BvS How Would People Feel About a Zack Snyder Batman Movie?

[KRYPTON INC.]

It's unreasonable because it makes no sense. Because in actuality "no sense" is exactly what Batman would have to do to Supes, TAKE AWAY ALL HIS SENSORY POWERS to even begin to mask himself. Is he masking his breathing too? The slightest rustle of his cape? His thermo signiture? His smell?

It's not Batman's brilliance or having him be formidable that some fans have a problem with. It's as was stated, writing him to either make other characters look useless or idiots or both. As well as writting confrontations with Superman that are just not well thought out or really make sense.

I love Batman. He's hugely insirational to me in my pantheon of favorite fictional heroes. But the last 25 plus years of the handling him alongside other characters is off putting to me and I suspect others as well that do love the character and hold him and many of his stories in high esteem.

 

[Boy Scout]

For all the talk of Superman being the ideal for mankind to strive for, etc etc, I personally feel that Batman is the true ideal.

Yeah, he doesn't wear bright, symbolic colors or always say "Please", "Thank you", and "Ma'am". He can get a bit moody at times, and he gets angry and depressed. He's not the "Boy Scout".

But he's a human being. That is something Superman, no matter how he tries, can never be. He can never feel the pain, danger, and helplessness we feel. He's just not human. How can he be the ideal to strive for when there is no way we can ever be like him?

Batman, with all his flaws, is the paradigm of humanity, to me. No, no one would ever devote their life to fighting crime, and he isn't realistic in the slightest sense of the word. But pushing your personal boundaries, driving yourself to be the best possible man you can be, to take up a noble cause and devote all your time, resources, and life at whatever cost, even death...to me that is more inspiring and heroic than an indestructible baby falling from the heavens.

Flame me all you like, but "bat-god" is still more interesting than Superman, to me.

Superman is not the physical or biological ideal we strive to emulate. Superman is inspirational because of his character.

 

[Sharkboy]

I have no problem with Batman being amazing, and hyper competent with a fictional hero's "improbable wisdom" like Sherlock Holmes.

I do have a problem with out fitting him soley with "plot armor" (A device he came up with to mask his heartbeat? Give me a frackin' brea with that bovine excriment. ) and writting stories where he makes all the other DCU heroes look irrelivant and useless.

It's unreasonable because it makes no sense. Because in actuality "no sense" is exactly what Batman would have to do to Supes, TAKE AWAY ALL HIS SENSORY POWERS to even begin to mask himself. Is he masking his breathing too? The slightest rustle of his cape? His thermo signiture? His smell?

It's not Batman's brilliance or having him be formidable that some fans have a problem with. It's as was stated, writing him to either make other characters look useless or idiots or both. As well as writting confrontations with Superman that are just not well thought out or really make sense.

I love Batman. He's hugely insirational to me in my pantheon of favorite fictional heroes. But the last 25 plus years of the handling him alongside other characters is off putting to me and I suspect others as well that do love the character and hold him and many of his stories in high esteem.

I feel that you have no context for the scene in which he masks his heartbeat.

In what way, pray tell, does Superman look "irrelevant and useless", the only thing you can complain about (outside of the wonderful mullet) is that Superman (in a completely non-competitive way) wasn't in complete an utter control of a situation. While i do not deny that the idea of bat-god can be abused, most of the time I think the complainers aren't mad that Superman (and the others) are getting shafted, rather that their favourite hero isn't the one getting overpowered themselves.

 

[hafizbat]

Superman is not the physical or biological ideal we strive to emulate. Superman is inspirational because of his character.

Don't want to turn this into Batman vs Superman (oh wait ) but I believe everything I mentioned in my post refers to character, not physicality.

This is a man who puts his life on the line each and every night to do the same things Superman can do in a blink of an eye. How is Superman's character any more inspirational? The "boy scout" personality isn't unique to Superman (Cap in the MCU is a much better example than MoS Clark).

 

[Sharkboy]

For all the talk of Superman being the ideal for mankind to strive for, etc etc, I personally feel that Batman is the true ideal.

Yeah, he doesn't wear bright, symbolic colors or always say "Please", "Thank you", and "Ma'am". He can get a bit moody at times, and he gets angry and depressed. He's not the "Boy Scout".

But he's a human being. That is something Superman, no matter how he tries, can never be. He can never feel the pain, danger, and helplessness we feel. He's just not human. How can he be the ideal to strive for when there is no way we can ever be like him?

Batman, with all his flaws, is the paradigm of humanity, to me. No, no one would ever devote their life to fighting crime, and he isn't realistic in the slightest sense of the word. But pushing your personal boundaries, driving yourself to be the best possible man you can be, to take up a noble cause and devote all your time, resources, and life at whatever cost, even death...to me that is more inspiring and heroic than an indestructible baby falling from the heavens.

Flame me all you like, but "bat-god" is still more interesting than Superman, to me.

It's not Kal-el's power that humankind should strive for, it's Clark Kents morals and upstanding character, it just so happens that his power highlights those qualities and makes people take notice, but yes the very best of humankind is represented in Batman. It would be interesting to see that explored in BvS, Kal-el finally meeting the absolute best in humanity (Batman) and the absolute worst (Lex)

 

[lc23]

I find it hilariously ironic that a richer than god 5-percenter trust-fund baby, playboy billionaire, forensic scientist, master martial artist, knows 20+ languages fluently, former paraplegic, time-traveling, over-entitled, emo-feudal lord-wannabe who dresses up like a giant bat is "easier to relate to" than a guy who grew up on a farm, not getting fed from a silver spoon, works a 9-to-5 in addition to the superheroing, no butler to make his meals, dress him, wipe his butt, based on the sole fact that he's human.

 

[Sharkboy]

I find it hilariously ironic that a richer than god 5-percenter trust-fund baby, playboy billionaire, forensic scientist, master martial artist, knows 20+ languages fluently, former paraplegic, time-traveling, over-entitled, emo-feudal lord-wannabe who dresses up like a giant bat is "easier to relate to" than a guy who grew up on a farm, not getting fed from a silver spoon, works a 9-to-5 in addition to the superheroing, no butler to make his meals, dress him, wipe his butt, based on the sole fact that he's human.

and I find it hilarious that after god knows how many movies, comic books, animated shows, animated movies and video games, how someone could miss the mark about the characterisation of such a well known superhero.

 

[Skrilla31]

For all the talk of Superman being the ideal for mankind to strive for, etc etc, I personally feel that Batman is the true ideal.

Yeah, he doesn't wear bright, symbolic colors or always say "Please", "Thank you", and "Ma'am". He can get a bit moody at times, and he gets angry and depressed. He's not the "Boy Scout".

But he's a human being. That is something Superman, no matter how he tries, can never be. He can never feel the pain, danger, and helplessness we feel. He's just not human. How can he be the ideal to strive for when there is no way we can ever be like him?

Batman, with all his flaws, is the paradigm of humanity, to me. No, no one would ever devote their life to fighting crime, and he isn't realistic in the slightest sense of the word. But pushing your personal boundaries, driving yourself to be the best possible man you can be, to take up a noble cause and devote all your time, resources, and life at whatever cost, even death...to me that is more inspiring and heroic than an indestructible baby falling from the heavens.

Flame me all you like, but "bat-god" is still more interesting than Superman, to me.

Superman has felt pain, both physical and emotional. He's been in danger, and yes... there are times when he's felt helpless. A good writer will find a way to make him vulnerable.

The only thing that separates Clark from the rest of us are his superpowers. Underneath he's just like you and me. It's what he chooses to do with those powers that makes him an inspiration.

 

[The Batman]

While i do not deny that the idea of bat-god can be abused, most of the time I think the complainers aren't mad that Superman (and the others) are getting shafted, rather that their favourite hero isn't the one getting overpowered themselves.

That's exactly what it is. And its more obvious when you go to the Superman and Wonder Woman message boards on the Comic Book Resources website.

 

[hafizbat]

It's not Kal-el's power that humankind should strive for, it's Clark Kents morals and upstanding character, it just so happens that his power highlights those qualities and makes people take notice, but yes the very best of humankind is represented in Batman. It would be interesting to see that explored in BvS, Kal-el finally meeting the absolute best in humanity (Batman) and the absolute worst (Lex)

Good post Let's hope they can capture the essence of all three characters.

I find it hilariously ironic that a richer than god 5-percenter trust-fund baby, playboy billionaire, forensic scientist, master martial artist, knows 20+ languages fluently, former paraplegic, time-traveling, over-entitled, emo-feudal lord-wannabe who dresses up like a giant bat is "easier to relate to" than a guy who grew up on a farm, not getting fed from a silver spoon, works a 9-to-5 in addition to the superheroing, no butler to make his meals, dress him, wipe his butt, based on the sole fact that he's human.

...If you would read my post, rather than get defensive and write an ignorant reply, you would find that I never said Batman is easy to relate to...I said he's more inspirational and a better ideal to strive for. I'm sorry, but posts like this make me feel disdain towards Superman fans.

Superman has felt pain, both physical and emotional. He's been in danger, and yes... there are times when he's felt helpless. A good writer will find a way to make him vulnerable.

The only thing that separates Clark from the rest of us are his superpowers. Underneath he's just like you and me. It's what he chooses to do with those powers that makes him an inspiration.

While that is true, I ask again, what makes him more inspirational than other heroes who do the same? Why isn't Spider-Man, who is far more vulnerable (and much less inclined, being publicly ridiculed) more inspirational because of what he does with his powers? Going by his motto "With great power comes great responsibility", no one has a greater responsibility than Superman. I don't see anything especially heroic about him.

And when it comes to Batman, he has no powers at all, and therefore has no responsibility at all. There are plenty of people as rich as him, but they don't do what he does. Batman has sacrificed the most of any hero, when he didn't have to.

 

[lc23]

and I find it hilarious that after god knows how many movies, comic books, animated shows, animated movies and video games, how someone could miss the mark about the characterisation of such a well known superhero.

I understand the character just fine, thanks. I even like Batman, believe it or not. I was intentionally skewing certain facts while leaving out others to present a certain viewpoint to make a point (and to be a smartbutt). It's common practice during fanboy arguments. Not even your Batgod is immune from being a target.




(Man. Batgod fans, can't live with them...)

 

[Skrilla31]

While that is true, I ask again, what makes him more inspirational than other heroes who do the same?Why isn't Spider-Man, who is far more vulnerable (and much less inclined, being publicly ridiculed) more inspirational because of what he does with his powers? Going by his motto "With great power comes great responsibility", no one has a greater responsibility than Superman. I don't see anything especially heroic about him.

And when it comes to Batman, he has no powers at all, and therefore has no responsibility at all. There are plenty of people as rich as him, but they don't do what he does. Batman has sacrificed the most of any hero, when he didn't have to.

That's a moot point because Bruce was traumatized at an early age long before he would ever choose to make that commitment. Bruce was never going to be happy in the first place until he found a way to cope with what happened to him, and luckily for the people of Gotham the way he coped with it was donning the cape and cowl.

Unlike Bruce, Clark actually has a happy life to go home to when he's not being Superman. If he really wanted to he could throw it all away for a life with Lois and live happily ever after. The reason he doesn't is because he puts other people's happiness before his own. That in my opinion is the ultimate sacrifice.

Plus in a world so gray as ours and where the big decisions aren't always so easy, you could always just kind of count on Superman to do the right thing. It's not that other heroes aren't capable but I don't trust them to remain as fair, kind and just in the face of despair as I do Superman.

 

[Sharkboy]

I understand the character just fine, thanks. I even like Batman, believe it or not. I was intentionally skewing certain facts while leaving out others to present a certain viewpoint to make a point (and to be a smartbutt). It's common practice during fanboy arguments. Not even your Batgod is immune from being a target.




(Man. Batgod fans, can't live with them...)

lol?

 

[DeGenerate10]

Personally I would rather see Affleck take over the directing reigns for Batman. I wouldn't complain a bit of Snyder did it though. I'm a big fan of the movies Affleck has directed and think he'd be a good fit for a Batman movie. Gone Girl, The Town, Argo were all pretty damn good.

 

[MrsKent26]

Superman has felt pain, both physical and emotional. He's been in danger, and yes... there are times when he's felt helpless. A good writer will find a way to make him vulnerable.

The only thing that separates Clark from the rest of us are his superpowers. Underneath he's just like you and me. It's what he chooses to do with those powers that makes him an inspiration.

Thanks for this. This is how I see it too.

Superman is very vulnerable in certain situations. When you increase a character's power level, you just have to increase the stakes of the battle to make it tense and give the character a struggle. As shown by the Zod battle, Kryptonians can be killed, so it's not like superman is immortal or anything. He came very close to losing that battle in MOS. And if superman loses, humanity is lost. It's not like there's no challenge there, lol.

Added to that is the fact that he grew up like a human and has the same emotions any of us have. The story of superman in general is beautiful. An alien grows up to love humans more than many actual human beings love humanity.

 

[JDklip]

That's a moot point because Bruce was traumatized at an early age long before he would ever choose to make that commitment. Bruce was never going to be happy in the first place until he found a way to cope with what happened to him, and luckily for the people of Gotham the way he coped with it was donning the cape and cowl.

Unlike Bruce, Clark actually has a happy life to go home to when he's not being Superman. If he really wanted to he could throw it all away for a life with Lois and live happily ever after. The reason he doesn't is because he puts other people's happiness before his own. That in my opinion is the ultimate sacrifice.

Plus in a world so gray as ours and where the big decisions aren't always so easy, you could always just kind of count on Superman to do the right thing. It's not that other heroes aren't capable but I don't trust them to remain as fair, kind and just in the face of despair as I do Superman.

Yeah, I agree with all of that completely (although I'm a Superman fan, so I would). Batman, if anything, is like Odysseus. Stranded on this journey that he actually wants to be on. How many stories have explored Bruce trying to give up the cape and cowl? And in all but TDKR, the answer always comes back that he can't. He IS Batman. He has to be Batman or he's not happy (or miserable, which for Bruce seems to be his preferred mood).

Superman, being the template from which all other superheroes were shaped, is not unique anymore in using his powers to help humanity. But Skrilla is right, the powers are both supposed to compliment and contrast the character of Clark Kent. Compliment in the sense that Clark, because of how he was raised, can't help but help others. He can't stand by and not do anything. The power allows him to do that.

But anyone else having this power would quickly succumb to it. It's all too easy with so much power to go down the wrong path, and Clark never does. That's the contrast part.

 

[MrsKent26]

But anyone else having this power would quickly succumb to it. It's all too easy with so much power to go down the wrong path, and Clark never does. That's the contrast part.

This is very important. I think people forget sometimes just how easy it would be for Clark to slip into villainy or dictatorship. He's got the mind of a human and has no more resistance to "Absolute power corrupts absolutely" than anyone else.

Superman's great power is also an opportunity to show how effortlessly he transitions from a galactic protector to someone who sees each individual as worth saving:

The same guy who saves Earth from an alien God is there just to give someone a hug.

 

[JDklip]

This is very important. I think people forget sometimes just how easy it would be for Clark to slip into villainy or dictatorship. He's got the mind of a human and has no more resistance to "Absolute power corrupts absolutely" than anyone else.

Superman's great power is also an opportunity to show how effortlessly he transitions from a galactic protector to someone who sees each individual as worth saving:

The same guy who saves Earth from an alien God is there just to give someone a hug.

Oh man, thanks for THAT!! I love that dichotomy. That hugging a kid about to commit suicide is so human to me. At least, what I hope I'd do in that situation. Man, yeah, aspirational. I LOVE Superman!

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

lol?

It's best to just ignore people that make posts like that. The only argument they have against Bat-god "BUT MUH SOUP!"

It can only be the best of the character they want to see the best in.

Because y'know when people do it the other way around and make Batman hilariously overpowered and Superman near braindead, that's always a fair representation, right?

 

[Sharkboy]

Oh man, thanks for THAT!! I love that dichotomy. That hugging a kid about to commit suicide is so human to me. At least, what I hope I'd do in that situation. Man, yeah, aspirational. I LOVE Superman!

 

[MrsKent26]

Oh man, thanks for THAT!! I love that dichotomy. That hugging a kid about to commit suicide is so human to me. At least, what I hope I'd do in that situation. Man, yeah, aspirational. I LOVE Superman!

I love him too. Looking forward to seeing more of him on screen.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Ignoring how hilariously abrasive you are being right now, no I'm not, I'm someone who thinks that if Batman is the only one without any sort of physical or mental superpower, then if you want him to be a part of the justice league (and considering he's DC's most popular property and a mainstay of the justice league of course he'll be) he'll have to make up his lack of super speed/strength with sharp wits, superior resources and an all around better mind (and a lot of luck and yes obsessive planning or "prep-time" as you call it).


You seem to make the common mistake in thinking that powering up Batman would equal depowering others. It's called writing a good balanced team, not being a fanboy, despite what insecure superman fans would have you believe.

I wasn't being serious. I've been forgetting to use this t: lately.

For future reference, I don't take this stuff that seriously very often. So if you see something like that from me again, I'm just messing with you. I do it to everyone.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

And it's the existence of THIS type of attitude that ensures that BvSDoJ will probably be massively divisive no matter what. It's going to be the first comic book film that will intentionally encourage fanbase infighting.

Oh man, it's gonna be hilarious watching people get all bent out of shape.

Yeah, it's gonna be fun.

 

[Sharkboy]

I wasn't being serious. I've been forgetting to use this t: lately.

For future reference, I don't take this stuff that seriously very often. So if you see something like that from me again, I'm just messing with you. I do it to everyone.

Well now i hate you even more for making me look foolish.

 

[Jake Cassidy]

Well now i hate you even more for making me look foolish.

It's not that hard to make you look foolish.