So Matteo is definitely Bruno Mannheim‘s son right?

I’m assuming so.

 

[Perfect Cell]

Matteo Mannheim is a great comic book name.

 

[herolee10]

Given how short this season is, I really hope that we get to see Clark Kent doing some actual journalism soon. It feels like Lois's cancer arc has taken priority over everything else.

 

[Gaultheria]

More generally: I'd claim that we, as audience, are usually fine with suspending our own disbelief — because that's a typical requirement of engaging with fiction (especially fantasy fiction). But it's harder, I think, to suspend disbelief on behalf of in-universe characters. So when these characters display less than expected levels of common sense or observational skill, the implausibility (of, e.g., the glasses disguise) becomes more conspicuous.

I like the "it's all a psionic power" explanation. If Superman was actually super-strong, then in 3x01 when he reached up to catch the falling crane component (including its massive counterweight) so off to the side from its centre of mass, it should have crumpled at the point of impact and torn away from his hand. There's something else going on in-universe, sometimes called "tactile telekinesis", beyond the surface explanation of humanlike strength scaled way up. Similarly, for invulnerability in John Byrne's Man of Steel comic, Superman's body wasn't any tougher than a human body, but rather it emitted an aura that protected him and the skin-tight parts of his costume, a power that depended on his confidence in it.

Generalizing from that, I'd say that Superman's power works the way he expects it to work, in ways that he can easily imagine. Part of that power seems to be "This disguise should work", and so it does, which reinforces his confidence in the disguise.

 

[elgaz]

I suppose there are different levels of willingness in the "willing suspension of disbelief." The scenario you describe seems superficially plausible. I.e., many of us have had the experience of failing to recognize someone (even a close friend or relative) due to a novel context or some minor physical difference (new hairstyle, clothing, etc.). So on that basis, we imagine that the Clark/Superman ruse could be effective. But while this sort of "hiding in plain sight" is often able to fool on the first glance, it typically fails on the second or third. Thus, the notion that a main character (Perry, Lana, et. al.) could have extended interactions with both Supes and CK and not see through the minimalist disguise strikes many as, well, silly.

More generally: I'd claim that we, as audience, are usually fine with suspending our own disbelief — because that's a typical requirement of engaging with fiction (especially fantasy fiction). But it's harder, I think, to suspend disbelief on behalf of in-universe characters. So when these characters display less than expected levels of common sense or observational skill, the implausibility (of, e.g., the glasses disguise) becomes more conspicuous.

All fair points

Ironically, Zack Snyder has released some photos (costume tests/marketing I assume) today from MOS and BvS which weren't seen before, I was interested in the Superman and Clark ones especially - when you see them together there really is quite a difference in how he looks.

JUSTICE LEAGUE Director Zack Snyder Shares New Photos DCEU's Superman, Lex Luthor, Jimmy Olsen, And More

 

[Dr.]

I like the "it's all a psionic power" explanation. If Superman was actually super-strong, then in 3x01 when he reached up to catch the falling crane component (including its massive counterweight) so off to the side from its centre of mass, it should have crumpled at the point of impact and torn away from his hand. There's something else going on in-universe, sometimes called "tactile telekinesis", beyond the surface explanation of humanlike strength scaled way up.

Superman, himself, defies physics. By definition. But as far as I'm concerned, Supes can't/shouldn't be able to control the physical reality of other objects. (That would be tantamount to magic.) And I think this is a useful way to limit his apparent omnipotence — without actually depowering him. Of course, this means that Supes may have to work harder and smarter to perform a "super save." Admittedly, though, this doesn't happen that often. It's easier (lazier storytelling) if he can just arbitrarily suspend physics and call it "tactile telekinesis."

Similarly, for invulnerability in John Byrne's Man of Steel comic, Superman's body wasn't any tougher than a human body, but rather it emitted an aura that protected him and the skin-tight parts of his costume, a power that depended on his confidence in it.

Generalizing from that, I'd say that Superman's power works the way he expects it to work, in ways that he can easily imagine. Part of that power seems to be "This disguise should work", and so it does, which reinforces his confidence in the disguise.

I'm actually fond of the catch-all "aura" concept. When a sci-fi "explanation" is nonsense, the less said about it, the better. And "aura" is beautifully concise. But I disagree that "aura" can rationalize the CK disguise. Comics/movies/TV are visual media. So absent a physical morphing of facial features (which I take to be a non-starter), you're asking the audience to "pretend to see" a convincing disguise which isn't actually present. I'm afraid we're stuck with the eyeglasses.

 

[Dr.]

...Zack Snyder has released some photos (costume tests/marketing I assume) today from MOS and BvS which weren't seen before, I was interested in the Superman and Clark ones especially - when you see them together there really is quite a difference in how he looks.

I guess. But I think the main advantage the Snyderverse had was that lots of people knew (or quickly came to know) the secret identity. So their "suspension of disbelief" wasn't required. And those who didn't know the secret identity never encountered both Supes and CK. It was one or the other. So the audience was never asked to believe that certain characters were spectacularly and implausibly unobservant.

 

[Slick]

There’s a very spoiler-filled synopsis for the May 9th episode “Guess Who’s Coming To Dinner” so read it if you want. I read it because I’m noisy lol.

 

[Pennywise]

 

[herolee10]

Feels very reminiscent of Kingpin from Daredevil Season 3.

 

[Iceman]

What was the reason for the 1 week break? Is this common? Did they do it in the other 2 seasons too?

 

[squeekness]

What was the reason for the 1 week break? Is this common? Did they do it in the other 2 seasons too?

Might be to stretch the season out to catch up on finishing the last episodes.

 

[flickchick85]

What was the reason for the 1 week break? Is this common? Did they do it in the other 2 seasons too?

They did MUCH longer breaks in previous seasons, and more frequently. Supposedly one of the main reasons for the late premiere date this season was to cut down on that. Based on when the finale’s supposed to be, I think we’ve got two more weeks of breaks coming up at some point. Dunno if it will be two more 1-week break or one 2-week break, but this definitely isn’t as bad as previous seasons regardless.

 

[Iceman]

They did MUCH longer breaks in previous seasons, and more frequently. Supposedly one of the main reasons for the late premiere date this season was to cut down on that. Based on when the finale’s supposed to be, I think we’ve got two more weeks of breaks coming up at some point. Dunno if it will be two more 1-week break or one 2-week break, but this definitely isn’t as bad as previous seasons regardless.

Thanks for the info. Is having breaks a common thing amongst CW shows in general? I wouldn’t have come across it before as I’ve never watched CW shows live - we were always delayed till I got direct access.

 

[squeekness]

Thanks for the info. Is having breaks a common thing amongst CW shows in general? I wouldn’t have come across it before as I’ve never watched CW shows live - we were always delayed till I got direct access.

It's common with a LOT of shows. I watch Will Trent on ABC and they took two breaks of about three weeks each. I hate that because it slows the momentum.

 

[Iceman]

It's common with a LOT of shows. I watch Will Trent on ABC and they took two breaks of about three weeks each. I hate that because it slows the momentum.

Thanks. Weird how I only now came across this in 2023 lol. 3 weeks wow, that’s too much.

 

[flickchick85]

Thanks for the info. Is having breaks a common thing amongst CW shows in general? I wouldn’t have come across it before as I’ve never watched CW shows live - we were always delayed till I got direct access.

Yes most broadcast network shows take time off in the middle of seasons. Sometimes it’s to accommodate other programming or just to avoid competing with other programming, sometimes it’s to save their most explosive episodes for May sweeps (when the advertisers examine their ratings to decide next year’s ad prices), sometimes it’s to avoid bad ratings during holidays (like spring break), sometimes it’s just to give the post-production teams time to catch up to air. But it’s a pretty regular thing for the broadcast network TV business model, since unlike streaming, they don’t film their whole show a year before they start airing or anything like that.

 

[flickchick85]

Thanks. Weird how I only now came across this in 2023 lol. 3 weeks wow, that’s too much.

That was regular for S&L before. Hell, last season we had a 5 or 6 week gap at one point. It was brutal.