Superhero Cinematic Civil War - Part 58

[Fosterson]

There is plenty of bad MCU CGI to go araround. The floating heads look abysmal and happens in plenty of em, and there is a lot of bad green screen back drops. I always use Civil War as a great an example. When Cap and Bucky slide through the falling debris before being met by Natasha...ooooof. Awful

But I still love the MCU lol

To be honest, the whole airport sequence in CW is a sight for sore eyes. Grey, grey and greyer.

I'm hoping that the use of the Volume from now on will hopefully allow MCU movies to look a little less.. fake.

 

[metaphysician]

Exactly. I mean people love the DC movies for giving something different in each film (and I do too to a point), but if you do too much while wanting to be a brand you’re gonna give your audience severe whiplash.

I think the thing too many people forget is that "different" does not equal "good". Its not even really about expectation whiplash, so much as the simple fact that when you ask people to invest a good chunk of time and money in a movie, they would really like some kind of guarantee that they will actually get their money's worth in entertainment. Telling the average audience member "We aren't going to follow any kind of best practices or engage in quality control, we are going to do something weird that might not work at all, but if it does it will work in a different way than you've seen before!", and they will start looking at you side-eye and asking what your policy on refunds is.

 

[metaphysician]

Yup, very true. Marvel has successfully built a brand like mass audiences instantly recognize and will watch with anything with that brand on. I can't think of any other studio that has audiences clapping and cheering as soon as their logo pops up in front of a film. People go nuts when they see that "Marvel Studios" intro and music come on.

Exactly. People see the "Marvel Studios" logo, and they know ( at least with a much greater degree of certainty than for the average movie ) that they will have a good time. Maybe they will see something extraordinary, but even a "bad" Marvel Studios movie will be fun, funny, and have a cast of characters who are entertaining just to hang out with.

 

[metaphysician]

True, although many would argue that this is what has held the MCU back from ever achieving true greatness with any of their films.

I mean, you can certainly choose to believe that movies like Avengers, Winter Soldier, and Black Panther aren't "true greatness". You can also choose to believe that a person who doesn't wear a kilt and scream about the Bloody English isn't a "true Scotsmen".

 

[Ninjablade]

Thanks everyone for the input and recommendations

So we went ahead and watched TMNT (1990) last night. Shinobi was right, this is how you successfully translate an iconic cartoon or comic to the screen.

Not having any emotional connection to the source material, I was able to go in with fresh eyes and evaluate the film objectively. While the FX is understandable crude by today's standards, I thought both the cinematography and production design were very effective and appropriate for the film. I especially liked the depiction of New York City at the dawn of the '90s. Squint just a little bit and it could almost pass for Burton's architectural style of Gotham in Batman '89.

I was also really impressed by the way both the voice cast and puppeteers were able to imbue each Turtle with a distinct personality. I can't speak to the faithfulness of the characterizations but I think they did a great job in differentiating each Turtle, and their respective personalities nicely complimented each other. And Splinter had such a wise, sad quality to him that it was actually touching. His loyalty to his 'sons' really got to me a couple times.

The action scenes were quite impressive too, considering these were in-suit actors trying to convincingly create martial arts sequences. The brawls were fun and the one-liners were silly but entertaining. I can imagine audiences in 1990 having a total blast with this movie.

And on top of all that, it had humor and heart. It doesn't have that cynical quality that so much '90s entertainment for kids tried to peddle. It's got something to say about friendship, family, loyalty, as well as self-acceptance and humility. Overall a good time and a pleasant surprise

Happy to hear you enjoyed it!

 

[Drizzle]

Longer than that. Its the television model of storytelling applied to big budget movies.

Yep, the MCU has many of the benefits and downsides of long running shows.

Pretty much. It's gotten to the point where Marvel is more or less done holding peoples' hands explaining everything and it's been like that for a while. It's not like that all the time, since the debut solo movies like Shang-Chi or even Black Panther and Captain Marvel back in Phase 3 can be enjoyed on their own without having seen any prior MCU movies (even though it helps) but then you get to something like Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness where they might as well say, "Oh, you're confused because you haven't seen WandaVision? Well you've had a year and a half to watch it so that's on you, pal."

 

[DocLathropBrown]

Thanks everyone for the input and recommendations

So we went ahead and watched TMNT (1990) last night. Shinobi was right, this is how you successfully translate an iconic cartoon or comic to the screen.

Not having any emotional connection to the source material, I was able to go in with fresh eyes and evaluate the film objectively. While the FX is understandable crude by today's standards, I thought both the cinematography and production design were very effective and appropriate for the film. I especially liked the depiction of New York City at the dawn of the '90s. Squint just a little bit and it could almost pass for Burton's architectural style of Gotham in Batman '89.

I was also really impressed by the way both the voice cast and puppeteers were able to imbue each Turtle with a distinct personality. I can't speak to the faithfulness of the characterizations but I think they did a great job in differentiating each Turtle, and their respective personalities nicely complimented each other. And Splinter had such a wise, sad quality to him that it was actually touching. His loyalty to his 'sons' really got to me a couple times.

The action scenes were quite impressive too, considering these were in-suit actors trying to convincingly create martial arts sequences. The brawls were fun and the one-liners were silly but entertaining. I can imagine audiences in 1990 having a total blast with this movie.

And on top of all that, it had humor and heart. It doesn't have that cynical quality that so much '90s entertainment for kids tried to peddle. It's got something to say about friendship, family, loyalty, as well as self-acceptance and humility. Overall a good time and a pleasant surprise

TMNT '90 is a flat-out masterpiece. It adapts a lot of scenes from the original comics run almost panel-for-panel, takes only what it needs from the animated show, and remembers to treat its main characters as characters as opposed to special effects (Take note, Michael Bay). It's surprisingly emotional and actually has narrative meat (wayward youths need love and guidance, otherwise they can fall pray to the wrong crowd).

It was made by Golden Harvest, a company that makes real Hong Kong martial arts films--that's why the action is so good.

Now, stop there! You've already peaked in the TMNT series

 

[Iceman]

Thanks everyone for the input and recommendations

So we went ahead and watched TMNT (1990) last night. Shinobi was right, this is how you successfully translate an iconic cartoon or comic to the screen.

Not having any emotional connection to the source material, I was able to go in with fresh eyes and evaluate the film objectively. While the FX is understandable crude by today's standards, I thought both the cinematography and production design were very effective and appropriate for the film. I especially liked the depiction of New York City at the dawn of the '90s. Squint just a little bit and it could almost pass for Burton's architectural style of Gotham in Batman '89.

I was also really impressed by the way both the voice cast and puppeteers were able to imbue each Turtle with a distinct personality. I can't speak to the faithfulness of the characterizations but I think they did a great job in differentiating each Turtle, and their respective personalities nicely complimented each other. And Splinter had such a wise, sad quality to him that it was actually touching. His loyalty to his 'sons' really got to me a couple times.

The action scenes were quite impressive too, considering these were in-suit actors trying to convincingly create martial arts sequences. The brawls were fun and the one-liners were silly but entertaining. I can imagine audiences in 1990 having a total blast with this movie.

And on top of all that, it had humor and heart. It doesn't have that cynical quality that so much '90s entertainment for kids tried to peddle. It's got something to say about friendship, family, loyalty, as well as self-acceptance and humility. Overall a good time and a pleasant surprise

Awesome! Glad to hear you’ve seen it now and enjoyed it, and cool to hear your write up of it seeing it for the first time in 2022. Makes me want to rewatch it now!

 

[kguillou]

TMNT 1990 is one my favorite movies, period, of all time. Thats one of those movies of my childhood that i hold so near and dear and it STILL holds up incredibly well 30 years later.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

Thanks everyone for the input and recommendations

So we went ahead and watched TMNT (1990) last night. Shinobi was right, this is how you successfully translate an iconic cartoon or comic to the screen.

Not having any emotional connection to the source material, I was able to go in with fresh eyes and evaluate the film objectively. While the FX is understandable crude by today's standards, I thought both the cinematography and production design were very effective and appropriate for the film. I especially liked the depiction of New York City at the dawn of the '90s. Squint just a little bit and it could almost pass for Burton's architectural style of Gotham in Batman '89.

I was also really impressed by the way both the voice cast and puppeteers were able to imbue each Turtle with a distinct personality. I can't speak to the faithfulness of the characterizations but I think they did a great job in differentiating each Turtle, and their respective personalities nicely complimented each other. And Splinter had such a wise, sad quality to him that it was actually touching. His loyalty to his 'sons' really got to me a couple times.

The action scenes were quite impressive too, considering these were in-suit actors trying to convincingly create martial arts sequences. The brawls were fun and the one-liners were silly but entertaining. I can imagine audiences in 1990 having a total blast with this movie.

And on top of all that, it had humor and heart. It doesn't have that cynical quality that so much '90s entertainment for kids tried to peddle. It's got something to say about friendship, family, loyalty, as well as self-acceptance and humility. Overall a good time and a pleasant surprise

Told you Babs!


Glad you enjoyed it. It really is a fun film and it endures for all the reasons you stated. This and Batman Returns are the first two CBM I remember watching, they’ll always have a special place in my heart.

TMNT '90 is a flat-out masterpiece. It adapts a lot of scenes from the original comics run almost panel-for-panel, takes only what it needs from the animated show, and remembers to treat its main characters as characters as opposed to special effects (Take note, Michael Bay). It's surprisingly emotional and actually has narrative meat (wayward youths need love and guidance, otherwise they can fall pray to the wrong crowd).

It was made by Golden Harvest, a company that makes real Hong Kong martial arts films--that's why the action is so good.

Now, stop there! You've already peaked in the TMNT series

Maybe I’m just getting soft in my old age, but I get emotional every time I see the scene where the Turtles meditate and have that vision of Splinter. Also love the little moment at the very end before the credits and you can see Raph hugging Splinter.

A lot of gems here!

 

[Pennywise]

One of my favourite scenes in TMNT 1990 that really spoke to me as a teenager:

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Superman '78, Batman '89 and TMNT '90 was my holy trinity of comic book films growing up. They're still my top 3 respectively.

 

[Batgirl0202]

Maybe I’m just getting soft in my old age, but I get emotional every time I see the scene where the Turtles meditate and have that vision of Splinter. Also love the little moment at the very end before the credits and you can see Raph hugging Splinter.

That's the part that surprised me the most. I expected it to be fun, but what I didn't expect was to be so moved.

There are real stakes in this movie. One of the main themes it explored was how actions have consequences, which is refreshing in material aimed at kids. There's a real strain of pathos that runs through the film, as well as a strong emotional undercurrent. I don't know how this film has eluded me for so long...

On a side note I also rewatched Venom 2018 for like the third time last night too. And yes it's still as ridiculous as I remember, but I'll be damned if it's not a great goofy time

 

[Pennywise]

I would love to see the opening pages with the Purple Dragons from the first issue recreated on screen one day, and would be a great way to tell audiences this ain’t the film you thought you were seeing.



So, so badass!

 

[kguillou]

Finished Jessica Jones season 2 and a few eps into season 3. Gotta say, y’all im really enjoying this and cant believe I just skipped these entirely when they came out. I think i get why ppl gave up on it after season 2, the stuff with Trish and Jessica gets a bit over the top and sloppy sometimes but overall i like how the show is pitting these “sisters” against each other.

Its a bit of a slow burn but Krysten Ritter just eats this role up and is so enjoyable to watch. And the rest of her supporting cast I feel are very likeable damaged characters. I hope Feige brings her back, she owns this role like Cox did Daredevil.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

That's the part that surprised me the most. I expected it to be fun, but what I didn't expect was to be so moved.

There are real stakes in this movie. One of the main themes it explored was how actions have consequences, which is refreshing in material aimed at kids. There's a real strain of pathos that runs through the film, as well as a strong emotional undercurrent. I don't know how this film has eluded me for so long...

On a side note I also rewatched Venom 2018 for like the third time last night too. And yes it's still as ridiculous as I remember, but I'll be damned if it's not a great goofy time

Not least of all, John Du Prez's phenomenal score. Very stirring when it needs to be, fun when it needs to be. One of my favorite film scores of all time.

A great soundtrack, too. "9.95" is a really catchy, upbeat little ditty. It's use in the film's final moments always lights up the positive spots in my brain. Hell, the ending of the movie, in general, always leaves me feeling uplifted!

 

[Drizzle]

I watched WandaVision again over the weekend and I've gotta say, it's even more heartbreaking than before after watching Multiverse of Madness.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

I watched WandaVision again over the weekend and I've gotta say, it's even more heartbreaking than before after watching Multiverse of Madness.

How people can watch that and MoM and have not one iota of sympathy/empathy for Wanda, I will never understand.

That poor mutant enhanced has been through a lot.

 

[Drizzle]

How people can watch that and MoM and have not one iota of sympathy/empathy for Wanda, I will never understand.

That poor mutant enhanced has been through a lot.

If only Hawkeye, who was basically like an older brother or even a father figure to Wanda through Age of Ultron, Civil War and beyond, had offered her to come stay with him and his family on the farm post-Endgame to clear her head so that she wasn't alone in the world. Probably could have done her some good, but then we wouldn't have gotten WandaVision or Multiverse of Madness that way.

 

[mclay18]

The mixed WOM on DS2 took effect. A 67% drop second weekend is painful.

We are looking at a slightly better BvS multiple for DS2 if it doesn’t stabilize next weekend. Top Gun Maverick will blow out everything else on Memorial Day weekend.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Speaking of Strange...

So now MCU is 616 Earth?
This confuses me since 616 is already exist (its the comics universe)...and MCU I read somewhere is Earth 199999.

Unless they change and retcon it...haha.

Technically, that's what the residents of Earth-838 called it. Maybe it will stick or maybe it was just a nod to the fans. For lack of a better name, when it comes to discussing the different Earths as it relates to the MCU multiverse, I'm going to use it until the MCU contradicts it. We need something to call it and since they use it in an actual film, that's as good as any.

 

[fan4stic]

If only Hawkeye, who was basically like an older brother or even a father figure to Wanda through Age of Ultron, Civil War and beyond, had offered her to come stay with him and his family on the farm post-Endgame to clear her head so that she wasn't alone in the world.

Who says he didn't? Though Wanda could've also gone to therapy, if she was really having issues like that.

 

[Drizzle]

Am I the only one who isn't phased by the big second weekend drop for Multiverse of Madness? I think what's more impressive is that a Doctor Strange movie opened to nearly $200 million. That aside, it's not exactly the family friendliest of MCU movies and isn't as rewatchable as something like No Way Home.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Am I the only one who isn't phased by the big second weekend drop for Multiverse of Madness? I think what's more impressive is that a Doctor Strange movie opened to nearly $200 million. That aside, it's not exactly the family friendliest of MCU movies and isn't as rewatchable as something like No Way Home.

I am not either. Movie is a success either way, just a bit more divisive than Marvel anticipated

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Pretty much. It's gotten to the point where Marvel is more or less done holding peoples' hands explaining everything and it's been like that for a while. It's not like that all the time, since the debut solo movies like Shang-Chi or even Black Panther and Captain Marvel back in Phase 3 can be enjoyed on their own without having seen any prior MCU movies (even though it helps) but then you get to something like Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness where they might as well say, "Oh, you're confused because you haven't seen WandaVision? Well you've had a year and a half to watch it so that's on you, pal."

It actually surprised me how standalone MoM was. I don't think you needed to see Wandavision to understand it. I think you probably need Infinity War and End Game, but that's it. Sure there are references to other things, but the characters and their motivations make sense if you go straight from End Game to here. I thought it would be more tied to something like No Way Home than it was.

To use an analogy, End Game is the top of a slide. MoM is the bottom of the slide. Wandavision is the trip down the slide. It provides some context, but if you see someone at the top and then you see them at the bottom, it doesn't take a lot to deduce what happened to them in between.