Superhero Cinematic Civil War - Part 58

[Sithborg]

Eek, I don't know how I feel about that. A little red flagy to me in terms of his business model that has been talked about since the start. Not that I care about the Wonder Twins or anything, but canning the project instead of lowering the budget? I don't know.

I do think some of his reasoning seems sound. Streaming movies are not the big draw of streaming services. You put that big of a budget into series. And I do think the mix of releases does boost the streaming numbers.

 

[mclay18]

THIS. It is charming, right?! Make no mistake, its a mess, but you can tell the cast and filmmakers did they best they absolutely could with the pennies they had. And the score is legit GOOD.

I saw the documentary about the making of the movie and decided to give it a chance. It is absolutely shameful that the studio did not give the post-production crew enough money to finish the movie as best they could. I mean, the composers paid thousands of their own money just to record the score with a live orchestra.

I kinda wish Corman and Eichinger actually released the damn thing in theaters. We'd have a nice DVD/Blu-ray release instead of all these bootlegs.

 

[Boy Scout]

So does this mean they’re going to CGI revive Stan The Man back from the grave via CGI?

The only way this won’t be weird and gross is if they exclusively use pictures. Show a photo of Stan Lee doing something cool or funny in every Marvel movie but do not try to bring him back to life with CGI.

 

[Ninjablade]

I do think some of his reasoning seems sound. Streaming movies are not the big draw of streaming services. You put that big of a budget into series. And I do think the mix of releases does boost the streaming numbers.

Yeah, I don't really have much of an issue as to what he's saying on paper. I agree with most of it. I'm just concerned as to what that'll look like in practice.

My biggest worry is whether he'll be making fair assessments on the budgets for particular projects. More smaller budget films should be made, but I don't want budgets to be slashed on things that need the money.

 

[Fosterson]

The whole thing just makes me uncomfortable. People shouldn't be treated like IPs. Stan Lee isn't Mickey Mouse.

I also quite frankly don't trust anyone involved in the Stan Lee camp/his people. Not with the stories about how awful he was being treated towards the end of his life. Bunch of blood sucking money grabbers. I can't imagine what the financial terms of that deal are. Whole thing is nasty.

Yet another reminder of Feige's darker side.

 

[mclay18]

Sounds like Batgirl will get a theatrical release after all. That’s good. I think Discovery is already making smart moves with WB so far.

I wonder what budget WB is making Blue Beetle for, since that switched from HBO Max to theatrical before Zazlav came on.

 

[Pennywise]

This meme made me laugh! Spoilers for DS: MOM

Spoiler

 

[Nardz937]

There was never a moment when after watching NWH and MoM where I was like "Aw, Stan's cameo was really missing from the experience". Seeing Stan pop up was always sweet, but not having it anymore was something I actually got immediately used too.

 

[MbJ]

So on one hand Batgirl is almost certainly moving to a theatrical release now. That it already hadn't was somewhat weird when Blue Beetle already did, especially since Batgirl is a much better known character and her film will also feature Batman.

On the other, however, it has me now wondering what will become of the proposed HBO Max TV shows. Green Lantern especially is really not a property you can do cheaply.

 

[Zarex]

So on one hand Batgirl is almost certainly moving to a theatrical release now. That it already hadn't was somewhat weird when Blue Beetle already did, especially since Batgirl is a much better known character and her film will also feature Batman.

On the other, however, it has me now wondering what will become of the proposed HBO Max TV shows. Green Lantern especially is really not a property you can do cheaply.

TV shows based on established IPs, even if they are pricey reboots of box office flops, are still a good investment for streaming services. If you can keep an audience engaged for 8 weeks or so that could be two or three months of subscription fees you might not otherwise have earned.

Though Wonder Twins didn't make sense as a mid budget movie, I could see it being resurrected at some point as a TV show.

 

[Erzengel]

I'm just looking at the rest of WB's slate for 2022. What are their remaining tentpoles? Shazam and Black Adam?

 

[Detective Conan]

 

[kguillou]

I'm just looking at the rest of WB's slate for 2022. What are their remaining tentpoles? Shazam and Black Adam?

yup. This was supposed to be a monster year for them and …welp…

 

[Sithborg]

The whole thing just makes me uncomfortable. People shouldn't be treated like IPs. Stan Lee isn't Mickey Mouse.

I also quite frankly don't trust anyone involved in the Stan Lee camp/his people. Not with the stories about how awful he was being treated towards the end of his life. Bunch of blood sucking money grabbers. I can't imagine what the financial terms of that deal are. Whole thing is nasty.

Ironically, I feel this kind of deal is something Lee would have loved. Keep being the face of other people's work? Sign him up. I think it is more important to think of Lee more as Walt Disney, than Mickey Mouse. And Disney, even if they aren't ghouls with his image, still protect his image to an insane degree.

And if you want to get really, really angry, just remember that his estate is going to get paid more than creators whose work is being used very, very much to make their blockbusters.

So on one hand Batgirl is almost certainly moving to a theatrical release now. That it already hadn't was somewhat weird when Blue Beetle already did, especially since Batgirl is a much better known character and her film will also feature Batman.

On the other, however, it has me now wondering what will become of the proposed HBO Max TV shows. Green Lantern especially is really not a property you can do cheaply.

TV shows are still good investments. Even ignoring HBO's success, I think they will look at how well Disney+ is doing.

 

[Detective Conan]

I'm just looking at the rest of WB's slate for 2022. What are their remaining tentpoles? Shazam and Black Adam?

I hate to be that guy but I think Shazam 2 is gonna flop. Especially after its releasing so soon after Avatar 2. I think they should move.

 

[mclay18]

I hate to be that guy but I think Shazam 2 is gonna flop. Especially after its releasing so soon after Avatar 2. I think they should move.

Shazam 2 has no commonality with Avatar 2 apart from them being sequels. Christmas releases tend to spread out the wealth among several movies, not just the big guns like Avatar 2.

I also see that Batgirl has a reported $70M budget, much higher than Zaslav's mandate that HBO Max originals be $35M or less. WB will have to reconfigure the cast and crew deals for a theatrical-first release as well.

And I'm curious where WB will place Batgirl on the release calendar. Will it be a prime summer release, pre-Thanksgiving, fall (a la Black Adam), Christmas or early winter (February)? The industry has shown studios can mint money outside traditional release corridors for big movies.

 

[mclay18]

And the score is legit GOOD.

Ever since I found a suite of the composers' music, I have been playing it over and over again. Terrific stuff-- sounds much bigger than most MCU scores at a fraction of the size.

 

[kguillou]

Man. If Corman had just given that movie 5 measly million dollars instead of 1M. i legit think we would've had a cult classic on our hands. Just enough money to touch up the effects, the costumes, sets, reshoots.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Man. If Corman had just given that movie 5 measly million dollars instead of 1M. i legit think we would've had a cult classic on our hands. Just enough money to touch up the effects, the costumes, sets, reshoots.

Why would you spend that much on a movie that was literally only made to keep the rights, and never be released? 1 million was probably even allowed only due to budget clauses in the contract.

Hey, no hate on the folks that made the '94 film, but it's really bad. The fact that some people prefer it to the Tim Story movies is insane to me. Sure, there's a lot of sincerity in front of the camera and it gets some elements more right than the Story films... but it's barely above the quality of a fan film. A bad fan film. When I see those actors in other projects, I wonder how they were so much worse in FF--not that any of them are any good when I see them elsewhere anyway

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Not to mention Corman was the King of the B-Movies. He would never spent that much on any film, let alone F4.

 

[mclay18]

Hey, no hate on the folks that made the '94 film, but it's really bad. The fact that some people prefer it to the Tim Story movies is insane to me. Sure, there's a lot of sincerity in front of the camera and it gets some elements more right than the Story films... but it's barely above the quality of a fan film. A bad fan film.

It is a Roger Corman film. He was like Blumhouse back in his heyday. Low budget B movies are his forte.

And if the eventual MCU director for F4 takes anything from the ‘94 film, the compact storytelling and staying true to the comics should be #1. If the story doesn’t demand it be longer than 2 hours, keep it short and sweet. And don’t use excess VFX if they can help it.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

Budget aside, I love the heart that the Corman Fantastic Four movie had. For better or worse, it got the team and Doom right. That movie and the 1994 cartoon are still the best iterations of the FF to me.



LOVE that cheesy ass theme song.

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Always had a soft spot for the 60's Hanna Barbera cartoon.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I really wish in the coming years that the FF and the X-Men are both resurgent to the GA with their movies. Those characters truly deserve it.

It was them and Spidey that made me the Marvel fanboy that I am…before it became cool.

 

[mclay18]

Budget aside, I love the heart that the Corman Fantastic Four movie had. For better or worse, it got the team and Doom right. That movie and the 1994 cartoon are still the best iterations of the FF to me.



LOVE that cheesy ass theme song.

I got the F4 cartoon boxed set years ago and I just couldn't get through the series. It was just flat and boring. It had none of the pizazz of X-Men and Spider-man or the budget of B:tAS or S:tAS.

The Corman 1994 film is a different story. It's a bad, shoe string budgeted movie but it's charming throughout. The musical score does a LOT of the heavy lifting.