Hawkeye Episode 5: Ronin (Spoiler Discussion)

[Drizzle]

Well, Bob Chapek sure won’t be happy, if KF says: go watch the origin story over at the biggest competitor of the streaming market…

The show is years old, so I don't think that matters at this point. It ain't like that will net millions of new subs for Netflix.

Yep. Also, just bringing D'Onofrio's Fisk into the fold is obviously going to create curiosity for anyone who missed out on the Daredevil series anyway, but I'm willing to bet that the majority of people watching Hawkeye have already watched Daredevil regardless.

 

[Saitou Hajime]

I mean there could be a connection, but my guess is that Valentina was like a subcontractor with lots of resources. People put out contracts to her, she pus dangerous individuals on the contracts.

Or I dunno, maybe she's married to Kingpin.

I'm not surprised if the three aren't in some kind of mutually beneficial business partnership: Kingpin supplies the crime, Bishop provides security for people affected by Kingpin's shenanigans, and Contessa handles specialized contractors that tackle missions for and against Kingpin, with just enough leeway that the big guy himself isn't affected.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I do as well. The show was just a bit more violent, so like I said a "reimagining" could just mean toning them down a bit. Like I said, it is a vague statement

Not sure if Punisher can be PG-13 but everyone else in the Netflix Marvel shows can.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Everyone getting happy about Fisk. I'm still waiting for fully realized Bullseye. He's still alive!

 

[Punisher_MAX]

I personally don't care if this is tied to the Netflix series, that Netflix Universe can just be a different reality like AoS.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

 

[Ninjablade]

Pretty decent episode. Have to say though, none of this Echo stuff does anything for me. Can't say any of it has inspired any interest in me to watch a spin-off.

The blip moment at the beginning of the episode was really freaking cool. I wish I had liked Black Widow because Yelena is much better here, but I thought that movie was really all over the place with her character, so the foundation is shaky for me. Her scene with Kate was pretty good. Wish they'd do something a little different than a one to one Hawkeye/Widow friendship with their legacy characters.

I really love Christophe Beck using Lorne Balfe and Alan Silvestri's music when relevant. He's always been good about it, dating back to the first Ant-Man, but it's been really apparent here. I appreciate the thematic continuity.

Excited for the final episode and that of course that reveal. Kingpin is back baby.

 

[Boom]

Soooo who has the watch at the moment?

 

[P Supreme]

If I had to guess what will be Canon from the netflix series I say the first 2 seasons they will ignore the 3rd season where Fisk is locked up and Matt lets his identity be know by Fisk and Vanessa we already have an answer to that Fisk is not in Jail

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Soooo who has the watch at the moment?

Kate I believe.

 

[Iceman]

If they integrate these characters they may just lift the characters in spirit and not refer to events from the shows. That way they aren’t contradicting them and making them impossible to coexist while also not committing to anything and getting weighed down and restricted in future.

 

[Donner]

Yelena is my favourite.

 

[Iceman]

Yep. Also, just bringing D'Onofrio's Fisk into the fold is obviously going to create curiosity for anyone who missed out on the Daredevil series anyway, but I'm willing to bet that the majority of people watching Hawkeye have already watched Daredevil regardless.

Daredevil has been out a long time, is highly rated and was the original Netflix Marvel show. You’d expect most Marvel fans who use Netflix to have at least tried it. And if not they probably know someone who has who will slap them for not having tried it after all this time. For any that haven’t maybe the next episode will help push them to finally do so.

 

[samsnee]

Yelena is the best. Anyone catch her mentioning the “new and improved Statue of Liberty”? Ties into the new Spider-Man movie

 

[Snow Queen]

If I had to guess what will be Canon from the netflix series I say the first 2 seasons they will ignore the 3rd season where Fisk is locked up and Matt lets his identity be know by Fisk and Vanessa we already have an answer to that Fisk is not in Jail

It's been like 6-7 years since season 3 of Daredevil in-universe, Fisk not being in jail has an infinite number of explanations before retconning only one season of a show.

 

[KillerMcQueen]

It's been like 6-7 years since season 3 of Daredevil in-universe, Fisk not being in jail has an infinite number of explanations before retconning only one season of a show.

It wouldn't even be the first time this version of Fisk has gotten out of a prison sentence.

 

[Spider-Fan]

If they integrate these characters they may just lift the characters in spirit and not refer to events from the shows. That way they aren’t contradicting them and making them impossible to coexist while also not committing to anything and getting weighed down and restricted in future.

Like I said, I kind of think this will be what happens. They will have vague backstories and won't reference the Netflix stuff in great detail. Just maybe vague things like Matt and Fisk know each other, if Bullseye comes he hates Daredevil and they know each other already, etc. I don't need super detailed references to the Netflix stuff regardless. I think the blip and 5 year gap give them a lot of freedom to start their current srorylines we are going to see without the need to toss anything.

 

[Sithborg]

Well, congratulations on Marvel creating their own Supercorp. Hope they survive the experience.

While the Kate/Yelena scene did a whole lot of heavy lifting at justifying her late inclusion into the story, I do think her inclusion is throwing the pacing of the show off. As much as I enjoyed it, and somewhat understand why she is included, I think it is a bit of a net negative. I have a hard time seeing how they wrap all this stuff up neatly in the next episode. Considering the only other MCU show I was able to finish was Wandavision, lets just say I am doubtful about the next episode being a fitting conclusion without setting up another half dozen other things, for either a second season or other shows.

I think the most egregious thing is the clear, easy, and quick set up to turn Maya heroic. Something that should have been seeded since she first showed up. But nope, quick few lines to seed, and then "surprise" face turn next episode, so we can watch her show.

Still, a lot will be forgiven if Yelena joins the Barton family for Christmas.

 

[RockSP]

OH MY GOD!

That episode was nuts from start to finish. The Yelena cold open which showed the snap/blip and how it seemed simultaneous for her and her realizing Natasha is no longer around.

Did you get access to some deleted scenes lol?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

My favorite shot of the show so far:

 

[CaptainWagner]

Amazing episode. Pugh as Yelena continues to be perfect and I already love her dynamic with Kate. (Hope this doesn't diminish any future Kate/America content though. What's the feminine version of "bro-mance"?)

Everyone getting happy about Fisk. I'm still waiting for fully realized Bullseye. He's still alive!

Yeah, I'm thrilled that D'Onferio and likely Cox are officially back. But it just makes me want Wilson Bethel to get the chance at going full Bullseye even more.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Like I said, I kind of think this will be what happens. They will have vague backstories and won't reference the Netflix stuff in great detail. Just maybe vague things like Matt and Fisk know each other, if Bullseye comes he hates Daredevil and they know each other already, etc. I don't need super detailed references to the Netflix stuff regardless. I think the blip and 5 year gap give them a lot of freedom to start their current srorylines we are going to see without the need to toss anything.

Also that Matt is responsible for his "injuries".

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Amazing episode. Pugh as Yelena continues to be perfect and I already love her dynamic with Kate. (Hope this doesn't diminish any future Kate/America content though. What's the feminine version of "bro-mance"?)


Yeah, I'm thrilled that D'Onferio and likely Cox are officially back. But it just makes me want Wilson Bethel to get the chance at going full Bullseye even more.

America will be Kate's bestise. Yelena will be her wife.

And yep. Inject Bethel's Bullseye into my veins!

 

[RockSP]

Wish they'd do something a little different than a one to one Hawkeye/Widow friendship with their legacy characters.

I'm hoping that is the case. As of right now, they aren't necessarily on that path. By the end of the next episode maybe Kate and Yelena will have a grudging respect for each other, but not end up besties.

 

[Still Wynning]

This show continues to be great!

My thoughts:

-Nice to get a little more past stuff with Yelena. Seeing the Snap and the Blip from her perspective was eerie as f***.

-Hailee Steinfeld continues to crush it.

-Florence Pugh as Yelena is the best as always, and her chemistry with Hailee in that conversation scene is just *chef’s kiss*. Already want to see them act together in future MCU projects.

-The scene of Clint at the plaque dedicated to the Avengers “talking” to Natasha definitely got to me.

-Echo definitely suspects something’s up. Possibly the main conflict of her own future series.

-I still main Jacques is definitely not a villain and didn’t kill his dad, though something’s still up with him. I think his goofy act is a facade to throw people off and keep them guessing, and he’s got some tricks up his sleeves.

-F***ING VINCENT D’NOFRIO BACK AS M*****F***ING KINGPIN!!!!! LET’S F***ING GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

Can’t wait to see how next week finishes things off!