Ahsoka Ahsoka: Episode 5 Spoiler Thread

[Kane52630]

Ahsoka is still more well put together than Obi Wan and the last season of Mando, that's for sure

 

[Deck Rickard]

Yeah, I’m still into this series but that whole Anakin/World Between Worlds sequence just left me scratching my head. I don’t need to be spoonfed stuff but I’m honestly not sure what the point of it was, other that to waste time and then I guess make Ahsoka so zen that towards the end of the episode, she comes off like the Dude listening to bowling sounds.

I guess what was frustrating was that it just felt like filler to me. I hope it does ultimately have a point and it wasn’t just fan service to whoever really needs to see Hayden again.

 

[PunyGod]

Andor worship

This is all I could think about when watching that pretentious snoozefest of a show:

 

[PunyGod]

Yeah, I’m still into this series but that whole Anakin/World Between Worlds sequence just left me scratching my head. I don’t need to be spoonfed stuff but I’m honestly not sure what the point of it was, other that to waste time and then I guess make Ahsoka so zen that towards the end of the episode, she comes off like the Dude listening to bowling sounds.

I guess what was frustrating was that it just felt like filler to me. I hope it does, and it wasn’t just fan service to whoever really needs to see Hayden again.

What was the point of the Dagobah cave?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

This is all I could think about when watching that pretentious snoozefest of a show:

What made it a "snoozefest" for you? The compelling themes, story, and characters?

 

[BoredGuy]

and then I guess make Ahsoka so zen that towards the end of the episode, she comes off like the Dude listening to bowling sounds.

Lol... Was anybody else expecting Ahsoka to pull a Finding Dory and start talking in whale to the Purrgils?
"Caaaaaaaan youuuuuu giiiive usssss a riiiiiiide?"

 

[PunyGod]

What made it a "snoozefest" for you? The compelling themes, story, and characters?

Compelling? Its the Star Wars equivalent of a Nolan movie. Grade school material that makes people feel smart because they "get it".

 

[DarthSkywalker]

What was the point of the Dagobah cave?

1. It's a test of Luke. Yoda tells him not to bring his weapons into the cave, but does so anyways. Forcing him into a confrontation. Luke will do this again when deciding to rush off the Cloud City.

2. It's a warning of the pull of the dark side. Luke has demonstrated a lack of emotional maturity and emotional balance, defaults to fear. And as a wise little green puppet friend once said:



3. The cave is telling Luke that big D is his papa. As Luke has shown, what makes Luke most vulnerable to the dark side, is his care for his loved ones. It's where his fear and anger is generated at it's most potent. Also his hope.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Compelling? Its the Star Wars equivalent of a Nolan movie. Grade school material that makes people feel smart because they "get it".

Oh yes, Nolan's a terrible storyteller. I agree.

So uh, what are you suppose to get in Andor exactly that is "grade school material"?

 

[PunyGod]

1. It's a test of Luke. Yoda tells him not to bring his weapons into the cave, but does so anyways. Forcing him into a confrontation. Luke will do this again when deciding to rush off the Cloud City.

2. It's a warning of the pull of the dark side. Luke has demonstrated a lack of emotional maturity and emotional balance, defaults to fear. And as a wise little green puppet friend once said:



3. The cave is telling Luke that big D is his papa. As Luke has shown, what makes Luke most vulnerable to the dark side, is his care for his loved ones. It's where his fear and anger is generated at it's most potent. Also his hope.

Good now apply that same critical thinking to this.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Good now apply that same critical thinking to this.

Let's see if you can. After all, you made the comparsions.

 

[PunyGod]

Oh yes, Nolan's a terrible storyteller. I agree.

So uh, what are you suppose to get in Andor exactly that is "grade school material"?

First tell me what exactly is so good about it. Because we see the first bedroom scene in Star Wars? Because Mon Mothma is having a year long dinner party where she is constantly looking pensive? Because they escape a jail? Because its completely humorless and drab? None of this stuff is deep.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

First tell me what exactly is so good about it. Because we see the first bedroom scene in Star Wars? Because Mon Mothma is having a year long dinner party where she is constantly looking pensive? Because they escape a jail? Because its completely humorless and drab? None of this stuff is deep.

You quoted me first and said it has "grade school material". So let's hear what you think that is. I'm not going to give you the answers so you can throw them back at me.

 

[Sithborg]

To ne frank, I keep coming up with about 3 reasons for this vision. None of which was mentioned previously in the show. Was it that she gave up on life, in many ways? Was it that she needed to change her path? That she was scared of what Anakin ended up becoming? None of the stuff dealt with Anakin and Ahsoka had anything to do with the previous established issue of Ahsoka and Sabine's failure of training. And to be quite frank, so much of that "conversation" freaking vague. There was good to be had here, but there was also so, so much wasted potential. "I've heard that before", just completely bypassing the giant robot in the room.

I think that is where the criticism is coming from. Disappointment, that something that should have been good, never dealt with the actual issues of Anakin/Darth Vader.

Side note, I wish they had gone full Mortis Dark Ahsoka in that bit than just the eyes.

 

[antsman41]

 

[antsman41]

My favorite Star Wars "meal" is The Empire Strikes Back. Then it's The Force Awakens. I love the PT and ST. I love Solo, Rebels, TCW, and The Bad Batch. The Aphra and Vader comics have made me very happy. I'm not hard to please and Ahsoka isn't trying to be anything new or different for Star Wars that I've known and loved. The problem it's bad at what it's trying to be. It lacks the depth, good storytelling, characters, and filmmaking prowess of the actual "grand operatic SW ****".

I think it's super weird that you're stating Andor is the "personal SW" when that's exactly what Ahsoka is trying to be. But it fails as it's all surface level and lacks anything outside of recalling past scenes from superior films/shows.

When I think of good Star Wars, I think about how it brings story, themes, and characters all together with memorable performances, lines, scenes, fights, etc. I think of some of the most beautiful films I've ever seen. It produced emotions beyond, I remember that line or character. Ahsoka isn't doing that. Andor did. For all it does different, it also is just really, really, really good Star Wars. Just like The Empire Strikes Back was. Nothing on Ahsoka is approaching's this "operatic ****".

Because Andor is dealing with day to day personal aspects, ala local government, racism, class, etc.

When Ahsoka is dealing with The Force, PURRGILS, and other grander aspects of the universe.

I’m not dismissing their either have aspects of the other, but on the surface and within their respective agendas… yes, what I said was correct.

 

[Sithborg]

And I reiterate, what guilt has been mentioned before this episode?

 

[BoredGuy]

It seems directly related to the things Baylon said to her during their duel about her being part of a legacy of violence, and her feeling like teaching Sabine how to fight as a Jedi would continue that failed legacy

so this seemed like more of a death vision than an actual journey to the World Between Worlds, Anakin wasn't a force ghost, or real Anakin, just the personification of her inadequacies; afterwards she was more connected to the living force like Ezra, the guy who first showed her the WBW

 

[Weather Witch]

Good now apply that same critical thinking to this.

To ne frank, I keep coming up with about 3 reasons for this vision. None of which was mentioned previously in the show. Was it that she gave up on life, in many ways? Was it that she needed to change her path? That she was scared of what Anakin ended up becoming? None of the stuff dealt with Anakin and Ahsoka had anything to do with the previous established issue of Ahsoka and Sabine's failure of training. And to be quite frank, so much of that "conversation" freaking vague. There was good to be had here, but there was also so, so much wasted potential. "I've heard that before", just completely bypassing the giant robot in the room.

Guess I can give it a shot. Break down what I took away from it, both this episode and the set-up for this last week. It's long-winded, so I'll put in spoiler tags.

Spoiler

Baylon sets up the lesson perfectly in the previous episode: "Your legacy, like your master's, is one of death and destruction", and "It didn't need to come to this, but you know no other way."

This episode reiterates why. She's a child soldier who saw so much loss during two wars. Ahsoka repeats that same line this week too: "But my part of the legacy is one of death and war" and "Is that all I'll have to teach my own padawan one day?" She believes their shared legacy is death. We see a shift between Anakin and Vader. Life and death.

Yet, he did present her with a choice between the two. Once Anakin says: "But you're more than that. Because I'm more than that." She protests and rejects this notion. She doesn't see that his legacy, and by extension her own, is more than just death. That's why she fails the lesson. Once again we see both Anakin and Vader.

Ahsoka for a second seems to embrace the darkness as Anakin once did, but then just like him, she returns to the light. She chooses life, just as Vader did in the end. She won't be Ahsoka the Grey, but Ahsoka the White. Their legacies will be more than just death. That's the lesson. One only Anakin could teach.

A few small side tangents, but this legacy of death is likely why she wouldn't train Sabine or Grogu. And with the entire series being about padawans and masters, Huyang previously mentioned her legacy of 'unique' Jedi as well. From a meta-perspective, Ahsoka's journey is also completely connected to death:

• Her literal death during the Mortis arc
• The assumption she'd die before the end of the series
• Her presumed death in Rebels
• The Ahsoka Lives movement
• Ezra saving her

So her rejecting death and choosing life, well, I couldn't think of something more befitting the character.

It seems directly related to the things Baylon said to her during their duel about her being part of a legacy of violence, and her feeling like teaching Sabine how to fight as a Jedi would continue that failed legacy

Basically this, but with a lot more words.

 

[Breogan]

Lol... Was anybody else expecting Ahsoka to pull a Finding Dory and start talking in whale to the Purrgils?
"Caaaaaaaan youuuuuu giiiive usssss a riiiiiiide?"

LOL Finding Ezmo?

 

[Kane52630]

LOL Finding Ezmo?

If you replace the music with Creed's Higher, that scene would be 10x better.

 

[Filmfan93]

Amazing episode.

Loved the TCW Anakin flashback and the space whales.

The young Ahsoka scene reminded me so much of the young Gamora scene from Infinity War (orange background too), then i realised it's the same actress playing both

Still a bit annoyed we have 3 episodes left and no appearance from Thrawn yet.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Because Andor is dealing with day to day personal aspects, ala local government, racism, class, etc.

When Ahsoka is dealing with The Force, PURRGILS, and other grander aspects of the universe.

I’m not dismissing their either have aspects of the other, but on the surface and within their respective agendas… yes, what I said was correct.

Government, bigotry, class, etc. are the grander aspects of the galaxy far, far away and are own world. They shape the world more then anything else.

The Force and all it's representations, are more often then not the vehicle for the personal aspects of the galaxy. The soap opera. That's why the Skywalker family drama is always filtered through it first and foremost. Because the Force and the path you follow is a personal battle within one's self. The Force is a literal morality play. It's why Luke and Anakin are living out Hamlet.

I would also point out that the Jedi, Sith, and other Force users are representations of political movements and their shifting nature. There is a reason the Sith are so fash and run that government that Andor is dealing with, why the old Jedi Order was so Liberal, and why all the individual post-Vietnam Jedi range from hippies to the disenfranchised.

 

[Another_Fool]

Damn people in here hard as hell on this show. I think it's been great.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Damn people in here hard as hell on this show. I think it's been great.

That's what happen when you have a slow crawl of a show that has nothing to say.