Superhero Cinematic Civil War - Part 57

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What if Marvel had come up with a lineup of 23 wholly independent TDK and Joker style hits? Would that mean the only option would be for DC to dive in to a light-hearted, banter-filled, massively connected universe?

I mean, DC has been making light hearted, banter filled movies. And while their films aren't massively connected, most of their current films are still DCEU.
 
I mean, DC has been making light hearted, banter filled movies. And while their films aren't massively connected, most of their current films are still DCEU.
I’m just making the point that DC don’t have to do the direct opposite of what Marvel have done just because Marvel have been very successful with a cinematic universe. Just do whatever they think will work for the projects at hand and make them good. All kinds of approaches can work as Joker, Deadpool, Iron Man, GotG, Infinity War, Superman 1, Ragnarok, Batman Begins, Wonder Woman and Aquaman have shown (random list of examples). Make films that are good (to at least a decent number of viewers) and people will embrace the overall underlying universe structure or lack thereof. The MCU kicked off with a broadly well received film in Iron Man that was a good film within its own right, that didn’t have a whole lot of crossover element until the end credits. If it had stayed as a one shot it would have still been massively respected and remembered. In other words either approach can still work, it’s more about how well the underlying films are received IMO.
 
I don't know how to feel about a Spider-Verse film, but I know I don't care about Holland's Spider-Man, so it has my attention as much as anything else they might do. Maybe something interesting could come out of it.
I loved his inclusion in Civil War and the Avengers films, but the new solo films don't have the charm of Spider-Man 1 and 2. I like FFH but I could just as easily do without these new solos. If they bring in Sinister 6 eventually maybe it will start feeling like an event film like SM1 & 2 rather than in some ways fun but disposable entertainment.
 
I’m just making the point that DC don’t have to do the direct opposite of what Marvel have done just because Marvel have been very successful with a cinematic universe. Just do whatever they think will work for the projects at hand and make them good.

Luckily, that's pretty much what they've been doing recently.
 
I'm still confounded that it's taken this long to make a Flash movie. Feels like an easy billion in the right hands.

Several reasons, most likely:

1. "In the right hands" is a very key caveat, because the Flash would only be an easy billion dollar movie if they didn't bury it in grimdark BS. Note the recent interview where the main thing Snyder ( the guy previously in charge of their cinematic vision through most of the Flash movie's theoretical development ) wanted to talk about was how Barry shouldn't be able to move people, because it would tear them limb from limb.

2. The TV Show. It was a huge, unexpected, success, and too big a success to get ignored or casually cancelled. That meant doing a Flash movie would invite comparisons with the TV show, which could be very bad, corporate politics wise. I mean, what happens to your rep if the audience largely says "We like the TV one better"?
 
There've been behind the scenes clashes as well. Multiple director changes, scripts thrown out and being rewritten, the entire tone and scope of the project supposedly changing after the initial plans for the DCEU fell apart. Allegedly, the major source of contention that led to Rick Famuyiwa's departure was that he signed on to make a more serious movie with some political undertones (supposedly touching on things like corruption and bigotry in the Central City Police Department where Barry works) and then the studio got cold feet and wanted something lighter when BVS underperformed. He wound up making a post dunking on WB when Black Panther did significantly better at the box office than Justice League, so it's clear there was no love lost there and that he didn't leave the film on the best of terms with the execs.

Then the Homecoming writers came onboard to do the lighter take WB wanted, but they apparently didn't get on well with Ezra Miller, and eventually departed (like Famuyiwa, they made a snarky post later implying that Ezra might be difficult to work with). Then we had Grant Morrison onboard to co-write a darker and more serious take with Ezra, but their script wound up being rejected by the studio.

Lots of false starts and pivoting of directions, basically.
 
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I think many seem to think this will be amazing because Into the Spiderverse was. But, that was a whole other animal. The movie wasn't good because it was a mutiverse romp. It was great cause Lord and Miller crafted a great movie that happened to involve multiple Spider-Men. I enjoyed the previous Holland Spider-Man films. But this just feels like trying to shove the Spiderverse in our faces cause it got an Oscar and is popular. Not because it was the natural evolution of the series. I have many concerns it will be rushed as hell and bank on novelty/nostalgia to make people like it.
Yeah, I didn't even like the idea of Spiderverse in and of itself. I thought it was a tacky, eye-rolling idea until I was sitting in the theatre being blown away.

Poor Holland Spidey never gets a chance to really stand on his own. He exists so completely in the shadow of the broader MCU and now potentially in the shadow of past Spider-Men as well.

That all being said? As one of those freaks who thinks Garfield is the best Spider-Man by a huge margin despite the messiness of his films if he's in this I am 110% sold.
 
I think many seem to think this will be amazing because Into the Spiderverse was. But, that was a whole other animal. The movie wasn't good because it was a mutiverse romp. It was great cause Lord and Miller crafted a great movie that happened to involve multiple Spider-Men. I enjoyed the previous Holland Spider-Man films. But this just feels like trying to shove the Spiderverse in our faces cause it got an Oscar and is popular. Not because it was the natural evolution of the series. I have many concerns it will be rushed as hell and bank on novelty/nostalgia to make people like it.

I understand the desire to place responsibility for Into the Spider-verse on Lord and Miller's shoulders, because they are the big name. But Lord shares the writing credit with Rodney Rothman. Bob Persichetti, Peter Ramsay, and and Rodney Rothman are the directors, and they rarely get a mention. And considering so, so much of what makes Spider-verse work is the animation, that the directors and the animation department deserve a greater lion's share of credit. Hell, Lord and Miller busy faffing around with Star Wars during the bulk of production.

Honestly, Sony is doing this because of Spider-verse AND because of all the Batmen stuff being talked about. Hell, it is also the quickest way for them to get the Sinister Six out.
 


Stupid question: Is Sam Riami’s first Spider-Man movie a “thanksgiving movie”?


Stupid answer... Nah.

Now... If the film all took place on turkey day or the build up to the plot centered on the build up to Thanksgiving or the meal etc. then... Sure.

Put it this way... Spidey1 is as much a Thanksgiving movie as Homecoming is ABOUT the homecoming dance at Peter's school. Pivotal events happen in the timeframe but it's not tied into the whole film's characters, plots or themes without a viewer really, REALLY reaching.
 
I'm a little lenient on that sort of thing. For example, I definitely consider Die Hard a Christmas movie because the Christmas references are just all throughout it. But Spider-Man 1 being a Thanksgiving movie because of one scene is a bridge too far for me.
 
Peter is wearing the Goblin's colors. Norman is wearing Spider-Man's and Harry is wearing both.
 
I'm a little lenient on that sort of thing. For example, I definitely consider Die Hard a Christmas movie because the Christmas references are just all throughout it. But Spider-Man 1 being a Thanksgiving movie because of one scene is a bridge too far for me.
Die Hard is 100% a Christmas movie. But if that can be debated, then this shouldn’t even be considered, lol.
 
Exactly. If a holiday makes you think of a certain film even if it's just because of one scene and makes you want to watch it during that occasion then go ahead and consider it what you want.
 
Exactly. If a holiday makes you think of a certain film even if it's just because of one scene and makes you want to watch it during that occasion then go ahead and consider it what you want.

If that's the case, Batman Returns is right up there with Home Alone and Charlie Brown for me lol.
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