Far From Home Spider-Man Sequel General Discussion and Speculation

[MaceB]

Saying something that hasn't worked before will work with 100% certainty because of a good screenwriter is severe overconfidence.

That's very true... an overstuffed script does carry a lot of risk. That being said, an overstuffed script can be done successfully with the right team... as Infinity War shows.

So, nothing is 100% certain - not that it will be a success, nor that it'll be a failure. All things being equal though, you're right, it's safer to work with less than to work with more IMO.

 

[ehh]

OK, you two, how do you explain formerly well-regarded superhero series fizzling once they stuffed in more than two villains? Spider-Man 3, Dark Knight Rises... even Amazing Spider-Man was much better regarded than its overstuffed sequel. Saying something that hasn't worked before will work with 100% certainty because of a good screenwriter is severe overconfidence.
The script for Homecoming wasn't great, and the best-written part was Toomes. To even have a chance of doing what you two are so certain of would require firing their existing writers for someone with a completely different set of strengths.

Didn't the Dark Knight have multiple villains to begin with? Joker, Two-Face, Scarecrow, Sal Maroni...? And that film was near perfect.

Characters are characters, whether they are villains or not. While Civil War had one villain (Zemo), it had to balance tons of superheroes in one film.

 

[zeptron]

OK, you two, how do you explain formerly well-regarded superhero series fizzling once they stuffed in more than two villains? Spider-Man 3, Dark Knight Rises... even Amazing Spider-Man was much better regarded than its overstuffed sequel. Saying something that hasn't worked before will work with 100% certainty because of a good screenwriter is severe overconfidence.

Well the problem with Spider-man 3 at least wasn't the simple fact that it had more than two villains. It was that none of them were connected and were all over the place. Villains ultimately need picked to compliment the story, not distract from it. Which is why certain villain team ups work (because they make sense) and others don't. What works? Sandman and Vulture, Electro and Sandman, Vulture and Shocker, Lizard and Kraven, Venom and Carnage etc. Sandman and Venom however didn't. Same goes for Goblin and Electro in ASM2. I don't think Rhino should even count as a villain there since his role was nothing more than a cameo and he didn't even become Rhino until the very end after the main plot was over.

As for The Dark Knight Rises, for the majority of the film, Bane was the only one that was actually presented as a villain. Catwoman was more of an anti-hero/anti-villain and Miranda Tate(Talia) wasn't revealed to be a villain until the end. Hell if you count Falcone in Batman Begins and Maroni in The Dark Knight, then those films actually had more villains that TDKR.

 

[ehh]

Well the problem with Spider-man 3 at least wasn't the simple fact that it had more than two villains. It was that none of them were connected and were all over the place. Villains ultimately need picked to compliment the story, not distract from it. Which is why certain villain team ups work (because they make sense) and others don't. What works? Sandman and Vulture, Electro and Sandman, Vulture and Shocker, Lizard and Kraven, Venom and Carnage etc. Sandman and Venom however didn't. Same goes for Goblin and Electro in ASM. I don't think Rhino should even count as a villain there since his role was nothing more than a cameo and he didn't even become Rhino until the very end after the main plot was over.

As for The Dark Knight Rises, for the majority of the film, Bane was the only one that was actually presented as a villain. Catwoman was more of an anti-hero/anti-villain and Miranda Tate(Talia) wasn't revealed to be a villain until the end. Hell if you count Falcone in Batman Begins and Maroni in The Dark Knight, then those films actually had more villains that TDRK.

Agreed 100%

 

[Blood Spider]

Well the problem with Spider-man 3 at least wasn't the simple fact that it had more than two villains. It was that none of them were connected and were all over the place. Villains ultimately need picked to compliment the story, not distract from it. Which is why certain villain team ups work (because they make sense) and others don't. What works? Sandman and Vulture, Electro and Sandman, Vulture and Shocker, Lizard and Kraven, Venom and Carnage etc. Sandman and Venom however didn't. Same goes for Goblin and Electro in ASM2. I don't think Rhino should even count as a villain there since his role was nothing more than a cameo and he didn't even become Rhino until the very end after the main plot was over.

As for The Dark Knight Rises, for the majority of the film, Bane was the only one that was actually presented as a villain. Catwoman was more of an anti-hero/anti-villain and Miranda Tate(Talia) wasn't revealed to be a villain until the end. Hell if you count Falcone in Batman Begins and Maroni in The Dark Knight, then those films actually had more villains that TDKR.

Regarding Spider-Man 3, there was another problem, imo: Topher Grace's Venom was atrocious.

 

[Web-Head]

If they incorporate Jameson as a character, with the spider slayers in the mix, I would be happy with Scorpion being the main baddie.

That's what I originally wanted for the sequel after the events of Homecoming. I thought it was a natural progression.

You have the spider slayers with Scorpion being the ultimate slayer.

Another thing I just realized is we still don't know who bought Stark Tower. Anyone think we'll find out in the sequel?

 

[GoldGoblin]

Since half the population was wiped out in IW maybe Toomes,Shocker,and Gargan escaped prison and have been busy.
Like going to Wakanda and taking everything from it since no one is there protecting it.

 

[Venom'sDad]

OK, you two, how do you explain formerly well-regarded superhero series fizzling once they stuffed in more than two villains? Spider-Man 3, Dark Knight Rises... even Amazing Spider-Man was much better regarded than its overstuffed sequel. Saying something that hasn't worked before will work with 100% certainty because of a good screenwriter is severe overconfidence.
The script for Homecoming wasn't great, and the best-written part was Toomes. To even have a chance of doing what you two are so certain of would require firing their existing writers for someone with a completely different set of strengths.

I was speaking in general, about experience writers/directors/producers...not necessarily firing the current guys. With that said, the guys that "ARE" in place, seem to have a grasp of things. The problem I personal see with those example you gave, was the inability to fashion a supporting villain. Who exactly was the main villain in SM3...was it Sandman or Venom. In TASM2 was it Harry Goblin or Electro. No problems with TDKR otherthan editing...some arcs did not work & push the film pace forward, making it drag & too long.

In three films thus far...we have seen the Russos & their writers do a good job in discerning villain roles as well as juggling heroes roles. The same can be said for 1st timer Coogler & Waititi.

Now I readily admit introducing 3 more members of the Six would be slightly different: but, not really, if the writers don't go SM3 & try to make all three equally important as main characters. The level of importances in their particular roles has to be discernible for the pacing & flow of the story being told. SM:HC did that with Vulture & Shocker as well as Tinkerer. They had very clear discernible roles & importance in the overall scheme of things. Toomes got the main backstory the other two just a brief mentioning as they sat around & reminisce about their employment together...very clever & effective.

That's given a clear objective & the writers responding in a clever way. That's possibly 2 members of the Six right there in the field, with the third probably being support for the eventual team....all in one film, while exploring the title character & his supporting characters.

 

[Toomes' Phone]

Most Marvel films have multiple villains in them anyway. The difference between Homecoming and SM3/TASM2 is that the writers made sure they prioritized one as the big bad (Vulture), and gave the other ones smaller but signifigant roles (Shocker #1 and #2, Tinkerer). I will say though that I'd prefer if HoCo2 just stopped with Mysterio and Vulture, and teased someone like Kraven at the end.

 

[Web-Head]

What do we think the title is gonna be? Spider-Man: Midterms? Maybe something Mysterio related like
Spider-Man: The Madness of Mysterio?

 

[CaptainWagner]

OK, you two, how do you explain formerly well-regarded superhero series fizzling once they stuffed in more than two villains? Spider-Man 3, Dark Knight Rises... even Amazing Spider-Man was much better regarded than its overstuffed sequel. Saying something that hasn't worked before will work with 100% certainty because of a good screenwriter is severe overconfidence.
The script for Homecoming wasn't great, and the best-written part was Toomes. To even have a chance of doing what you two are so certain of would require firing their existing writers for someone with a completely different set of strengths.

How many movies with multiple villains to we need before people keep trying to make this argument? It's all about how it's handled. SM3's problems were rooted in bizarre character choices for "dark Peter" and a horrible execution of Venom, not to mention a barely followable script. TDKR's problems had nothing to do with the villains, and it still got great reviews critically. It just disappointed some fans.

I thought the script for Homecoming was great, so I guess that's where our expectations diverge.

 

[Marvel Spider]

What do we think the title is gonna be? Spider-Man: Midterms? Maybe something Mysterio related like
Spider-Man: The Madness of Mysterio?

After carefully thinking about it for about thirty seconds:


Spider-Man: Aftermath.


You get the Avengers fallout acknowledgment and another school-related pun! Everyone wins.

 

[SP1D3YTHW1P]

What do we think the title is gonna be? Spider-Man: Midterms? Maybe something Mysterio related like
Spider-Man: The Madness of Mysterio?

Spider-Man: The Next Semester? IDK

 

[Blood Spider]

After carefully thinking about it for about thirty seconds:


Spider-Man: Aftermath.


You get the Avengers fallout acknowledgment and another school-related pun! Everyone wins.

I could get behind this.

 

[ehh]

Spider-Man: London Calling

 

[Marvel united]

Spider-Man: London Calling

Wasn't that the shooting title for Amazing Spider-Man 2?

 

[ehh]

Wasn't that the shooting title for Amazing Spider-Man 2?

Yes. I was joking lol.

 

[SpeterMan3]

After carefully thinking about it for about thirty seconds:


Spider-Man: Aftermath.


You get the Avengers fallout acknowledgment and another school-related pun! Everyone wins.

Oooh, I like that.

 

[PeterBenParker]

Spider-Man: Curtain Call

 

[SpeterMan3]

Spider-Man: He Feels Better Now

 

[Village_Idiot]

Spider-man : Returns From The Dead

 

[DyeLorean]

After carefully thinking about it for about thirty seconds:


Spider-Man: Aftermath.


You get the Avengers fallout acknowledgment and another school-related pun! Everyone wins.

 

[SP1D3YTHW1P]

 

[MarvelRudi]

Spider-man: Back to Reality
Spider-man: Field Trip

 

[pixen]

Been away from this forum for a bit... Any idea who the “femme fatale” role could be? Was there any talk about it at all?