Superhero Cinematic Civil War - Part 58

[Iceman]

My mate just met Chris Hemsworth at some esports thing he's helping organise in Dubai, very cool!

 

[Drizzle]

Outside of that, Namor was cool even with his ugly Yeezys, AB was amazing, Lupita was great, and I enjoyed seeing Okoye again. Riri was fun, but so unnecessary, as was the entire CIA plotline, which just slowed the film down. Could of done with more M'Baku.

Agreed on all that.

Spoiler

I don't know why they were so hellbent on bringing Riri into the fold before Ironheart, could have been a decision made after the passing of Boseman and rewrites, but I liked what she brought to the table. The entire CIA plotline could have been left on the cutting room floor though, with the exception of the first scene where Shuri and Okoye find Ross to help them locate Riri. I love Julia Louis Dreyfus but the movie would have been paced a little better without that storyline.

There definitely needed to be more M'Baku...HOWEVER...if he's watching the throne until Shuri is ready then what I really hope is that one of the upcoming Wakanda shows on D+ is about him. Think about the gold that could be mined with M'Baku as the de facto king being flanked by his warriors at a United Nations session and just having them bark at all the crusty old ambassadors who are after Wakanda's vibranium.

 

[The Caped Knight]

 

[mclay18]

I expected a good cinemascore but not sure how well that will translate into repeat value compared to other films that receive an A score (I want it to do well). It's obvious high quality to the masses but that doesn't mean they will want to keep going back given the tone and length. Chadwick is such a huge miss. I feel a serious but upbeat sequel with him still as the lead could have done mega-numbers.

I think Wakanda Forever would get the kind of MAJOR box office lift Furious 7 and TDK did if Chadwick shot all or most of his scenes before dying like Paul Walker or Heath Ledger did. It would be hitting the numbers the first BP film did on opening weekend.

The pallor of WF as it is -- with Chadwick's absence from the start of production -- it limits how many repeat viewings fans did for BP. Some will show up to honor Chadwick's legacy but IDK. It'll own the whole month and early December before Way of Water opens.

 

[OtherwiseKnownAs]

Spoiler: Wakanda Forever

Gotta say, of all the ways to circumvent an actor's real tragic passing, replacing them with their hitherto unmentioned long-lost son who shares his name is probably the most hilarious

 

[Batgirl0202]

The release schedule seems pretty light until Avatar opens December 16 so we might be looking at some good legs here...

 

[Iceman]

The release schedule seems pretty light until Avatar opens December 16 so we might be looking at some good legs here...

Good numbers. I was hoping it might get as high as $200m until recently but these are solid.

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Less than Dr. Strange 2 seems underwhelming.

 

[Ninjablade]

Watched the movie, still collecting my thoughts. The Latinx savages were pretty much as racists as I expected. Especially in the light of the comparison to the Wakanda folk. The commentary on colonialism is lost when you know, disconnect the people from it.

Spoiler

The first film is all about empathy for modern people for what happened to them. Here they separate the plight of Latinx/Hispanic folk by tying this all to hundreds of years ago, without a modern prospective. Having the people walk around like savages as opposed to Wakanda, where they keep their traditions, but also have modern tech and clothes.

Absolutely agree.

 

[kguillou]

Meanwhile Black Adam is projected 10M fourth weekend which, for whatever its worth, is actually a lot better than I expected. I thought for sure it would more or less evaporate in the low single digits in the wake of WF.

 

[psylockolussus]

Meanwhile Black Adam is projected 10M fourth weekend which, for whatever its worth, is actually a lot better than I expected. I thought for sure it would more or less evaporate in the low single digits in the wake of WF.

8 not 10.

 

[Lily Adler]

Meanwhile Black Adam is projected 10M fourth weekend which, for whatever its worth, is actually a lot better than I expected. I thought for sure it would more or less evaporate in the low single digits in the wake of WF.

 

[Drizzle]

Black Adam box office conversation?

 

[kguillou]

I wanna see Hodge’s Hawkman again dang it!

 

[Batgirl0202]

Good numbers. I was hoping it might get as high as $200m until recently but these are solid.

With a $250 million production budget and a (presumable) $150 million marketing campaign, the break even point should be around $800 million.

Wakanda should be able to reach that threshold relatively easily but I don't think this will be a $1 billion film. I'd love to be proven wrong and it might very well enjoy incredible holds, but from all reports it's a bit too melancholy and contemplative to be a real crowd-pleaser.

A friend of mine put it quite aptly. He said it's very much a "winter" film that was released on the wrong side of the winter season, and I think I understand what he means.

Movies like Logan and Wakanda that are this emotionally heavy probably play better in months like February/March than in November/December. During the holidays, audiences are in the mood for lighter, more rousing fare. As someone here pointed out, Wakanda might be a tad too emotionally draining for multiple viewings at this time of year...

Anyway we shall see

 

[Ninjablade]

I wanna see Hodge’s Hawkman again dang it!

Here you go

 

[Iceman]

Less than Dr. Strange 2 seems underwhelming.

Don’t forget all the ridiculous multiverse and cameo hype for MoM after NWH. It was getting to seriously dumb levels.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think Wakanda Forever is gonna have better legs than MoM

 

[Snow Queen]

Wakanda Forever is a very messy script. There are some well done moments and good lines, but it never really comes together into something solid. And a messy script spread over two and a half hours with a tone like this is exhausting.

 

[Sithborg]

Wakanda Forever is a very messy script. There are some well done moments and good lines, but it never really comes together into something solid. And a messy script spread over two and a half hours with a tone like this is exhausting.

Yeah, it was fairly clear what was originally in there and what had to be changed and tossed in.

 

[Sithborg]

Movies like Logan and Wakanda that are this emotionally heavy probably play better in months like February/March than in November/December. During the holidays, audiences are in the mood for lighter, more rousing fare. As someone here pointed out, Wakanda might be a tad too emotionally draining for multiple viewings at this time of year...

Anyway we shall see

That's the thing that gets me. There were multiple points in the third act, where things could have been played as emotionally triumphant moments. But because some aspects were rushed, some elements wanted to be played more sinister than it needed, and hell, the resolution is resolved a bit bad for the heroes. Now, I imagine what Coogler was going for was a bit more of a realistic approach to how he and the cast were feeling. And honestly it might have worked if they had not kept the original emotional impact of the 2nd act.

Comparison to Logan is weird, because as dour as that movie was, it ended a lot more hopeful than this movie. And yes, I do not consider the post credits stuff to be part of the movie. If its important, put it in the damn movie itself.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Meanwhile Black Adam is projected 10M fourth weekend which, for whatever its worth, is actually a lot better than I expected. I thought for sure it would more or less evaporate in the low single digits in the wake of WF.

Ain't nothing out.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I think Wakanda Forever is gonna have better legs than MoM

Domestically? Most definitely. They're ain't nothing out, Thanlksgiving is coming up, and it went over well with women, which is always good for dem legs. What I'm now curious about is what it looks like overseas.

 

[Ninjablade]

I think part of the issue of trying to be a little more emotionally triumphant final act is the fact that they basically speed ran Shuri through T'Challa's Civil War arc but against discount Killmonger. While that arc is a positive one, it's not one that ends in something more than resignation.

Not necessarily an issue, but the film just never lets up on the somberness from the start, and that's a lot to ask for over the course of 2:45. There's really not an apt comparison in terms of other big blockbuster action films, I don't think.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I think part of the issue of trying to be a little more emotionally triumphant final act is the fact that they basically speed ran Shuri through T'Challa's Civil War arc but against discount Killmonger. While that arc is a positive one, it's not one that ends in something more than resignation.

Not necessarily an issue, but the film just never lets up on the somberness from the start, and that's a lot to ask for over the course of 2:45. There's really not an apt comparison in terms of other big blockbuster action films, I don't think.

It really, really, really doesn't help that Shuri isn't the lead character T'Challa is. TConceptually the journey should work really well, but the mixture of the actress and character doesn't hold up to Black Panther lives! here is a reason Q isn't the lead, Bond is.

Seeing Lupita standing right there being everything you could want out of a lead, does not help.

On another note, those suits at the end of the film. So ugly. It was like Kit Fisto crossed over.