The General Comic Discussion Thread - Part 1

[flickchick85]

Have you read Sheriff of Babylon? I’ve always intended to give that a read but never have.

Yep, that one's great too - especially as you can kinda tell he's speaking from experience there. Definitely recommend it if you like his other stuff. Also, I'm not as into Marvel stuff, but his Vision was fantastic. He's just REALLY damned good, imo. Especially when doing these limited/maxi-series.

 

[Babillygunn]

I have heard great things about his Vision series. It sounds very similar to Mister Miracle.

 

[flickchick85]

Yeah I preferred Mister Miracle overall, but there are definitely some similarities. If you liked one, you'll probably like the other.

 

[CrimsonMist]

Hrmm.

On the one hand, I felt pretty dirty after buying Doomsday Clock #1 when that came out, mainly because I do not like Geof Johnsat all. That feeling, and the fact that I found the book to be nothing more than a disingenuous continuity plant, made me drop it.

And to this day, Minute Men and Silk Spectre remain the only two works by Darwyn Cook that I do not own and have not read.

I thought the TV show extrapolated some interesting ideas from the comic but was ultimately pointless as a narrative whole.

On the other hand, I've always thought King was the best writer DC had to actually tackle the subject of Watchmen in a way that not only means something, but with a more literate approach than anything Johns was ever capable of. Putting Fornes on art is just cake.

This sounds more up my alley as far as how to explore the world by extrapolating ideas and commenting on the original and even running parallel to it without necessarily making a direct sequel. I'm also all for really bringing how awful Rorschach was to the forefront. The title is pretty clever metaphorically and metafictionally and the cover, which is just great, adds an interesting contrast to it with the use of the finger print. The absolute vs the subjective.

But if I couldn't bend for Darwyn Cooke, can I do that for King? I'll have to wait and see as solicits for the remaining issues of the year are released. This is a tough decision.

 

[Calvin Ellis]

Hrmm.

On the one hand, I felt pretty dirty after buying Doomsday Clock #1 when that came out, mainly because I do not like Geof Johnsat all. That feeling, and the fact that I found the book to be nothing more than a disingenuous continuity plant, made me drop it.

And to this day, Minute Men and Silk Spectre remain the only two works by Darwyn Cook that I do not own and have not read.

I thought the TV show extrapolated some interesting ideas from the comic but was ultimately pointless as a narrative whole.

On the other hand, I've always thought King was the best writer DC had to actually tackle the subject of Watchmen in a way that not only means something, but with a more literate approach than anything Johns was ever capable of. Putting Fornes on art is just cake.

This sounds more up my alley as far as how to explore the world by extrapolating ideas and commenting on the original and even running parallel to it without necessarily making a direct sequel. I'm also all for really bringing how awful Rorschach was to the forefront. The title is pretty clever metaphorically and metafictionally and the cover, which is just great, adds an interesting contrast to it with the use of the finger print. The absolute vs the subjective.

But if I couldn't bend for Darwyn Cooke, can I do that for King? I'll have to wait and see as solicits for the remaining issues of the year are released. This is a tough decision.

Doomsday Clock will always upset me because even though I loved the last 2 issues (mainly because it finally included Superman) the book just felt rushed and poorly planned because Johns spent so much time with the Watchmen's version of Joker and Harley that it felt like he forgot to write about the DCU characters and was just rushing to give them a place in the story.

 

[Babillygunn]

Doomsday Clock will always upset me because even though I loved the last 2 issues (mainly because it finally included Superman) the book just felt rushed and poorly planned because Johns spent so much time with the Watchmen's version of Joker and Harley that it felt like he forgot to write about the DCU characters and was just rushing to give them a place in the story.

I usually like Geoff Johns. Let’s face it, he has written much of the greats of the past 20 years. Sinestro Corps War, Throne of Atlantis, Infinite Crisis, Up Up and Away, Forever Evil...they are all landmark stories. But I found Doomsday Clock to be laborious and uninteresting. It really underscored that I don’t feel like the Watchmen universe and the general DC Universe really mix very well.

 

[super85]

I am assuming you never read his Mister Miracle, Superman Up in the Sky, or Strange Adventures (so far). If not, I would encourage you to try those out before getting too set in your judgment. While I liked his Batman run quite a bit, I do understand the problems people had with it and can see them as legitimate points. But his other work is universally beloved (with the only possible exception being the controversial Heroes in Crisis, which I struggled with, not because of his writing, but because of the tragic story he told in it.)

I thought that "Heroes in Crisis" was terrible. It had nice art, but as a story it was terrible.

I checked out Strange Adventures( a friend reads it so we swap comixology accounts sometimes) and I read the latest issue a few days ago, #3 I think. Thought it was stupid, the wife husband relationship comes across like mother and son instead,. Just odd. and just general stupidity in it. Wont be finishing that. The dialogue was pretty terrible too. I can't imagine reading like 12 issues
of the hero being such a weak ninny.

I think he wrote some of that "Grayson Agent of Spyral" stuff, and it wasn't too terrible. Even if "Spyral" is a dumb name.

Superman Up in the Sky was that stuff they published in Walmart in the US with Andy Kubert art?
I looked at it, it wasn't too bad. He has good artists, and since it was meant for a wider audience it felt a little better than his usual superhero stuff.

Havent checked out his Mister Miracle series.

But like said before, "each to their own"

 

[Babillygunn]

I thought that "Heroes in Crisis" was terrible. It had nice art, but as a story it was terrible.

I checked out Strange Adventures( a friend reads it so we swap comixology accounts sometimes) and I read the latest issue a few days ago, #3 I think. Thought it was stupid, the wife husband relationship comes across like mother and son instead,. Just odd. and just general stupidity in it. Wont be finishing that. The dialogue was pretty terrible too. I can't imagine reading like 12 issues
of the hero being such a weak ninny.

I think he wrote some of that "Grayson Agent of Spyral" stuff, and it wasn't too terrible. Even if "Spyral" is a dumb name.

Superman Up in the Sky was that stuff they published in Walmart in the US with Andy Kubert art?
I looked at it, it wasn't too bad. He has good artists, and since it was meant for a wider audience it felt a little better than his usual superhero stuff.

Havent checked out his Mister Miracle series.

But like said before, "each to their own"

To each his own??? This is the internet. We can’t disagree cordially or civilly. We have to administer ad hominem attacks and use vitriolic discourse. Lol.

But in all seriousness, I totally see where King’s writing wouldn’t be everyone’s cup of tea. I would assume that most people who are big Scott Snyder fans wouldn’t like Tom King. (Not saying that you are a Snyder fan, I just use him as an example.) King writes very intimate stories and uses his own pacing. He has a very unorthodox narrative style as well. I can see where that isn’t for everyone. Personally, I like it quite a bit, but to be honest, it took me a while to get used to it. But now I find it extremely effective.

 

[NDX]

I thought Heroes in Crisis was pretty bad, but I really liked the idea of Sanctuary and found the interviews very interesting. I would actually find a book based on those a better read.

 

[super85]

Babillygunn

To be fair, not too inpressed by Scott Snyder either. I thought "Metal" was fun, but I felt it started to have tendencies like Snyder showing like "look! its crazy! anything can happen! its comics!", and while i enjoyed that (and the Capullo art) it, now he is doing "Death Metal" and it does not come across sincere. Its almost pretantious. "Look this is fun crazy comics!" but it just feels off. A million dumb variant versions of characters, some sort of Robin goblins and people who have their brains inserted to other bodies to become some sort of hybrid characters.

His own run on "Batman" was a bit of a similar experience as Tom Kings run. Starts out pretty good but ends almost unreadable. For me at least.

Of the modern current Batman writers, I think Tomasi and James Tynion are a lot better than either Snyder or King.

 

[flickchick85]

I kinda feel like Tomasi is the (somewhat) unsung hero of modern mainstream superhero comics. His runs seem to be regularly overshadowed by some bigger names who are either writing companion titles or did the runs on the same title before/after his, yet I pretty much always prefer his runs over those bigger names (looking at you, Johns, Snyder and Bendis). I think his work is more consistently strong than any of those guys.

 

[super85]

I think similary about that. Tomasi is constantly better than those guys. He feels like somebody who is a true pro, and thinks how he can write good Batman , or Superman or whatever stories first, not the way many other modern writers come across. A lot of stuff now is "How can i fit in Batman or Superman in these stories I want to tell".

Geoff Johns work hasn't been great for almost 5 years I would say . I picked up a big chunk of what Bendis wrote recently in Action Comics. But cancelled it becouse I had stopped caring and not even managed to finish the issues anymore.

 

[Babillygunn]

Totally agree on Tomasi. He writes with such heart, without it being cheesy (and when it does cross over into cheese, it’s still great.) With the exception of a few stories, I’m not a fan of Snyder. He is the Jerry Bruckheimer of comics. Everything has to be a huge blockbuster. There are very few small, intimate stories. He really is the polar opposite of King and Tomasi. The best thing about Snyder is Greg Capullo, who is a great artist and a genuine good guy.

 

[Mani-Man]

Tomasi really deserves more credit, the man has a very consistent high level but somehow always gets overlooked a bit.
I always hoped to see a Tomasi batman run drawn by Greg Capullo...that would have been a dream collaboration of mine.

I think i said it before about snyder, but the ideas he has are super cool on paper...but he tends to overcomplicate things and tries to pile up more and more and more, wants to make everything feel like some spectacular grand page...which i get, but his writing only very few times hits the right notes for that.

Johns is a hit and a miss.
A very polarizing person in writing and general.
Some of his stuff is fantasic, some not.

 

[Babillygunn]

I always hoped to see a Tomasi batman run drawn by Greg Capullo...that would have been a dream collaboration of mine.

 

[MMMMM...Pancakes]

I kinda feel like Tomasi is the (somewhat) unsung hero of modern mainstream superhero comics. His runs seem to be regularly overshadowed by some bigger names who are either writing companion titles or did the runs on the same title before/after his, yet I pretty much always prefer his runs over those bigger names (looking at you, Johns, Snyder and Bendis). I think his work is more consistently strong than any of those guys.

Absolutely agree!

 

[super85]

Tomasi is also a "old skool" editor. Back when editors actually did something. I think that adds to that "pro level" his writing has. Give the guy a big name artist and his stuff will be the best selling stuff in the charts. Not that comicbook sales charts are that impressive anymore.

 

[Gee]

Oops, Tom.




EVS, though...

 

[flickchick85]

So...Jae Lee did do art for ComicsGate, he just didn't know it?

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

Oops, Tom.

Oops Tom, indeed!

 

[Mani-Man]

So...Jae Lee did do art for ComicsGate, he just didn't know it?

Seems that way...its easy to miss ComicsGate when you arent on twitter.
Could be that he was hired without knowing for which group.

Im somewhat shocked how many people believe that comicsgate is not a hate group and how many defend it.
Even worse is when you see those people guys like EVS held back, support him.
He was a ****ing snake in editors etc ears, told them not to hire talented people because they were trouble according to him...when their only crimes were, being women, poc etc.

 

[Babillygunn]

That tweet by Comicsgate through God of Thunder!
Talk about obnoxious.

 

[super85]

King handled this poorly. Not everyone hang out in twitter, people have actual lives too.

Jae Lee to Tom King - "We're Not All Good"

 

[CrimsonMist]

What King did was pretty damn stupid. It was a mistake, but it was a completely bone-headed, absent minded, stupid mistake.

While I can understand the need to be more aware of what's going on within the community in which you work, making a broad accusation like that is...not the way to go. Then again, there was a point in time where I was genuinely surprised that some people I met didn't have social media.

I do find it kind of amusing that despite everything, Jae Lee wants nothing at all to do with Comicsgate.

Hopefully, King and Lee can move forward from this and that King learns his lesson to research first.

 

[gohei_]

I wasn't really planning on it, but I just bought Uncanny X-men Omni vol 1. I have actually been wanting to go back and read this title from the "start" so it's gonna be interesting for sure.