Civil War The Official Captain America 3 News & Speculation Thread

[Shikamaru]

Say, what happened to the Russos' comments about AoU being a "break point" for Cap and then getting back to TWS' loose threads in Cap 3? Now the AoU events directly lead to Cap 3...

 

[Mr.M]

So all I'mreading is iit's Tony this and Tony that reconciling this reconciling that. Is this the Captain America threquel thread or is this no longer a Captain America film with any of Cap's rogues gallery involved?

I'm shocked to be honest, especially after the success of the last film, that they had to resort to this. Pure greed. RDJ has already banked a small fraction of a billion with this franchise, and they just had to squeeze him into one more film. I am a huge fan of him and the take on the character, but it is a little overkill for me, coming off of AoU and now this only a year later.

 

[IncognitoWalrus]

I really like the theory about Bucky being the reason why Rogers and Stark start fighting each other. It makes sense and it would be a logical progression of The Winter Soldier.

I think some of us need to stop seeing heroes as centerpieces of their respective films and just as characters. Hating on Batman and hating on Iron Man for showing up in their respective boy scouts' films is easy to do when you view them as primary protagonists.

If we view them as characters, it becomes much easier to accept the possibility that they might be supporting players/deteuragonists.

 

[Dark Raven]

Surely there must be other good Captain America stories to tell? It's not like Civil War was some beloved story loved by all fans either, certainly not in the same way as Winter Soldier was. Sometimes it feels almost as if Marvel these days is treating anything written in the last century as old hat and as if the Marvel universe only began this century or that all the old stories aren't worth telling in cinematic form.

 

[Village_Idiot]

The Civil War story line makes no sense , there is like only 7 people with super powers , and their identities are already known anyways , so what would be the point

 

[Mr.M]

The biggest issue I have is it feels like the only time the Avengers existed as a team was during a brief period between TWS and AoU that we never got to see.

I mean, I thought the first film was a setup for what would eventually lead to a team. The "Avengers" as we knew them in the comics didn't exist yet, it was just a group that came together to stop a specific threat then went their separate ways. The "A Tower" at the end hinted at what was about to come, at the Avengers as we know them. As in an Avengers Tower, day-to-day normal interactions, a team dynamic fully established, etc.

Now it looks like the team will fall apart in A2, then we get Tony and Cap at odds, then if the rumors are true we get a whole new team in A3 or a "Marvel vs Thanos" film under the Avengers logo, where everyone fights Thanos. Avenger or not.

If that's indeed the case, then in the 10+ years the MCU would have existed by then, the only time we would've seen the Avengers as a fully functioning team was during the first few minutes of A2?

I really resist this idea. It feels like there never was a team, outside a marketing standpoint, and more like a few individuals that just happened to cross paths on a few occasions. If that's the only time I'm getting to see them as a team - a glimpse in the overall grand scheme of things - why should I be invested when that team falls apart and Cap and Tony have to fight?

Avengers shouldn't be a team like X-Men (not that that was a great team by any stretch in that cinematic trilogy) like they are in the comics. These egos are too big to stay together for too long. That's what makes it special when you put them in the room together. It's so freaking epic that it can't consume an entire two hour picture. When you actually see Hulk catch Iron Man, you capture just how epic the team can be, but these have to be fleeting moments. You can't have them going gangbusters for two hours singing Kumbaya at the end of the day. That's why B v S is a versus movie and won't have the two back to back kicking Eisenberg's Luthor in the rear end all film. These are super egos that are constantly butting heads and shoving one another out of the way, while struggling to get out of their own way.

 

[Shikamaru]

Avengers shouldn't be a team like X-Men (not that that was a great team by any stretch even in that trilogy) like they are in the comics. These egos are too big to stay together for too long. That's what makes it special when you put them in the room together. It's so freaking epic that it can't consume an entire two hour picture. When you actually see Hulk catch Iron Man, you capture just how epic the team can be, but these have to be fleeting moments. You can't have them going gangbusters for two hours singing Kumbaya at the end of the day. That's why B v S is a versus movie and won't have the two back to back kicking Eisenberg's Luthor in the rear end all film. These are super egos that are constantly butting heads and shoving one another out of the way, while struggling to get out of their own way.

You're under the assumption they have to stay together permanently in order for them to feel like a true team. That's not the case a lot of the time, yet they still have that team dynamic there.

Plus they have stuck as a team for long periods of time without their egos constantly getting in their way. Not saying the films should do that, but clearly it can and has worked if Marvel ever has to resort to that.

 

[Son of Coul]

Stark isn't going to be the villain any more than Bucky was the villain in Cap 2. I also think it's not going to be a cookie cutter Civil War plot, anymore than IM3 was loosely based on Extremis.

They still have a major plot point of Bucky to tie up, and that's going to be the point of contention. There might be some political plot points of the SH registration act, but I think a major point of contention will be Cap going after Bucky.

WE KNOW WHO KILLED TONY'S PARENTS! That is going to be a major plot contention in this, you can be sure of that. Iron Man isn't going to be a bad guy, but he will want to go after Bucky for what he did to his parents. Cap wants to save Bucky.

I bet you anything the plot of the movie is going to be a race to find and stop the Winter Soldier.

This is more well-thought out than the actual Civil War story. I, too, think (and hope) it'll basically be INO. When has Marvel ever directly adapted a comic arc? The closest was TWS, and that basically just kept Bucky's return/backstory, and even that acts as the heart of the movie - the actual plot is completely different. I feel this'll be the same way.

And please don't drag Spidey into this, Marvel. My fingers are crossed that's just the Planet Hulk rumor all over again.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Oh, I most certainly agree that this won't resemble the comic book storyline much. I personally think Stark is going to think that the Avengers are dangerous after his involvement with Ultron leads to what happens, and his regret for it will cloud his judgement and make him feel they need to be controlled. This won't be about secret IDs.

But, even as a loose adaptation, I am worried as a Cap fan that they may try and off Cap (at least until Avengers 4 or Cap 4), and as a fan of the series, MCU, and Cap in particular, I absolutely don't want that. I think worries like that are legitimate. I don't think Iron Man will take over Cap's movie. I think the Russos will make it still clearly Cap's film. I am more worried about the conclusion.

 

[TalismanRing]

I couldn't agree more.

I don't have any problem seeing Evans gong toe to toe with RDJ and the writers and director love Cap and have done so well by him and from every interview respect and care for the character so much I don't fear that he'll get overshadowed in his own movie.

I do fear what the end of the movie might bring and how it means Steve might be removed from the MCU for awhile. I'm (almost - OK not even close to almost) prepared to be emotionally devastated but not because Steve is forced to play second fiddle in his own movie.

 

[Moridin]

Not really. Everyone, including us, thought that Howard died in a siple car crash but it was revealed in tws that his death was made to look like it when in fact he was actually murdered.

I recall Favreau, possibly in the IM1 commentary or DVD extras, saying that their intent was to imply or allude to the idea that Stane had Howard killed and made it look like an accident. So the idea has been around from the start of the MCU.

On that note, people assume that Bucky will reappear some time in the MCU, but that's only because the comics have shown that he became the Winter Soldier. We saw Bucky fall to his death though in Cap 1. I don't recall it's ever been implied that there's any kind of Winter Soldier in the MCU or that there will necessarily be one when CA:TFA eventually gets a sequel. Cap 2 will probably be about the Red Skull or Baron Zemo.

EDIT: How come there's a Captain America 3 thread?

There's plenty of foreshadowing of Bucky becoming Winter Soldier in TFA.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

Say, what happened to the Russos' comments about AoU being a "break point" for Cap and then getting back to TWS' loose threads in Cap 3? Now the AoU events directly lead to Cap 3...

Break point, meaning that Cap probably won't be actively searching for Bucky in AoU....which still seems to be the case.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

Howard and Maria died in a car crash that was reported and believed to be an accident. In TWS, Zola tells Steve and Nat then when people got to close to figuring out who HYDRA was within SHIELD then accidents happened. Then a photo of Dominic Cooper as Howard Stark was shown.

That it was staged as a car accident I believe pretty much points to another HYDRA assassin since the WS's M.O. is his sniper rifle - like how he took out Fury in Steve's apt and tried to take out everyone else in a manner that could hardly be swept under the rug as an accident.

WS would've killed Fury earlier and without a sniper rifle if Fury hadn't escaped after that car explosion.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

It just dawned on me that this means likely no Sin, no Zemo, and no NuRedSkull…

Boo.

I think we'll at least see Zemo, Zola and Crossbones in Cap 3. Even with Stark in, I expect there to be a strong HYDRA presence since this is still Cap's movie.

 

[TalismanRing]

WS would've killed Fury earlier and without a sniper rifle if Fury hadn't escaped after that car explosion.

Yes, he'd have shot him with another gun after blowing up his car in broad daylight on a public street. That's not exactly along the same subtle lines as staging a car crash to look like an accident.

That scene though does make me laugh when Widow is telling Steve all about how he's like a ghost - yeah practically invisible in black armored leather and a metal arm, armed to the teeth blowing **** up in broad daylight. That line fit when his first appearance was written to be sniping Fury in Steve's apt not so much after the revision.

 

[marcvader]

Well one positive I'll take from all of this is finally seeing Stark and/or Iron Man overshadowed and clearly being second fiddle as well as not having "the" hero moment. Right?

 

[TalismanRing]

Well, he might just wind up with one of the most iconic emotional scenes while Evans gets to just play *sob* dead.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Man thank God Bale isn't Cap. Dude is too ****ing method. He would have taken Cap's death a little too far.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Well one positive I'll take from all of this is finally seeing Stark and/or Iron Man overshadowed and clearly being second fiddle as well as not having "the" hero moment. Right?

Agreed. If done right, this could be the movie that cements Cap as the MCU's #1 most important hero.

 

[Katsuro]

I'm really thinking (hoping) that Cap 3 isn't actually a Civil War movie, but rather the build up to an entire phase of Civil War. Civil War just seems far too complex to put in a movie under simply the Captain America banner. Plus, we're hearing that Downey Jr.'s role was originally going to be small, and he pushed to have it bigger. It seems odd that the original plan would've had Downey Jr. play only a small role in a Civil War movie, unless the thinking is that a Cap movie feat. an Iron Man cameo turned into a Civil War movie at Downey Jr.'s insistence. But it seems hard to believe they'd alter the entire course of the Marvel Universe just for him.

So instead, I think this movie will be primarily about Cap's search for Bucky, along with a regular Cap villain, with a major plot thread being about a growing divide between Cap and Iron Man. Then I think Avengers 3 will carry on from that, featuring Iron Man and his new team of Avengers. Perhaps even having Avengers 3 be the real Civil War movie. Then Avengers 4 is the regrouping of the heroes to unite and defeat Thanos.

Also, super awesome idea: introduce Spidey at the closing moments of Age of Ultron. There are those rumors of a scene in which the new Avengers team is recruiting, imagine the audience freak-outs if Spider-Man shows up in that scene (better yet if they kept the secret until then). Spidey would then be in Avengers 3, setting him up for his role in Civil War.

 

[falconcrest87]

What is all this about the Winter Soldier M.O.?! His "M.O." is whatever they tell him his M.O. is. He's a master assassin! If he is proficient at Russian knife fighting, I'm pretty sure he knows how to cut a brake line.

 

[Heretic]

In the comics, the story after The Winter Soldier involved Crossbones, Sharon Carter, Cap searching for Bucky and the head of the parent company of Roxxon. Sure...there were other things (like Red Skull's daughter and the Cosmic Cube...and HOPEFULLY they leave out the Red Skull's return, I've seen enough "you thought I was dead but I'm not" scenes in Marvel already) that won't make the transition, but I think it is VERY safe to assume that parts of that storyline will be included in Cap 3.

So...maybe instead of the head of Roxxon we get the head of Stark? Maybe Stark is after Bucky for killing his dad and Cap thinks he can be rehabilitated instead?

Faustus got involved...and he's been mentioned a few times on Agents of SHIELD in regards to brainwashing...so maybe Bucky wants revenge on him?

Eh...its all speculation...but I trust the team in place. If the events of this movie are hints at a future Civil War, then great.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Hopefully we'll see this guy in the MCU:

Spoiler

 

[TalismanRing]

What is all this about the Winter Soldier M.O.?! His "M.O." is whatever they tell him his M.O. is. He's a master assassin! If he is proficient at Russian knife fighting, I'm pretty sure he knows how to cut a brake line.

HYDRA is so hard up for assassins they have to defrost someone to cut a break line? Why? They have an entire STRIKE team on call not to mention weasels like Sitwell. And nothing in BW's rundown of him or what we saw on screen from him screamed subtle - he seems more designed to terrorize or instill fear before he kills not go about behind the scenes arranging "accidents". I mean really, that outfit and that hair aren't exactly low key.

 

[TalismanRing]

I'm really thinking (hoping) that Cap 3 isn't actually a Civil War movie, but rather the build up to an entire phase of Civil War. Civil War just seems far too complex to put in a movie under simply the Captain America banner. Plus, we're hearing that Downey Jr.'s role was originally going to be small, and he pushed to have it bigger. It seems odd that the original plan would've had Downey Jr. play only a small role in a Civil War movie, unless the thinking is that a Cap movie feat. an Iron Man cameo turned into a Civil War movie at Downey Jr.'s insistence. But it seems hard to believe they'd alter the entire course of the Marvel Universe just for him.

So instead, I think this movie will be primarily about Cap's search for Bucky, along with a regular Cap villain, with a major plot thread being about a growing divide between Cap and Iron Man. Then I think Avengers 3 will carry on from that, featuring Iron Man and his new team of Avengers. Perhaps even having Avengers 3 be the real Civil War movie. Then Avengers 4 is the regrouping of the heroes to unite and defeat Thanos.

Also, super awesome idea: introduce Spidey at the closing moments of Age of Ultron. There are those rumors of a scene in which the new Avengers team is recruiting, imagine the audience freak-outs if Spider-Man shows up in that scene (better yet if they kept the secret until then). Spidey would then be in Avengers 3, setting him up for his role in Civil War.

What would be the point of having a "real Civil War" movie afterwards without Cap. He's the main player in the story along with Tony. The dynamic between them is what drives the story.

I do see villains being introduced though in a parallel story, just as they also existed in the comic, but don't see the search for Bucky as a main story but rather part of larger events.