The Superhero Cinematic Civil War

[Drizzle]

Sony just pushed back Kraven the Hunter to December 13, 2024. And their Karate Kid movie is now opening May 30, 2025.

‘Kraven the Hunter,’ ‘Karate Kid’ Pushed Back by Sony

The studio made some late Friday afternoon changes to its calendar.

www.hollywoodreporter.com

I'll tell the children.

 

[The Caped Knight]

Man I feel old. I remember loving the original series of Dragonball as a kid , then Z came along in my early teens and shattered my whole world with such an incredible action . I like so many DBZ fans eagerly awaited the live action adaptation film only to get the dumpster fire known as Dragon Ball Evolution an agonizing abomination of Goku and the rest of the beloved characters.

 

[Spider-Fan]

You may as well just release Kraven today in whatever incomplete state it may be in. It's gonna lose a ton of money regardless when you put it out. August, December, 2024, 2025, tomorrow, it doesn't matter. It's going to suck. It's going to fail

 

[Lily Adler]

Man I feel old. I remember loving the original series of Dragonball as a kid , then Z came along in my early teens and shattered my whole world with such an incredible action . I like so many DBZ fans eagerly awaited the live action adaptation film only to get the dumpster fire known as Dragon Ball Evolution an agonizing abomination of Goku and the rest of the beloved characters.

Don't forget Toriyama has now passed away.

 

[mclay18]

You may as well just release Kraven today in whatever incomplete state it may be in. It's gonna lose a ton of money regardless when you put it out. August, December, 2024, 2025, tomorrow, it doesn't matter. It's going to suck. It's going to fail

The fact that Sony pushed it to a week before two big family movies is pretty telling. Barring the first two Scream movies, when was the last time an R rated film released around Christmas made over $100M domestic?

If it becomes a hit, it’ll be a Venom type anomaly. I don’t see Sony doing any reshoots to justify the delay either.

 

[Drizzle]

The fact that Sony pushed it to a week before two big family movies is pretty telling. Barring the first two Scream movies, when was the last time an R rated film released around Christmas made over $100M domestic?

American Sniper I think. Had to edit the post twice because first I thought it was Django Unchained, then Wolf of Wall Street. That was three consecutive years with a $100M+ domestic R-rated Christmas release.

 

[mclay18]

American Sniper I think. Had to edit the post twice because first I thought it was Django Unchained, then Wolf of Wall Street. That was three consecutive years with a $100M+ domestic R-rated Christmas release.

Those movies had good buzz though. American Sniper was given a limited release on Christmas 2014 and got nationwide expansion on MLK weekend (it earned 99% of its earnings in January/February 2015).

I think Sony is covering their ass because if they REALLY wanted to dump Kraven, it would be in the post Thanksgiving weekend spot. Now that would be a major ouchie. Mid December 2024 looks better from a studio perspective.

 

[blueharvest]

 

[Spider-Fan]

That's a shame. Seems like whatever this was, Captain Marvel 3, and Ms Marvel season 2 likely all are unlikely

 

[Kane52630]

I hate Rogue and Magneto. I also hate the original VAs. That's it.

sounds like a Saturday Morning Cartoon Character

 

[Drizzle]

Those movies had good buzz though. American Sniper was given a limited release on Christmas 2014 and got nationwide expansion on MLK weekend (it earned 99% of its earnings in January/February 2015).

I think Sony is covering their ass because if they REALLY wanted to dump Kraven, it would be in the post Thanksgiving weekend spot. Now that would be a major ouchie. Mid December 2024 looks better from a studio perspective.

Still, those were the last R-rated movies to do very well at the box office before Disney laid claim to that territory starting with The Force Awakens. But it doesn't even matter because as @Spider-Fan said, Kraven is probably going to do poorly no matter when it's released. They should have just kept to its original date in October of last year.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Yeah, if they wanted to dump it and forget it, they'd release it now. My best guess for the delay is they want Venom 3 to do well so the stink of Madame Web is off Kraven. But Venom 3 doing well won't save Kraven. We all know it's getting that 15% or lower RT score and review embargo will lift day of release to hide it

 

[Drizzle]

Yeah, if they wanted to dump it and forget it, they'd release it now. My best guess for the delay is they want Venom 3 to do well so the stink of Madame Web is off Kraven. But Venom 3 doing well won't save Kraven. We all know it's getting that 15% or lower RT score and review embargo will lift day of release to hide it

The funny thing is that for as much of a dumb idea it is to do a Kraven spinoff when he hasn't even appeared in a movie with Spider-Man yet, he's still less obscure of a character than Morbius and Madame Web. If they had just released it already it's entirely plausible that it would have done better than Madame Web at least.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

First Monica gets robbed of her Captain Marvel title, now she gets robbed of a spinoff. We literally had just ONE job, go see The Marvels, BUT NOOO.

 

[Pennywise]

First Monica gets robbed of her Captain Marvel title, now she gets robbed of a spinoff. We literally had just ONE job, go see The Marvels, BUT NOOO.

View attachment 88727

That sucks! I thought the film was so much fun when I saw it! Loved the dynamic between Carol/Monica/Kamala, the action sequences, the direction, also made me laugh quite a bit too!

Watched it again recently on Disney+, still great to me!

 

[DA_Champion]

Sony's asset stripping of Spider Man is comically bad business.

I personally think a spider man universe can do just fine, but they're rushing it. They need to build up some good will with the consumers before flooding the market.

***

If WB buys Sony, can Spider Man join the DCU?

 

[Spider-Fan]

Sony's asset stripping of Spider Man is comically bad business.

I personally think a spider man universe can do just fine, but they're rushing it. They need to build up some good will with the consumers before flooding the market.

***

If WB buys Sony, can Spider Man join the DCU?

No. Sony would lose the license if a studio buys them. Per the Sony leaks, that is in the agreement.

 

[Drizzle]

Sony's asset stripping of Spider Man is comically bad business.

I personally think a spider man universe can do just fine, but they're rushing it. They need to build up some good will with the consumers before flooding the market.

***

If WB buys Sony, can Spider Man join the DCU?

If the Spider-Man rights are to remain with Sony, they'd be fine if they just stuck with Venom and Spider-Verse movies under their own umbrella along with joint co-productions with Marvel Studios for the Holland movies or even some live action Miles Morales and Spider-Gwen movies instead of wasting money on obscure spinoffs. And if the Venom well runs dry as I'm sure it will because I doubt Tom Hardy will be sticking around for any more after this third one, maybe they should try to make a fourth Raimi Spider-Man movie with Tobey happen. It's a pipe dream but it's still a much more lucrative prospect than chasing after box office gold with C and D-list villain spinoffs that are never gonna happen.

 

[Spider-Fan]

If the Spider-Man rights are to remain with Sony, they'd be fine if they just stuck with Venom and Spider-Verse movies under their own umbrella along with joint co-productions with Marvel Studios for the Holland movies or even some live action Miles Morales and Spider-Gwen movies instead of wasting money on obscure spinoffs. And if the Venom well runs dry as I'm sure it will because I doubt Tom Hardy will be sticking around for any more after this third one, maybe they should try to make a fourth Raimi Spider-Man movie with Tobey happen. It's a pipe dream but it's still a much more lucrative prospect than chasing after box office gold with C and D-list villain spinoffs that are never gonna happen.

While I don't know this as a fact, Marvel Studios almost certainly has a no compete for the Spider-Man license. Meaning Sony almost certainly cannot make competing Spider-Man branded live action solo films while Marvel Studios is making them. It's as clear as day that's the case. Tom Holland by many accounts filmed a scrapped Venom cameo. Morbius clearly was connected to the MCU and Morbius was in the Vulture's jail in an earlier version before they changed it and NWHed Vulture via post credits. May and Peter couldn't be mentioned by name in Madame Web. Sony is desperate to connect this stuff to Spider-Man or have Spider-Man be a huge presence in them. Clearly they legally cannot. So Spider-Man 4 or Amazing Spider-Man 3 are almost certainly off the table.

As for why they can do the Spiderverse movies, animation film rights and live actions rights are 2 different things legally. Now, I don't know what the Ghost Spider or Miles Morales situation is. That might be where Sony ends up going, unless they plan on using Miles in the Holland movies. On that front we have to wait and see, but the Sony arrangement is the way it is right now for a reason.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

The funny thing is that for as much of a dumb idea it is to do a Kraven spinoff when he hasn't even appeared in a movie with Spider-Man yet, he's still less obscure of a character than Morbius and Madame Web. If they had just released it already it's entirely plausible that it would have done better than Madame Web at least.

Doing better than Madame Web means nothing because it did so poorly. It’s like being better than the Chicago White Sox.

 

[Deck Rickard]

“Oh ****, Kraven has been pushed back again? Damn, I was really looking forward to that.” - No One, Ever

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

“Oh ****, Kraven has been pushed back again? Damn, I was really looking forward to that.” - No One, Ever

B-b-but the El Muerto teaser was going to be in it!

 

[Deck Rickard]

B-b-but the El Muerto teaser was going to be in it!

Part of me hopes Sony still makes El Muerto despite Bad Bunny leaving the project because they think they’ll save face, even though the whole thing was concocted just to give him a franchise, lol.

 

[Iceman]

That's a shame. Seems like whatever this was, Captain Marvel 3, and Ms Marvel season 2 likely all are unlikely

Before this MCU downturn and also the poor numbers for The Marvels, I was hoping each of the main characters was getting their own next project (ie Monica spinoff, Ms Marvel season 2 and independent CM2) and then a reunion of all of them in a second Marvels. It was probably overoptimistic hoping for all of those, but at least 1 or 2 of those should still have been given a chance.

 

[Iceman]

If the Spider-Man rights are to remain with Sony, they'd be fine if they just stuck with Venom and Spider-Verse movies under their own umbrella along with joint co-productions with Marvel Studios for the Holland movies or even some live action Miles Morales and Spider-Gwen movies instead of wasting money on obscure spinoffs. And if the Venom well runs dry as I'm sure it will because I doubt Tom Hardy will be sticking around for any more after this third one, maybe they should try to make a fourth Raimi Spider-Man movie with Tobey happen. It's a pipe dream but it's still a much more lucrative prospect than chasing after box office gold with C and D-list villain spinoffs that are never gonna happen.

Miles/Gwen could have exploded if handled right IMO. I wish I could sit in on a Sony CBM strategy meeting where someone is being enthusiastic about greenlighting some of these vague properties. Would love to see the thought processes at work lol.